Here we go loopty loo. Here we go loopty li.

[Raine]

Act 1, Scene 1
Act 1, Scene 2

Recap: 7 months post BD, 4 months separated. He has done a 180 on life:

• Left me pregnant with sons 2, 6, 8
• Abandoned kids: Spent an average of 12 hours per month with kids last 3 months. Can't handle periods greater than 2-3 hours with them.
• 3xOW, cycling between all three at the same time. All being used as F buddies. No remorse, no apologies when caught by others with OW. Hides and lies about all of them. Doesn't know I know about #2 or #3. He avoids OW#1 for long periods of time when caught or who knows why, but has cycled back to her three times.
• Dropped religion: Hasn't been to church since S. Very active before.
• Dropped friends: Rare contact with old friends. Has new friends.
• Avoids his family: Doesn't contact his family, and they rarely contact him. Beginning of our marriage H would say that his father was his BFF. Now H can't talk about him without tearing up or getting very angry.
• Will not talk to anyone about sitch. Tells friends/family he is great. Tells me he can't talk to anyone, that no one knows what's going on inside his head.
• Seems pretty happy the majority of the time. Looks like crap most of the time. Sounds completely out of it if kids call him vs him calling them. Goes through spurts of going out a lot, staying out late, to other periods of time always staying home watching TV for days on end.
• Stays connected to me through various means, rarely misses a day of some kind of contact. No R talks. No arguments. No questions. He mentioned D only once two months ago to me, but says D needs to happen to those who don't know me. Super nice to me always. Wants me to be involved when there with the kids. Talks about me, brags about me to others, refers to me as wife. Very insecure about me and how I am reacting to him. Worried he is bothering me and he says he'll leave me alone.
• Has not mentioned baby since BD

Questions:

• Since I keep reading in other sitches that we really don't know if it's MLC until the process is complete, what else could it be?
• What's the main differences between a WAS and MLC? Do we treat them the same?
• How do I balance giving space and being the lighthouse/friend? How can I be there for him as a friend, but make him realize I'm not going to be there so he can have his single life and family life? Basically what I am doing is letting him control the contact and I'll get back to him then or at some point. Do I cut this down even more when he knows I know he is doing things with OW?

[MrBond]

Can you recap what your ages are?

Your H seems to be in a bad MLC. IMHO you need to stop having contact with him and grow your life without him. Start making yourself strong and GAL. What have YOUR activities been? The list was purely focused on your H. What about you?

[Raine]

H is 36. Me 35. I work full time and have multiple clients contacting me for side work, but I've cut way back on that. I go out about 2 times per week, never ask H to watch kids. I leave all contact and relations with kids up to him. I spend a lot of time with the kids, playing games, talking, making videos, sports activities, etc. Out of the house with the kids for some time most nights. I'm six weeks away from due date, so sleep, hot baths, and massages are my favorite activities at this point. I do a lot of reading, mixed between MLC stuff and fun stuff. Attend church weekly with kids and go to church sponsored activities. Rarely watch TV or movies. Talk on the phone with friends/mom a lot. But really at this point in pregnancy after work, homework, dinner, time with the kids, all I want to do is go to sleep.

[kml]

Raine -
sorry you are going through this. Your H does sound like a MLC setup (turning 35, having an affair, wife gets pregnant, feels trapped and flees, acting like a teenager) - but - also wondering, as you look back, do you see any other explanations for his behavior?

- does he have substance abuse issues (or other addictions like compulsive gambling or porn) that appeared earlier?

- did he ever show signs of being love avoidant or commitmentphobic earlier in your relationship?

- did he experience a death of a friend, or go on medications that might have changed his personality?

I've just finished reading a book on commitment phobics called He's Scared She's Scared. My friend recommended it to me because of my post-divorce pattern of dating men who are seriously Love Avoidant. (Surprise, surprise - it's because I'm not currently anxious to get into a serious relationship again).

But I was kinda surprised to see some of my ex-husband in that book - I would never have pegged him as an avoidant, in fact he often wanted a little too much closeness for my liking - but he definitely had some of the characteristics.

Which brings me to your H - his method of abrupt exit reminds me of some of the stories in the book, so makes me wonder if he might fit some of the rest of the description - you might want to check it out.

Meanwhile - I don't know if you've seen an attorney yet, but if not, I highly recommend that you do. It doesn't mean you have to file for divorce (you've got enough on your plate right now anyway!) but you need to find out what steps to take to protect yourself financially from your H. Also, if you haven't run a credit check, do so - sometimes guys with this crazy behavior are hiding something, like huge credit card bills or the like.

This may be a temporary, severe depression/mlc crisis for your H - OR it may be the final unveiling of a character disorder that was present all the time. Take some time to think back and figure out which it is. Temporary MLC crises can be recovered from. Narcissistic or avoidant personality disorders - not so much.

And either way, you and your kids deserve much better than this. If he triesa to come back, MAKE HIM DO THE WORK ON HIMSELF before you let him back into the house.

[Raine]

No substance abuse problems. In fact one thing he seems to have a line with is alcohol. OW okay, drinking and drugs not. I would not be surprised about porn right now, but that was not something he did before, and not something I know if he is doing now.

He has been very committed to me before this. Very affectionate, caring, concerned and loving. He put me on a pedestal. People would remark that not only did he love me, but clearly really liked me and adored me. Other couples would comment they wish their relationship was like ours. He made a lot of sacrifices to make it possible for us to be married. We are coming up on 13 years of marriage.

The trigger is what I'm not sure about. We had a close nit group with two other couples who we did stuff with multiple times per week. Both of their marriages fell apart and D two years ago. I see MLC signs in one of the H and in the other W. The H in said case went extreme. Blowing over $100k in 18 months, alcoholic, drugs, women. We were very close to these other couples and i was the sounding board friend for both LBSs. Only other thing is my H father's health isn't too great, but nothing lasting, althought a few trips to hospital. H's father has suffered from depression for years and not worked for 20+ years due to depression/anxiety. Also my H was not happy in job for past few years but I pushed him into a new field last April. He is very happy in new job now, but was still depressed and unhappy, so his reasoning went to me.

I haven't seen an attorney yet, but done a lot of research. I have control of all money going in and out and have alerts on credit. H has been very good about money. Spending is not out of the ordinary and he tells me about stuff he is buying or anything I might question on CC. I don't ask or question him about spending. I felt that was too motherly. He doesn't even spend money on OW, like paying for lunches. I think he knows that is one thing I would seek legal action on immediately if he started spending, but I never said that to him.

I agree. I am not letting him back without lots of consistent postivie changes and actions. It's easier when I'm not around him.

[Takevowsserious]

R-

Have been reading your stuff for awhile, and it truly amazes me how strong you are. Pregnancy is still pretty fresh in my mind, and I can't imagine dealing with my H's MLC on top of it. It is so exhausting... Plus you are taking care of three kids and working! Amazing!

I found it interesting when you wrote about possible triggers for the crisis. It sounds like it wasn't just one thing, more like a perfect storm of factors. (Which is the same with my H). None of the things you listed really have anything to do with you. But I know you know that already

And the whole OW thing... It royally svcks. I always think - if H (real H!) could see himself, he would be mortified. There are so many different emotions with it. I guess I expect to have the typical anger, hurt, sadness, disappointed and disgust. But, part of me does feel bad for him. That he would cheapen himself like that makes me mad and embarrassed for him. That he would need to do something so drastic that could cost him everything he once held dear just to escape the pain he's feeling breaks my heart. It really does.

Your H can try to pretend there isn't a baby coming all he wants. Reality will hit him hard soon... That baby doesn't give a rat's a$$ about your H's crisis, it's coming into this world when he/she is ready! (Couldn't remember if you knew gender or not)

Hang in there. You seem like such a wonderful person, and I do feel bad that you are here. You most certainly deserve better.

Please take care of yourself. Like Snodderly always says, let him blow in the wind. Focus on you and your boys. And of course that precious little one who will be arriving soon

[Raine]

I completely get what you mean about if real H could see himself. My H was really upset by the affairs that happened with our friends, even when it was just a kiss. He didn't want to know anything about it because he felt obligated to tell the other spouse. So I did not get why not D me, and then carry on his player/bachelorhood when he is so morally opposed to cheating. We dropped friendship with both of these couples because everything with them was so crazy and dramatic and draining.

I think that's why it's easier if he is not around. I have this board I can vent to and get the thoughts I have about him out of my mind, and then carry on with life outside of it and not have to keep thinking about it. Once I write it out, I have an easier time not letting my mind idle back to it.

Boy

[JBolt]

I completely get what you mean about if real H could see himself. My H was really upset by the affairs that happened with our friends, even when it was just a kiss. He didn't want to know anything about it because he felt obligated to tell the other spouse.

That's funny because my W was the same way. I also have a big problem with infidelity, trust is paramount to me. There were these students I knew in grad school, the woman was married and was not subtle about her feeling for this other male student. It was pretty embarrassing to go out with them the way they behaved and knowing her husband was at home and likely didn't have a clue. Well, she divorced him and married her fellow student shortly after they both graduated and appear to have a pretty stable relationship. I don't think it was MLC or anything, she just fell in love with this other guy. The point being, my W hated both of them. She really didn't know them at all and had never really interacted with them, but based on what I told her through the years she thought it was horrible what they had done. I see them at least once a year and sometimes share work with the husband. But through the years, every time I mentioned one of them my wife's face would twist with disgust. I always agreed with her on this.

Fast forward to mid-Oct. 2012. My W has her online EA and the fantasy of always being in love with this tool she never so much as held hands with and hasn't seen in 25 years . I couldn't understand how she could make those two moral choices/judgments jive. How does one so insulted by adultery amongst people she doesn't even know turn around and commit adultery? It's f'd up.
J.

[Raine]

J, I read an article when I first found out about OW that really helped me. It's on Psychology Today and called "Once a Cheater, Always a Cheater... Maybe Not." You can Google it. It helped me realize how/why it could happen and made me stop blaming myself and comparing myself to the OW. It's a really great article analyzing the types of affairs, written by a psychologist who had an affair himself.

Comparisons between self and OP only add to more confusion, especially with MLC. It became clear to me that it was about the first willing person, and that person is going to have a lot of insecurities and low self respect, along with other issues to allow him/her be used that way. It helped to know that it had nothing to do with me. This quote from MWD has also helped me a lot too:

"I've met people whose spouses refused to have sex for years and although that made them miserable, they simply could not cheat. I've met other people who, when their relationships hit predictable bumps in the road, rather than work things out, they sought comfort in the arms of strangers. Unhappy marriages don't cause infidelity. Being unfaithful causes infidelity."

[MrBond]

With that being said, there are usually actions from the LBS that pushed the WAS away to a certain degree. Have you taken ownership and changed those things?