Ggrass, I have been divorced since end of August. Moved out 10/10. I continue trying to be dark, yet when I have to talk...due to kids, I try to stick to this list. I feel being vague is not a game, but the reality of not letting your spouse know every detail. If they wanted to be in your life, as you wish (romantically/monogamous)then they would know the day to day things. Hopefully going dark and not playing the friendship game will make them miss what you had when you got along. I am at a stage that I am going in circles trying to do the right thing. Holidays are upon us and my thread has gotten weird/confusing. Wonka, Thanks for all you have done with this list. I value your insight.
Me43/WAW43..M 4y..S1 11/S2 4..Bomb2/2014..Dfile 5/2014..Settlement signed 8/20/14..D final 8/29/14 I moved out 10/10/14..WAW got D she wanted. I wanted R. No waiting,just no boundaries in her way.
Since many posters have expressed the view that this thread be sticked in the Newcomers' section, would it be possible for this thread be moved and placed right under Sandi's Rules on a permanent basis? This way, newbies and posters will have this resource in place for quick and easy access anytime.
Thank you for your careful consideration of this request.
Since many posters have expressed the view that this thread be sticked in the Newcomers' section, would it be possible for this thread be moved and placed right under Sandi's Rules on a permanent basis? This way, newbies and posters will have this resource in place for quick and easy access anytime.
Thank you for your careful consideration of this request.
Regards, Wonka
Can I just support this request. this thread is one of the more referred to that i've seen round the site and it would be useful to have it readily accessible
thanks
Both mid 30s, 2 young kids BD 7sep14 XW moved on long ago, now living with OM1 D paperwork in progress
Came across this level-headed article recently in Redbook by a man who has been married to his wife for 12 years. A good read for newbies and other DBers to file away in the back of their minds.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ 12 Lessons Learned In 12 Years Of Marriage
We were married before I graduated college. Pregnant with our first child shortly after. I finished college. New baby. Two miscarriages. Four more children.When the youngest was born, we had five children under 8 years old. Owned four homes. Rented a house and an apartment somewhere in between. Five different jobs with four different companies. Lived in four cities. In many ways, life has been on fast-forward. We've been drinking from a fire hose. In the course of these 12 years, we've learned a great deal. About ourselves. About each other. About the importance of marriage. And why it's worth fighting for. We were young, in love and ready for marriage when we said yes in our early twenties. But that doesn't necessarily mean we were prepared.12 years later, here are 12 things that have been clarified for us in our marriage:
1. 50/50 expectations lead to disappointment. For a season, we viewed marriage like it was a game. A competition. If I do this, you should do that. Meet me in the middle here, do a little more there. If you do 20 things, I'll do 20. That sort of game. But the true work is done when one of you can't get to the middle. When it's up to the other to go the extra mile. Maybe that ratio is 90/10 for a season if a spouse is sick, stressed, even depressed. Don't view marriage as a scorecard, someone always loses that way.
2. Keep adventure alive. In my early days of dating Brooke, I pulled out all the stops. We went on long hikes, I made her candlelit dinners, I worked hard at the chase. When the years and responsibilities piled up, I let that fire die too many times. Fighting to keep adventure alive doesn't have to look like a trip to Paris; it could be a last-minute trip to a local hotel, a surprise baby sitter for the evening or even a simple handwritten note. Inject your marriage with adventure.
3. Kiss each other first. I'm imperfect at this, but I try to kiss Brooke first when I get home from work. Before I kiss our five kids. It's a small thing that points to a much bigger reality. For me to be a great dad, I have to be a great husband first. Otherwise, we'll become roommates who are collectively raising our kids.
4. Grit is often the best description of love. It was easy to love Brooke when we were newlyweds. Easy for her to love me during seasons of comfort. But it's much more difficult to fight for love when you lose a baby. Or have a huge financial setback. Or confess a really ugly secret about yourself. Fairy tales are great for movies, but real life is more often confusing, chaotic and messy. Dig in when it gets hard.
5. Real life happens in the mundane. Huge promotions, babies being born, buying the dream house. The peaks of marriage are great. However, most days are mundane. I've been guilty of missing the little moments while I work to make the big ones happen. I'm realizing that life happens in those little moments. I'm learning to love the journey every bit as much as the destination.
6. Proximity doesn't equal presence. Getting home from work early, getting a sitter for a date and even taking a vacation alone are all great things. But physically being close isn't the same as being close emotionally. For me, most of the time that looks like staring at my iPhone instead of looking my wife in the eye. Being more concerned with my Twitter or Instagram feed than I am about hearing my wife's heart. When you have the ability to be together physically, be there emotionally as well.
7. Comparison will kill your joy. In an age of edited facades of other people's lives on Facebook and other outlets, it's easy to feel like your marriage suucks. Like you're getting lapped by the Jones family. When I begin to compare our money, house, kids' performance and marriage to others through a distant lens, I'm the one that loses. It robs my joy. There will always be others with more; don't play that game.
8. You'll each have the opportunity to throw it away. We all know the marriages that end in pain instead of celebration. Divorce instead of dancing at the 50th anniversary party. Brooke and I are realizing that some days it's far easier to give up than keep fighting. But each day, we keep choosing each other. We continue to be honest about where we fail each other. Because it's worth it.
9. Take initiative for the benefit of the other. We talk often in our family about whether we're being givers or takers. Are we giving and serving? Or are we only taking and using? I'd argue that life is best lived when you're giving yourself away for the benefit of another.
10. Live in community. Marriage is hard and messy, but also beautiful and redeeming. Lived in isolation, you may be tempted to give up. But when surrounded with friends and family that know your strengths as well as your struggles, you realize you have support and encouragement.
11. Will you forgive me? Let's face it; in marriage, we fail each other more often than we'd like to admit. We tell a white lie, we forget a huge appointment, we get angry. There are a million other examples. Instead of shifting blame or dodging responsibility, marriages get stronger when you start to say "will you forgive me?" Even more than an "I'm sorry," this question leads to restoration and healing.
12. Love wins. This list could be a mile long. I didn't touch on things like honesty, making time for dates and speaking highly of your spouse. But all the lists in the world won't keep your marriage strong if it lacks love. In the end, love wins. It conquers all. It removes doubt. It pushes through fear. It invites deeper purpose. Love wins.
No need to bump anymore, Wonka; your wish has been granted.
-PM
M:12y - BD:12/11 - D:6/13 - 4Ds
"The ultimate measure of a man is not where he stands in moments of comfort and convenience, but where he stands at times of challenge and controversy." -MLK Jr.
Here are some more ideas on validation and de-escalating comments. This section is based on emotional aikido techniques. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
What makes you feel that way / say that? That’s a question / judgment? Where is this all going? What would you like me to do? Is there something else you’d like to tell me? What’s the worst that could happen? How much time do you have to talk about this? How do you mean? Where is all this coming from? Why would you say such a nice thing? What would you like to know? And what do you think is going to happen now? What do you suggest we do about it? Are you OK? You seem really upset / stressed out! Do you feel that anger / cynicism is the best response here? What did you hear me say? How long have you been feeling this way?
I hear what you’re saying. You sound really concerned about this! You seem really upset… This seems pretty important to you! OK, so that’s how you see things? I wasn’t sure… Really? OK I see, yes that must’ve left you feeling less than pleased! What happened? That’s terrible! I wish this topic was easier to talk about. I can see why you would say that. I don’t blame you! That can’t be easy to manage. I know exactly what you mean. Indeed! I’m really trying to understand what you mean here. Thank you.
So if I’ve understood correctly, you…? So you have the impression that…? Would I be right in saying that you think / feel…? Are you trying to tell me that…? I see, so it’s important for you that I understand…
I think I see where you’re coming from, go on… Help me understand that one. I think there’s something else you want to tell me… There’s gotta be a better way to find a solution! Tell me what you heard me say. Can you say that again please. Please, do elaborate. How about we talk about this over a beer/coffee!
