Is this the end...

[Hero18]

Yes, had a consult and am going to retain an atty.

My part of the cookie will most likely always be bigger even after she gets her pound of flesh in a D.
Naturally I want to minimize the damage and the old her would never be the vindictive type as she avoids conflict, but this new version of my W is a complete enigma to me. She has gotten so cold so fast, I have no idea what she is capable of. I am just shocked at the speed she with which she is trying to end the M and cut off all contact. It really is like an alien has taken over her body.

[burned]

How can you just move out and shut another person out of your life like that? But then out of the blue text and ask if I would like to have the dog for a few days and pretend like nothing is happening when she drops it off?

This must be in the WW playbook.

Back in August, W asked me to look after the dog for the weekend. No way to know for sure, but it makes sense in hindsight: then she didn't have to be back in town before the kennel closed, freeing her to visit OM on the way back from her conference. Plain as day now. But back then I thought, "Hey, here's an opportunity to show her I've changed!" Ha.

It really is like an alien has taken over her body.

People here say, "Don't believe anything she says." I take it a step further and say, "Believe the opposite of what she says, and if the opposite makes sense from the perspective of a selfish alien, then it's actually more likely to be true." Of course you can't say for sure, don't mind read. But learn to evaluate her behavior from a drastically different viewpoint, and test that against reality to see if it fits.

[EZdozit]

Hero,

My WAW has gone to great lengths to avoid having any FTF or phone interactions with me. Definitely a Mrs Jeckle/Hyde thing...and it’s been going on for several months.

Some weeks she appears to be the W I fell for.....and on a turn becomes vindictive, cold, and treats me with utter disrespect.

I don’t concern myself with it anymore...

[Hero18]

I have retained an attorney, which feels totally deflating, but if I am to potentially set her free, I guess it what is necessary.

My W wrote me back today saying that she does not feel comfortable coming to any agreement without her Atty present. She even went on to say that she hired her atty to make things easier for us.... really for us?
She also goes to say that if I wish to say anything to her in private that out of respect for me she would be willing to listen to me and hear me out but will not agree to terms.

My initial thought is just to have her atty contact mine with whatever terms she has in mind and go from there, but wanted to get the boards opinion about whether I should meet her face to face to discuss...well anything. Before when I thought there was a possibility of having a civil conversation and potentially coming to an agreement, my DB coach said I could take the opportunity to tell her that I do not wish to stand in the way of her happiness and will not try to prevent a D. I also mentioned that I am a recovering NG and have learned a lot and understand better now my contribution to adding stress to the M. My coach suggested that I could let her know what I have learned and maybe even apologize for making things difficult at times. Specifically, I mentioned that I lost my way a few years back and stopped taking care or/prioritizing my needs thus putting a lot of pressure on her. I also am guilty of things such as covert contracts and then acting in a passive aggressive manner when I was frustrated that I did not get what I did not ask her for.

I know it will not stop anything with the D, but do I bother telling her those things? Does it even matter? I read over and over again that WW do not want to hear any of this stuff not do their believe that we are capable of change, so part of me is telling me to use my knowledge to simply better myself and not enlighten her about how I feel. If she wants to know, she would need to ask, right? For the last 2 months, my W has shown no interest in talking to me or even contacting me outside of taking care of the dog or the next steps towards a D.

I can hear my DB Coach in my head asking the question, what does she expect you to do? And how can you show her that this is not the same old Hero18?

I guess what caught me off guard was her offer to listen to me. Is this one of those cheerless tunnels or something I should be taking advantage of?

I appreciate your help and advice.

[Ready2Change]

My W wrote me back today saying that she does not feel comfortable coming to any agreement without her Atty present.

H:"W, I am sorry you chose this path. I believe having two lawyers argue for us will completely drain our family assets. I understand you being uncomfortable talking to just me. I am willing to negotiate with you using a mediator. Would you be willing to find 2 or 3 mediators that look good to you and I will pick one? We can have our lawyers review the documents before we come to any formal agreement. Thank you for considering this alternative"

[Hero18]

I can sense that I am in some sort of funk and cannot turn my mind off. I am struggling again with trusting myself that I am doing the right thing here.

I have been reading old texts and emails to help me figure out what I did wrong and where I can do a 180 and something finally clicked.

When I got stressed or upset, I had a tendency to shut other people out and keep to myself until I could process everything. This was really hard on wife and after seeing it multiple times in past texts, I can see it upset her more than I originally thought. I did a poor job of apologizing for this...

I can also see where I contributed to making her feel smothered or that I was being controlling. Again it probably comes from the NGS and being new to the area and not having any guy friends. I never let her go do stuff on her own, I always felt left out and alone and I can see now that I acted in a passive aggressive manner that made her feel bad about taking care of her social needs.

I just feel like I have learned so much and can recognize where I went wrong and if she only knew that I knew that. I know I should be focusing on me and I know that having a logical argument about where I am now versus 2+ months ago with someone in a emotional state is a bad idea, but I still struggle with wanting to try. It is programmed into us since childhood that we should always try, yet DBing is counter intuitive.

Sorry for the rambling, I just want to fix this or at least get another chance to start over.

Send me those 2x4s, I need them

[Ready2Change]

All normal. Feel anything you need to. Just don't do it in front of W.

Remember that everything will be OK. You are doing the needed work.

Time is your friend. Use it wisely.

[Hero18]

R2C, I am and have been using the time to better myself. I am doing my best to GAL and have a pretty full plate at the moment with the hobbies that I have re-started after many years. The next step is really making my own network of friends here in a new place, especially guy friends.

I know that I am supposed to detach and not worry about what my W is thinking or doing and for the most part I do not even think about it. It is just that I feel like the last few weeks/months between DBing and seeing a IC I have had some sort of epiphany and see myself in a new way. I am really disgusted with the way I treated myself in the past and as result treated my wife.

Maybe because a D is on my doorstep or maybe it is because our Anniversary is only 2 weeks away, I just feel like I should at least own up to who I was and maybe even apologize for my behavior. Is the reason why I should not do that because of the possibility that I will not be able to do it with some expectation that she reacts positively to it, thus setting me back personally and even the chance of a R?

Again I did a poor job of conveying my feelings, saying I am sorry, and validating her feelings in the M, would it not be a 180 to do that now? Or is it simply a day late and a dollar short at this point?

Would a letter be a better way to avoid falling into the trap of coming across as needy or weak during a face to face meeting? My W used to remark that I never write her anymore and that was something that she cherished in the early years of our R.

My DB coach made some mention that by potentially showing her that I am someone can that learn and grow it may spark her to be more interested in learning about the new me. How do I do that without contact? We do not have any mutual friends in the area and I am not on social media?

[burned]

Maybe because a D is on my doorstep or maybe it is because our Anniversary is only 2 weeks away, I just feel like I should at least own up to who I was and maybe even apologize for my behavior. Is the reason why I should not do that because of the possibility that I will not be able to do it with some expectation that she reacts positively to it, thus setting me back personally and even the chance of a R?

Use your judgment, but this will probably be interpreted as pressure. Your sitch is somewhat similar to mine and I can tell you that my W can detect pressure even in the things I DON'T do. When they want out, they want out.

Again I did a poor job of conveying my feelings, saying I am sorry, and validating her feelings in the M, would it not be a 180 to do that now? Or is it simply a day late and a dollar short at this point?

Yup. The game has changed. Consider the fact that you didn't marry a monster. Think about the last time you did something you felt was absolutely necessary but you were horrified by how it would affect someone you cared about. Maybe that has never happened. OK, put yourself in her shoes. Pursuit, to me, is more than just "take me back please." It also sends the message, "Please see things my way, and stop trying to cope with your own pain by doing the things you're doing." It's invalidating. She feels that she HAS to do what she's doing to protect her own image of herself. Anything you do to remind her of her guilt will backfire. Maybe a pet analogy: you're moving to an apartment that doesn't allow dogs. You have to bring the dog to the shelter because nobody else can take her. What do you say to the dog? How do you feel? Do you give her lots of treats so that she feels happy...as you're leaving her behind? How do you feel when the dog tries to follow you out the door? What about when she jumps up on the cage and cries as you're leaving? Maybe that's how the WAS feels. Must be awful. Yet they feel they have to do it.

Would a letter be a better way to avoid falling into the trap of coming across as needy or weak during a face to face meeting? My W used to remark that I never write her anymore and that was something that she cherished in the early years of our R.

Again, the game has changed. It won't help. It WILL come across as needy, if not weak. Just about everything you do will come across as needy. Because she will think, "He sent me a letter because HE wants to feel a certain way, or he wants ME to feel a certain way, and I don't feel that way (right now)."

My DB coach made some mention that by potentially showing her that I am someone can that learn and grow it may spark her to be more interested in learning about the new me. How do I do that without contact? We do not have any mutual friends in the area and I am not on social media?

The perennial question. I don't know the answer to that. I'm told that if you really change she will "sense" it, maybe in your tone of voice next time you talk, or your body language and facial expression that sends the message that you're fine, when she expects you to not be fine.

[Hero18]

Thanks for the response, Burned.

Any one else have any advice on how to handle the no contact situation? Just continue to give it more time, even if it means up to and after a D? Yes, I know that GAL is for me and not for her, but how else can she see that I am capable of change as opposed to telling her about it?

Also, I am still stuck on the text I received yesterday where my W offers to talk to me and listen to what I have to say. This is the first time since she moved out that she has even remotely mentioning talk to me and listening to me. It was simply a fluke that I was home when she came to pick up the dog a few weeks again and I allowed her to cry on my shoulder. All other times when picking up or dropping off the dog, I have not been home. Is this simply a form of temperature check or is that an opportunity that I should not let pass?