I meant after work Steve. I’d ask 3 or 4 times a day.
I’m sorry I’m frustrating to you guys. I really am.
The little ins and outs are hard for me to grasp. I read your advice, I take it to heart. I try to make it make sense to me so I can implement it. You tell me to read the book, I do. Please read Steve’s sitch. Starts on page 163.
His immediate changes: Complimenting her on her looks Bringing her her morning coffee Helping more around house Being more involved with children Being lighthearted
Ok check this out. W and I are about at week 3 in Steve’s sitch. Page 168
“Steve continued his efforts to be more INVOLVED more thoughtful and more loving. She was no longer avoiding him. They were often in the SAME ROOM TOGETHER and although their conversation was generally superficial or child related, he saw this as an improvement. Because he took to heart the idea that “small changes matter” he felt encouraged by this development.
Guys this could be my sitch almost to a tee
The only GAL he did was to go on a walk or something when he was angry
You guys would tell Steve he is spending too much time with her right? Also the small changes don’t matter right? They don’t mean anything
W is no longer avoiding me. Much more conversational, albeit superficial We are often in the same room
If you read in week 4 of Steve’s sitch you see things are going well enough he’s tempted to test the waters which backfires. This is where I am. I’ve been tempted. But per your guys advice I haven’t.
All of that is fine and dandy, none of us would tell you not to implement changes like this. However, what we are telling you is that you can do those things AND GAL!! I just gave information to Destroyd in his thread about self-differentiation in marriage. There is room in a relationship to be a partner in that relationship AND be an individual. In fact, the survival of the relationship depends on you also being an individual.
SO yes, make small changes. But also go out and GAL. Meet new friends (male only). Reconnect with old friends. Join a men's group. Join a bowling league. But get out there and do some things outside of the house. And when you are home you can make those small changes.
I think the problem with you is that you get fixated on the ACTUAL action. "Steve brought her morning coffee, so should I!" In my sitch, my W would have not appreciated that since she hates coffee and doesn't drink it. So use your logic and say "ok, in my sitch, when she is working outside in the garden (this is hypothetical), I should grab her a bottle of water from the fridge and take it out to her." Small. Thoughtful. And if done right it doesn't have to be pressure and pursuit.
Again, I think you read into things what you want to. You are fixated on what the book says on page 163, but ignore the other 300 pages of the book! It has been almost 1 1/2 since I read DR, but between it and this forum I got completely different things out of it than you are getting. You keep fixating out what you can do to "fix" things. We call that "the illusion of action". DBing is about NOT doing things. Because most of what LBSs think they should do will backfire on them.
We also have a saying "do what works, don't do what doesn't work". If bringing your W her morning coffee works, then do it. However, having financial discussions with her doesn't, so don't! Sorting wedding pictures doesn't, so don't! "I am busy working on the bankruptcy, can we sort wedding pictures some other time?" Or maybe I misread you and sorting wedding pictures with her worked. You weren't really clear on that.
We tell you what we think. You get to decide whether to do it or something completely different. But I can tell you to stop looking for the magic bullet, because it doesn't exist. If she stays it will be because she decided too, not because you bring her morning coffee.
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
Ozman. Im going to ask you a few questions, despite all the guilt we live with for the things we didn't do according to our WAW'S. Even though its never just one thing, or one reasin why they justify in leaving us after the fact that the issues were commited and never resolved. In you're belief system. Do you think its justified to leave a M, if the division of labor wasn't right? I kmow what the WAW is getting at with this, they are trying to say they feel resentful that they seemed to do more thsn you, and consider themselves less selfish.
Oz, imagine you are trying to get a plant to grow. If you look at it every single minute of every day and you see zero progress right? So then you think you're doing something wrong. So you add more water, or add more fertilizer, or you Google it and see something about adding french fries to the dirt so you try that. But you just become more and more frustrated because you're still watching it and it's not growing. So you keep changing stuff and trying new things (add coffee grounds! Maybe Dr Pepper!) and eventually... you smother it and it dies.
Now Oz, why did you kill it? Because you lacked the most important thing of all- PATIENCE. People told you over and over again it takes MONTHS to see that plant progress at all. They told you that you can't sit there and watch it every minute of every day, you have to LEAVE IT ALONE sometimes. You have to go off and do other things and give it a chance to grow on it's own. You keep doing that and leaving it alone and just give it a little water now and then and in a few months you suddenly notice is has grown a lot and is starting to bloom.
Quit trying the "trick of the day" to get your W back. Quit putting her under a microscope. Quit examining her every second of every day for an improvement. BE PATIENT. Practice DB'ing, and give it time to work.
You want answers and all that is offered is GUIDANCE, if there was a sure fire way to do this we would say do these 7 steps and you will get your spouse back 100% .Life isn’t like that , everyone is different and everyone’s sitches are different and in different stages .
For me about 90% helped me immensely, I had to choose the bits that I was sure were not right .
For example Sandls 37 rules , 30 worked for me 7 didn’t. ) was actually less than 7 but I’m keeping it simple .
Work on being the man only a fool would leave. R2C has posted some EXCELLENT advice on this site go through it and use the ones that work for you , after you have got your set of sandis rules buttoned down solid .
Cool , calm , collected and CONFIDENT ( the no. 1 attractive quality for men )
IF you were a woman, I would tell you to get yourself looking smoking hot. Do up your hair, makeup, good smelling perfume, a sexy dress, high heels. Be happy while doing this. (These things are attractive to men. We are simple creatures) Then leave the house. Tell H "I am going out". Then go to a coffee shop and relax. Or a movie. Be gone for several hours.
Do you understand why I would recommend this?
As a man, you need to do things that are attractive to women. Dropping beta behavior and taking on Alpha male traits is key.
Yes help around the house, but you have to do things that you want to do.
I was intimate with my lady, then within a half hour I was driving off to the gun range. I could tell she didn't want me to go, but I have to be me and do things that make me who I am.
"What is best for my kids is best for me" Amor Fati Link to quotes: https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2879712
Ihclacs. I think you can leave a M. But you had better have tried DAMN hard to fix it first. Which includes communication
Steve I don’t know what to think of the wedding pictures thing. I was trying to get office in order to start bankruptcy process. Lots of boxes and shelves that needed sorted. I opened a box of her things. Went downstairs and asked her to sort them (politely). She came upstairs sorted them then started sorting more. She came across wedding album, guest list etc. she went through them for a min quietly. She then handed my half of them and told me to sort out the bad ones. She did her half. She showed me a few. She said “wow look at this it’s the only good one of our cake”
She resents her whole life. She has said this to me
So apparently she’s been having lunch with a coworker a lot and he’s easy to talk to
Last edited by Cadet; 07/09/1907:22 PM. Reason: combine posts
Ozman, ouch. Up to now you've emphasized how you do everything together and you each have no time to leave the home and self-differentiate. She seems to be finding it! I hope that encourages you to, too.
