My journey here...

[MrCAS]

Where to begin my journey into Divorce Busting...

I am a WAS. This is not something I am proud of by any means. It was looking at life in a very skewed manner that lead me to make decisions I did. Through some heavy reading and work, I have come to many conclusions about myself. The ones that I found to be less than acceptable are things that I am working on right now.

So, how did I end up here? A little history to give some insight...

My W and I got married in June 2001. It was somewhat of a whirlwind romance having lived together for eight months before we got married. We had had an online relationship romantically for six months before she moved to New York. We had known each other for approximately 3 years prior to pursuing a romantic relationship. Approximately 5 years after we were married she expressed a desire to move back to Minnesota. So I looked into a business opportunity in Minnesota to continue my career and she could be back home near her parents and daughter.

Shortly after looking into the opportunity, I had a heart attack. I ended up having a double bypass. Unfortunately, I had no health insurance in place and this created a huge debt load. I had lost my health insurance because my wife has gotten fired from her job. The lack of insurance and the huge debt was the beginning of many building resentments on my part.

Shortly before my heart attack I had a huge falling out with my business partner of fifteen years. He was angry that I had chosen to move to Minnesota over staying in New York and continuing the business with him. To make a long story short he locked me out of the business and put a very meager offer on the table and I was basically told to take it or leave it. This was another one of the resentments that had started to build up.

After moving to Minnesota we ended up living with my in-laws for a period of six months. The business opportunity had fallen through for a myriad of reasons. I ended up having to accept a position with a company in my field. While the job paid well and the benefits were excellent the job itself was not that great. I also had a 63 mile one way commute to the job. The job was another building resentment.

In April 2008 I was released from my employment. I was told I was being fired. I applied for unemployment and was denied. I appealed the decision and was awarded unemployment insurance plus back pay. To have to listen to your former employer tell you what a POS you were after two years of nothing but accolades was very difficult for me to deal with. This was yet another cause of resentment.

I was unable to find a job and was unemployed from April 2008 until April 2009 when I accepted a job outside my field. In January 2009 I had left the marital home and went down to my sister's house in South Carolina. I returned to the marital home in late March without first informing my wife that I was coming home. This was a huge source of anger for her. What I did not realize at that time, but suspected, was that she was having an extramarital affair.

The affair was very short-lived. She told me that her intention was to move out on June 1st. I told her that that was fine if she felt that that was what she really needed to do. I told her that June 1st was appropriate since that was the day that my first wife had left me. I told her that if she needed help to pack and move that I was willing to help her. For some reason this seemed to spark something inside her and she decided to stay. While I was greatly relieved that she decided to stay I have to say that in retrospect that we did absolutely nothing to truly reconcile our differences.

In July 2011I accepted a position working in upstate New York. I was not thrilled about having to leave the state to work but I really needed the job. We were in constant communication and that although it was not lovey-dovey it was very good nonetheless. January 2012 proved not to be a good start of the year as my job ended in New York and I had to return to Minnesota.

I started to remodel my studio area in the house on my return to the marital home. This caused some resentment on her part as she was very concerned about the finances. I started a new job in May 2012 and this seemed to relieve her fears as far as money went. I had a job, although not great paying, that I liked and was performing well at.

In August 2012 we had a huge blowup over a particular lifestyle. I will not delve into the details. However this proved to be a huge cause of resentments and anger on both our sides. It seemed as though we were both determined to be right. I told her that if she refused to stop pursuing her interest that maybe she should just get out. She told me that maybe it was me that should get out. Then the big fight started.

In October 2012 the situation had reached an intolerable level on both our sides. I was bound and determined that I was going to crush her and make her pay for being the bitch that I thought that she was being. I had threatened her with financial ruin, exposing her to her family on her choices, and just generally being a really rotten SOB. I had reached my limit and frankly so did she.

I accepted a job in South Carolina and I moved out of the marital home the day after Christmas. My mother-in-law told me, to my face, that it was awfully difficult to work on a marriage when you're over 1000 miles away. My stepdaughter expressed her deep sorrow that I was leaving. My father-in-law had tears in his eyes as he put his hand on my shoulder and was so choked up that he couldn't even say goodbye.

So for the first month that I was down here I was bound and determined that I was just going to have a big old party. I was going to live my life on my terms and she could just be damned. That was until I got a call from my stepdaughter. That call really jarred something loose in my brain but, more importantly, something in my heart.

In the meantime, my wife sent me a box of stuff that was supposedly just laying around the house. Inside was a copy of Stephen Covey's book "7 habits of highly effective people" and Don't sweat the small stuff. I gave the Covey book a cursory go through and then realized that it contained a lot more information that started to make sense to my feeble little man brain. So I decided to give the book a much more thorough reading. That was when I discovered that maybe I didn't want to get divorced after all. I discovered that maybe the marriage really was worth saving.

So I found the divorce busting website and bought both of the divorce busting and divorce remedy books. I didn't realize that I had already started putting many of the divorce busting techniques into practice on my own. Many of the things that they teach and divorce busting our techniques that you can carry on into your regular life and your interactions with people in your life. I can honestly say that in three short months I am not the man that I used to be.

It was a hard realization when I started to become aware just how far down I had sunk into the depths of my anger. I began to realize just how my anger and resentments had clouded my thinking. I was becoming acutely aware of how my anger was affecting my life and all the relationships I had. What I needed to do was to figure out how to deal with that anger. So I began to research online on anger management and techniques for dealing with it.

Anger is a very easy place for me to live. It is an excellent mask for all the pain and resentments I had. Anger just numbed me to the reality of it all and as long as I stayed angry, I didn't have to deal with anything else. Once I started dealing with the anger, I started to have to deal with the pain and resentments. Looking at life in different perspective really helped me down a different path.

So after starting divorce busting, I began to put some of the techniques I have learned into practice. It was in the area of doing 180s that I really focused on. During our previous separation I constantly emailed, telephoned my wife, and basically became a general nuisance. This time around I have limited my contact to her on a very need to basis. I have not pleaded with her, begged her, or threatened her with anything. I have also started to send her money, via our credit union joint account, to pay on her credit card debt. The credit card debt was something that we had fought about before I left and I told her, in no uncertain terms, that I was not going to give her one penny towards that.

After she got the first payment she didn't ask me why I sent it but she did thank me. I decided that I needed to send money on this account because it was the right thing to do. I know that it could be construed as some sort of bribery but I wanted her to know that I was working very hard to change my line of thinking.

This past week I put together a list of all the BS that I used to yell at her when we are having our arguments. I took that list and made a graphic of it. As a side note, I am sign and graphic designer by trade. I put it altogether and I saved it as a JPEG so that she could see it. It shows "The List", as she called it, torn into many pieces. She thought that it was a really good thing to do and very much appreciated the effort it took to make it. In the accompanying email, I had let her know that "The List" was now a thing of my past and will never be brought up again. I keep a copy of it at home and one at work to remind of the promise I have made.

So today was the first time that I called her on the phone since January. I told her that I was sorry for spending the last three or four years trampling on her heart, her love, and our marriage. I told her that I wanted to come home. She told me that she knows I want to come home. She told me that she was sorry but she couldn't do that. She told me that she was scared. I told her that I was scared, too. She told me that she is aware of many of the changes I have made in my life and she liked it. She thought all I am doing is a good thing.

She did not shut the door completely on the future. I feel that her telling me that she was scared was the reason why she did not want me to come home. I cannot blame her for having this fear. While her answers we're not exactly what I was hoping for they were pretty much what I had expected. I did come out of the conversation feeling a little heartened. It has only been four months and I really didn't expect a miracle.

I do get a lot of mixed signals from her. She has not filed for the D like she said she was going to do. She has told me that she will keep me on her health insurance. She has not unfriended me off of FB although I do wonder if that is so she can keep tabs on what I have going. She was going to let the house go into foreclosure but has reversed her position on that with no explanation. There are some other things that she has done and things that she has said to others that kind of defy logic but we are dealing with an emotionally charged situation so I guess that could be expected. I am choosing to look at these things in a positive light. Not the rose colored blinder view, either.

So I will continue to work my 180's and keep doing what I need to do to improve myself. I have been working on GAL. I have been playing with my fun car. I have been doing some extra-curricular work to make some extra cash. I have joined some interest groups. I am learning to look at life from a different perspective. I have started to fine tune my BS meter so that it now registers on me as well.

I am just as straight forward with myself as i have been when commenting on other posts. I expect no pity and have a low tolerance for BS. I refuse to label myself a victim any longer. I am in the situation I am in today because of decisions I made yesterday.

Thanks for listening.

[Cadet]

Not sure that you are a WAS, in that your wife was the one having an affair.

You may have been going through some transitions, and certainly we all have issues that we need to work on.

It is also not unusual for a crisis in one spouse to start a crisis in the other one.

As you seem to be finding - ACTIONS speak louder than WORDS.

Keep working on yourself.

This stuff is not easy!

Keep posting.

[MrCAS]

The affair ended just before she decided not to leave. The whole thing never did get properly resolved... just sort of swept under the rug so to speak.

I may have misinterpreted the term WAS. I was the one that did walk away.

A close friend keeps telling me to remember... "Your actions are speaking so loudly that I can't hear what you are saying".

So, the 180's are actions on my part to change past behavior. The changes I am working on have been painful but a necessary part of personal growth.

I believe that biggest part of beginning my recovery was taking responsibility for what I had done and stopped feeling and playing the part of a victim. Nothing like several good blows with that 2x4 to my head to snap me out of that funk I was floating in for so long.

No, this stuff is not easy. However, something worth keeping is worth the effort.

[uRworthy]

Hi M, I'm a New Yorker so no bs from me.

I've been around here a long time under a different name.

My rep is that I am kinda gentle, but, I am not above a 2x4 if warranted.

I dont really like the acronyms LBS, WAS and all that. I know it serves a purpose in explaining things in a quick way. But I never did like to put labels on stuff. That's just me.

Cuz it really doesnt matter who walked away and who didnt right now.

I am a little confused about some things. You moved out. I get that. I am assuming you did because you wanted out of the marriage. But, did you and your w have a discussion.about it? I guess my confusion lies in why you would go back home without telling her.

If you could just flesh out your story a bit, it would help us be able to help you.

Good job on working on 180's, but, you need to really dig deeper to find out why you were the way you were, ya know?

[sandi2]

In August 2012 we had a huge blowup over a particular lifestyle. I will not delve into the details. However this proved to be a huge cause of resentments and anger on both our sides. It seemed as though we were both determined to be right. I told her that if she refused to stop pursuing her interest that maybe she should just get out. She told me that maybe it was me that should get out. Then the big fight started.

Maybe you need to explain what the lifestyle was. Was it something like an open M or swingers?

[MrCAS]

Hi M, I'm a New Yorker so no bs from me.

Yes, growing up in WNY taught me to be to the point and not beat around the bush, too.

My rep is that I am kinda gentle, but, I am not above a 2x4 if warranted.

"Amen" to that. I am right there with you.

I dont really like the acronyms LBS, WAS and all that. I know it serves a purpose in explaining things in a quick way. But I never did like to put labels on stuff. That's just me.

I concur. It just makes it easier sometimes to get to the point quicker.


I went back home the first time because I got two job offers. I needed the job. I was tired of not working. It gave me way too much free time to fall into the pity pit. I went home without telling her because I was acting like a putz.

I moved out the second time because I felt things were not going to get any better because we had both painted ourselves into corners we could not get out of. Neither one of us was willing to back off.

Yes, we discussed a lot of things but it always came back to finger pointing, mostly on my part in retrospect.

Why was I the way I was? Because I was one PO'd dude. I had a heap of stuff piled on me in a very short period of time and I did not deal with it well. The resentments and the pain built up in layers upon layers. It fermented into an anger that came out in inappropriate ways. My personality started to change. I was not always this way.

I used the anger to mask and cover up the feelings I had instead of dealing with the real root of it all. Anger, for me, was a much easier thing to live with than the pain.

I thought by leaving MN and my W I was going to leave all of my problems and issues behind me. Instead, I spent a month being the most miserable I had ever been in my life. My mind hurt. My heart hurt. Nothing was making any sense at all.

I prayed to Jesus one night to give me some clarity to make sense of all of this turmoil. Man, did I get some clarity. It came in droves. Let me tell you, the clarity I got is not for pussies. I came to realize I was one colossal dick.

My W and MN were not the problem. I was the problem. My issues came from me. The issues that came from other people came because they were reacting to me. They treated me like I treated them.

In the last couple of months, since I have started to look at things with a different set of eyes and a new purpose, I have noticed that people are nicer. I notice people aren't afraid to approach me at work. People seem to smile more at me in public. Maybe I have a new aura. I don't know.

All I can say is that none of this would have happened if I had stayed. I would have floundered in the muck and mire of my own doing... or pooing if you will.

Life is not so black and white for me as it used to be. My W is starting to notice. My family sees it. Four short months ago, I would have never asked for my W' forgiveness or apologized for anything. Why? Because it wasn't my fault. Nope. I was perfect. Yeah. A perfect AH.

I may never get back with my W but I know that all of this is happening for a reason. I do not believe in coincidences.

I now know I am still in love with my W. I know she still does it for me. I know now that she has fears and I don't blame her. We both had our share in the breakdown of of our marriage but I am now accepting my role in it.

[MrCAS]

Okay... a little more info on the call last Saturday...

W's XH called me Friday night. Told me she was bringing "friend" to see his band. He was less than pleased. W's D was even less impressed. She and I talked and she said a one word description was that "friend" was crusty. I have to admit I was amused by that. Not too impressed with new "friend" thing but there is nothing I can do about that.

So, I had intended to call her Saturday. Kind of wish I had talked to her before she unveiled the new friend but it is what it is. So our conversation briefly to be expedient...


So, I apologized to her for trampling on her heart and our marriage. She said she appreciated that. She told me that she had noticed that I was making a lot of improvements based on what she saw on FB and talking with people. I told her that I wanted to come home. She said she knew I did but she couldn't do that. I told her I understood and left it at that.

During the rest of the call she kept saying "I can't do it" at least five of six times until the last one when she added I can't do it because I am scared." I told her I was scared, too. Neither of us asked each other to expound on what we meant.

I told her that I would talk to her soon and she said "Okay".

So... It has been a week and I have not talked to her or sent an email. My question is...

Should I sent her a message and tell her that I understand that she has fears and that her feelings are justified (to validate them that they are indeed very real to her.. which is a 180 for me) and that if she wants to discuss them that I will listen? That would be all I would say. Worded differently?

Should I just keep silent? I want to let her know I can appreciate how she feels but I don't want to be too pressing, either.

Some objective advice would be helpful.

[MrCAS]

Note to Sandi2... it is a Dominant/submissive lifestyle. No swinging... no free love...

When we decided to do this, our R really wasn't ready for something like this. I could explain it more but I really don't want people thinking I am from another world...

[AnotherStander]

Should I sent her a message and tell her that I understand that she has fears and that her feelings are justified (to validate them that they are indeed very real to her.. which is a 180 for me) and that if she wants to discuss them that I will listen? That would be all I would say. Worded differently?

Validation needs to happen at the time the emotions are being expressed, not days later. Our emotions change from day-to-day and even hour-to-hour, so she may feel something quite different now. When she told you she was scared, you shouldn't have replied by saying that you were too (this actually invalidates emotions because basically you're saying 'I know exactly how you feel' while she is thinking you know NOTHING about how she feels). You should instead have validated right then and there. I don't think it was a backslide or anything, but next time hopefully this will help you remember to validate.

[MrCAS]

Okay... I am filing that in my mental filing cabinet.

Do you think it would be construed as pursuing if i dropped her a note on that? Not asking for you to read her mind.