Hi everyone I Need some advice. How many of you have went through a custody trial? I believe that is where we are headed. After our mediation he went very irrational. Texted he would be going for full custody ( his concept of full custody is I would not see my kids). Yes I know that's not true. Said I couldn't take the kids to church on his day. Commented on the "welfare" check he gives me every month etc. lots of other things. I filed for temporary sole custody. We can't agree on anything and he appears to be irrational on all subjects. Don't want to go into a lot of detail.
He has started putting the kids in the middle and every day I find out more stuff he has told our 7 year old. She should not be I. The middle and is already seeing a counselor. The school recommended this. I'm going to continue after school is out. He does not believe the children suffer in a divorce. His words "when they see me in a happy relationship it will make them happy. I need to stop reading the negative aspects of divorce." Financially he can't seem to produce all of his documents. It appears to me my accountant and attorney there is a ton of money not accounted for unless all of us cannot add. Lol! He continues to hold up all discovery by not producing documents and what he gives us seems suspect. We just had to subpoena one of his main clients to see what he has really been paid. Any good ways to find hidden assets. He never allowed me on the accounts or houses. I know it does not matter in a divorce but difficult since he is not opening marital funds for attorney's fees and I believe trying to "starve" me out. Any more suggestions on finding hidden assets. On our farm I am having to place the majority of the animals. Keep in mind these are rescues. He has now told the volunteers he can get them new horses. Errr we are in the middle of a divorce and I thought you were broke. Also he now has cameras out there so he can always watch what is going on and told my daughter he watches on the phone and it will even track him but he says it's ok I'm a friend. Paranoid. He is ex military. Could he be having flashbacks. He was pretty high up and did a lot of secret stuff from what I understand. So many more completely off the wall characteristics. I have never been close to anyone going through a divorce. Is some of this off the wall. Can he be in the throes of deep MLC?. I truly do not know this person. I am honestly becoming scared. When they are in the fog do they even know what they are doing. Another example I always took the kids to church. I begged him to come. He went 3x in 8 years. Last week he told our daughter I took his church from him and he took all 3 kids to a different church. Sorry to judge but I don't know how he can go to church with what he's doing in all aspects of his life right now. We were looking at a 3rd home beach house last July and now we can't even look at each other. This is not how I imagined our miracle sons first year of life would be. I feel as if I'm being attacked on all fronts by him. I can't imagine that I had 3 children with this man. I have no idea how I'm supposed to ever co parent with this person. Can't he please go away to planet MLC. Another crazy thing he asked for the divorce. I did not want it at first but now I just want to be done and get what should fairly be mine andEVERY proposal of his is ludicrous. Why can't he just settle and go away. Lots of rambling from me tonight. Would love any insight and direction anyone may have.
W-38 H-42 T-11 M-8 C-6,2,6 months BD-Oct 1 2013 DFiled-Jan 6 2014 Went Dark - April 4, 2014
From what I see, your H is losing control so he's taking all kinds of potshots at you in order to beat down your confidence and trying to assert control now that the D train is moving forward. When the LBS files or asserts their parental rights by asking for custody, the WAS gets all hot and bothered when THEY were the ones that wanted out of the M in the first place! Too funny!!
If I were you, I'd want to work with a L to get all of H's financials, access to accounts, and his paychecks so an equitable formula can be caculated for child support & any maintenance. Do you have a Controlled Separation order in place? Or some type of arrangement in place now? Many of the WAses don't like to be parted with their money as they want to spend on themselves and the OW/OM to continue with their fantastyland.
As for the horses, I'd have the L take a look at it as to where the funds came from to purchase these animals as they don't come cheap at all!
Regarding Church, what does it matter if H takes the children to a different one? It is HIS choice. Let him walk on his own path in that direction.
Mic, wow. You haven't given a lot of detail here, but what really struck me about the last few posts are what your H AND YOU are doing to your kids.
PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE do whatever you can possibly do to come together for your children. If you want to spend all your assets fighting over money issues, go for it. If you want to hate each other and bicker over churches outside of earshot of your kids, feel free. But PLEASE stop this custody battle. Do you really want to put your kids (let alone yourself) through a parenting investigation?
Here is something that worked for me and my crazy H, who decided a few months ago to make this the most difficult D ever. He insisted on getting a PRE (same kind of things as a CFI, where they do an evaluation and make a custody recommendation). We started that process. It is awful on everyone, and IMO it will end up further damaging your R with your H, and going forward, who will that hurt? YOUR KIDS. So, a few weeks into the PRE process (well before it ever involved our kids), I asked H if he would go see a counselor with me to discuss kid issues and see if we could resolve this on our own. (We happened to find a person who is an expert on kid/divorce issues and a therapist - your L may have a suggestion.) He really couldn't say no, could he? I mean, if he said no, is he really looking out for the best interests of the kids, or is he putting his own crap ahead of the children? (And if he is, does he really deserve more or even equal parenting time than the parent who is looking out for the kids and putting them first?)
We have gone to see her ONE time, and then talked for several hours afterward, and we came to an agreement on parenting time. Not all the details, but the number of overnights with each parent, and an agreement to continue seeing this counselor to help us with the details of the plan and ongoing co-parenting issues. Was it hard? Yeah. My H was still doing his manipulative crap, rewriting history, etc. But (1) we were able to clear up some miscommunications and that calmed my H a little; and (2) with a neutral party (who is looking out for the kids and has no allegiance to either of us) present, he was forced (as was I!) to consider the kids first, not himself.
Yes, your H is being crazy. He is being an a-hole. He is being selfish. All that stuff is true. But since YOU are the sane parent, you cannot just sit back and allow the kids to be hurt and blame your H. You need to take any and all steps you can to make this better for your kids. Even if that means being cordial or cooperative with your H. I am not saying you just lay down and play doormat; I am saying you do the best you can to come to a reasonable agreement with him.
And please remember, your kids don't feel about him the way you do. They LOVE him. He is their Daddy. They love him, and they need him. So unless he is abusing them or there is some other real danger to them, they need to (and I imagine want to) spend time with him. Please don't try to take him away from them.
Forget about you and your feelings and how he feels about you. You need to play on his desire to do what is best for the kids - whether his desire is real or not. (I am still not sure whether my H's is real (or if he is even capable), but since he has to keep up as though it is real, it works either way.)
Can you talk to your L and see if she knows of someone who might be able to referee for you guys? What if you said to H, "H, I know our M is over, and there may be hard feelings on either side. But I think we agree that the most important thing here is our children. Fighting over these custody arrangements is only hurting them. Would you be willing to try to talk this out, with a counselor present to help us with communication and maybe give us some information re: under what circumstances kids do best? I am willing to commit to setting aside my feelings about you and the M and to communicate with you in a cordial and cooperative manner, so we can ensure that we are doing the best we can for our kids in this difficult situation. Are you willing to do the same?"
If he is not - well, that speaks volumes, doesn't it. Get it in writing.
Worst case, you have examples of why he is not putting the kids first; and at least you tried and did the best you could for your kiddos. Best case, he steps up to the plate for the kids.
P.S. My H said the same thing - the kids will be happier (not just happy, but happIER) because they will see that I am happy. Holy narcissist.
me: 44 XH: 42 M 11 years D10 and S8 Bomb drop 9/27/13 D final 7/1/14
Hi Melissa Tried all of that first. Asked him about family counseling to help the kids work through the divorce. His response. You are the unstable one. They are happy and will have no issues. Tried to agree again. We have been doing where he has we'd, thur and every other weekend. I was able to take the kids to church on my weekend. I go in Saturday. Please understand if he wants to take the kids to church I am ALL for it. He just never went anywhere to church ever. We started this when my son was 3 months old. Separated when son was 6 months old. Against the advice of everyone I let him keep our son overnight so all 3 children would be together. Still nursing through all of this. I asked if I could come nurse once a day on his days. I nursed my oldest to a year and the second to 14 months. Want to nurse him that long. I had all my children natural no drugs. Believe me I try to look out for their best interest. Anyway after mediation he did not like the way it looked. I had 4 pages of stuff to get written I. The parenting agreement going out 18 years. Since he did not get what he wanted he revoked my privilege to nurse my son on his days. Christmas is very important to him. I have other holy days I celebrate. I offered him Christmas Day and Christmas Eve every year but stated I would like thanksgiving. He said no I want thanksgiving also. I said well we will just follow the courts every other holiday plan. He said no I will not do that either. This is all in mediation. I have no idea how to have a rational discussion with him. My default position is I say if we can't agree it will be taken out of our hands and the courts will decide. He got so irrational in mediation that the social worker made him leave and was worried for my safety. The courts are the ones ordering the parenting investigation. I'm not sure what else I can do. He is refusing to do counseling. Refused to go back to mediation. Before I went forward with my affidavit my attorney called his to see if we could try to negotiate one more time. He stated he would give me a day I already had if I promised to live in the city we live in and have our kids go to school there for the next 18 years. He is a head political figure in our small city and I feel the fallout may be very harmful to the kids and it does not allow me to ever move forward in my life. I want my children to see their dad. I talk him up and want him to have a relationship with him but I feel I can't negotiate when there is no cooperation. Am I missing something? Wonka Financially there is a lot of money at stake or there was this year. His income increased 5x what he has ever made in the last year and a half. Truly he doesn't want to pay any support child and it is like pulling teeth to get him to pay anything. We are in the process of making child support and maintenance court ordered. It appears he has recklessly spend multiple thousands after our financial restraining order is in place. I do have two amazing attornys ya though.
W-38 H-42 T-11 M-8 C-6,2,6 months BD-Oct 1 2013 DFiled-Jan 6 2014 Went Dark - April 4, 2014
Asked him about family counseling to help the kids work through the divorce. His response. You are the unstable one. They are happy and will have no issues.
You cannot force H to do something he doesn't want to do. Instead, you can take the kids for family counseling with you. I hope you've asked around for recommendations on a good family counselor or child psychologist with experience in divorce.
For many WASes, they need to demonize you in order to justify their warped reasons for leaving the M. Why else would they leave a great spouse and family?! Right. They are very self-absorbed at this stage and try to miminmize or discount (and deflect) the damage on their kids by saying they'll be happier! Their logic is out of whack for sure.
We have been doing where he has we'd, thur and every other weekend.
Is this schedule still going on? How's that working out for everyone so far?
Anyway after mediation he did not like the way it looked. I had 4 pages of stuff to get written I. The parenting agreement going out 18 years.
Can you please expand on this a bit more so we can understand this better? It is hard for me and others to comment here without knowing the details of your proposed parenting schedule.
Since he did not get what he wanted he revoked my privilege to nurse my son on his days.
This is H being a bully right there. It needs to stop. I'd have my L on H's ass about this right away! He cannot prevent your son's access to natural foods from the mother.
I have no idea how to have a rational discussion with him.
You can't or don't at all. The WASes are too angry and controlling that they are not able to see clearly that the best path forward is mutual cooperation for their kid's best interests. They're all caught up in negative emotions that it spills over into other areas. Which is all the more important to hand over all those types of discussions to your L as they are the neutral party in negotiations with H and will protect you financially, emotionally, and mentally. I'd stop having any of these discussions with H and simply turn them over to your L.
He got so irrational in mediation that the social worker made him leave and was worried for my safety.
This is a bit concerning to read here. H is cearly feeling the loss of control and he's reacting in a negative fashion to re-assert himself. The only problem with this approach is he's shooting himself in the foot.
He is refusing to do counseling.
This is typical response from many WASes. You cannot control this part. Let it go.
Refused to go back to mediation.
His choice.
He is a head political figure in our small city and I feel the fallout may be very harmful to the kids and it does not allow me to ever move forward in my life. I want my children to see their dad. I talk him up and want him to have a relationship with him but I feel I can't negotiate when there is no cooperation. Am I missing something?
You cannot always protect your family from H's poor choices. Life will take care of the consequence, not you. You cannot show or teach him the consequences of his choices. Life will teach him all of that. Let the chips fall where they may and let H see/experience them for himself.
You can try your darnest to facilitate the R between their children and their Dad, but it is not your job. It is on H to determine this. It [censored]...I nkow. The kids will figure out which one of the parents is more reliable than the other. Trust the process and rely on your L to guide you through this legal game of Twister.
We are in the process of making child support and maintenance court ordered. It appears he has recklessly spend multiple thousands after our financial restraining order is in place.
Do you have some legal conditions in place that are enforceable if H breaks the order? In other words, is there some "teeth" in the enforcement aspect?
Mic, do you communicate with your H at all? If you do, please make sure it is all in writing. For example, if the nursing conversation was a verbal one, I would send an email requesting that you be allowed to nurse your son. It has to be completely devoid of any emotion, accusation, etc. Stick only to that one item. If he says "no," print it out and add it to your pile for the CFI. I would do the same (one at a time, though) with the request to try to work out an agreement between the two of you with the help of a counselor. Make sure you are always focused on (and mention) the kids, and that you want to make the kids a priority. (i.e., we need to set aside our own personal stuff for the benefit of the kids.) Either he will start to behave better or he will hang himself. But you make sure you are doing everything you can.
This whole thing is so frustrating - I know. My H is crazy but I don't think even as crazy as yours. Still, I can empathize to some extent. He thought he would be so happy and he is SO sure that his life will be so wonderful and terrific if he could just get away from me . . . so why the hell is he tormenting me like this? Why doesn't he just get it done and go live his wonderful life? Ugh. Your H seems to be doing the same thing.
As far as church, or whatever else he does on his parenting time, as long as it is not dangerous, STFU about it.
I am disturbed by this whole thing, as I have read and heard in multiple places that kids under age 2 should not be having overnights with a noncustodial parent - they need to have one home with frequent visits from the other parent.
So you are currently on a 4/3 parenting plan, right? He gets them 3 nights a week, you get them 4. What is the problem with that? Who wants it changed? Why? Is it worth a battle for you? Why is he asking for sole custody? Why are you asking for sole custody? Sole custody is pretty sh!tty for kids - they need both of you in their lives. Why did the court order the investigation? If it is because you cannot agree on parenting time, then you can stop that investigation by coming to an agreement.
I am glad you have great attorneys. I am just sorry you will have to waste so much money using them because your H is such a pain in the ass. I am right there with you - just watching tens of thousands of dollars go down the drain. It's nauseating.
By the way, it sounds like you had a crappy mediator. Does your H have an attorney? If so, I am disappointed in his attorney as well. Why have neither of these two people told your H how it is? He can complain all he wants and kick and scream, but he is going to pay child support. It is what it is! Why has nobody set him straight on this stuff?
me: 44 XH: 42 M 11 years D10 and S8 Bomb drop 9/27/13 D final 7/1/14
Mic, I'm so sorry this has taken an ugly turn and you're hurting. Wonka makes some great points. You can't make him do anything, really.
You take care of you and the kids and let your L take care of you (with your oversight and agreement of course). It will be interesting to find out more about your H as this moves forward.
Maintain strong boundaries.
What are you doing for you?
Me 57/H 58 M36 S 2.5yrs R 12/13
Let me give up the need to know why things happen as they do. I will never know and constant wondering is constant suffering. Caroline Myss
Thanks all. I will respond to all of these. For me I meet friends for lunch. I taught in my daughters class. Going on a field trip with one I've been out looking at houses. Working on moving forward. Did a cancer walk with my kids this weekend. Put my story in perspective;) We have a settlement conference tomorrow. I will know more then. I guess I need to call my DB coach. I wasn't sure since I went dark if it was still worth talking to someone but I should finish out my sessions. This made me laugh today. I pulled up to our farm to feed the animals. He was there working with the garage open. He immediately runs over and shuts it so I couldn't see inside. I already know what's inside- artwork, statues etc from someone who is "broke" and wants me to pay him child support. I'm sure he was not expecting me to just start laughing. Will update more. It saddens me to read the other threads but makes me feel good to know others are out there feeling the same. My H is deep in mid life crisis land apparently.
W-38 H-42 T-11 M-8 C-6,2,6 months BD-Oct 1 2013 DFiled-Jan 6 2014 Went Dark - April 4, 2014
