My husband of 19 years (partner of 23) left me just before Christmas to go and be with a woman 10 years younger that he met at work. We're both 45. (MLC alert!)
Backstory, he's known her maybe 18 months or so. Has worked closely with her brother for a few years. She was temping in the same workplace and they became friends. A year ago they added each other on SM and WhatsApp and began messaging. OW came on my radar about the same time but it was March/April before I realised something was getting out of hand. Accused him of an affair twice and got laughed at and he convinced me the flirty messages were just banter and I didn't understand the context. I kept an eye but didn't realise how bad it was getting. I know my DH can't understand hints or nuances in messages so really didn't see the OW blatantly flirting and chasing him. Until it was too late. He is (was) always very loyal, loving, trustworthy and honest and everyone is shocked that he could actually do this.
Ironically he says my upset at what he thought then was just an innocent friendship and my arguing over it actually drove him to spend more time together with her. I basically pushed him into her arms.
She left his workplace in July and by this point they had strong feelings and had admitted it to each other. He then told me he'd fallen out of love with me because of all the arguing over the 'friendship' (passing blame!) and I spent 5 months trying desperately to fix it. OW then returns at Christmas, he takes the first opportunity to go and see her, behind my back. I throw him out and he's in a new relationship the very next day.
I've got two heartbroken kids aged 11 and 13 who found out on Christmas Eve dad was leaving for someone else. He spent a week or so living in hotels and is now back home whilst we sort out the finances for him to move out. We don't own our home and he'll be moving into a room in a shared house.
He tells me he still loves and cares for me deeply but he can't stay as he's 'in love' with the OW. That she makes him feel happy and relaxed and builds his confidence up. He's only spent a few afternoons/evenings with her in cafes/pubs so it's natural he's going to feel happy and relaxed. As for confidence building, she is ego-stroking by telling him he's completely perfect and everything he does is right.
There's also issues from the past - 4 years ago I was overwhelmed, having gone back to full time work and had to navigate a career change, school runs and an unreliable car. I didn't know then I also have inattentive ADHD which hugely affects my focus, organisation and time management. My anxiety over my work and parenting failures led me to lose weight, improve my appearance and go out drinking with younger colleagues as an escape. DH didn't step up in the way I needed him to do (he can't drive, I had all the mental load, budgeting etc.) so I told him I was thinking about leaving. He then had a full on breakdown. We got back on track and I thought we were stronger than ever but he held resentment and never quite felt the same about me. He only told me this after he'd already fallen out of love with me. I then also admitted to having a crush on my boss back at that time (not reciprocated and nothing happened). He says that this crush from 4 years ago was what killed our marriage - not his infidelity, strong feelings/love for someone else or falling out of love with me - deflection again.
I've trying to navigate round having him at home, he's being super affectionate, can't do enough for me, keeps staring at me and begging for cuddles. But still wants to leave as it's not fair to stay when he's in love with someone else and he feels too much has been said and done between us. Plus too many people know he cheated and he thinks marriages can't survive affairs. He said he has no option but to carry on down this path. Even used the phrase 'I've made my bed and I have to lie in it'. His actions and that conversation lead me to think he has serious doubts but not enough to change his mind.
OW is very childlike, immature, needy, anxious, needs constant reassurance. DH lacks empathy and his love language is acts of services (making snacks and drinks etc.), he's not good at talking or being a sounding board. OW has not had a relationship longer than 2 years and still lives at home at 35. I see many red flags and none of our friends and family think it will work.
My friends tell me to distance myself, put up barriers, stop letting him take advantage as he's getting the best of both worlds, being home with me and affectionate but having a long distance relationship (till summer when OW is back permanently). I did manage to do this when he was acting horribly but now he's being so nice and I'm really depressed so I've lost the strength to say no.
Welcome to the boards. I am sorry you find yourself in this situation. I am pasting Cadet’s welcome post below for your reference. There are many links to a trove of useful information. Do have a read of it.
Have you read Divorce Remedy by MWD? If not, do get a copy and read it cover to cover, a couple of times. Also keep DR, this site, and the DB techniques and strategies to yourself. Do not share them with H. (Some wise words from Wonka.)
Originally Posted by Wonka
Get DR/DB book. Keep this to yourself. DO NOT share this book or this site at all with your spouse. It is your playbook and not to be shared with the "opposing" team.
It is important to clear the search/browsing history from your computer on a daily basis to prevent the possibility for your WAS to stumble on the DB site and discover your posts here on DB. Erasing the search history will protect your posts and you as well.
We have seen too many Marriages blow up in pieces after the WAS discovers the DB site or DR book. Why is that? It is because the WAS thinks, erroneously I might add, that you are "manipulating" them back into the M.
Keep the DR book and DB site very close to your vest.
I look forward to conversing with you.
DnJ
- - - -
Welcome to the board.
Sorry you are here but you will meet some wonderful people here and get some great advice.
The first thing you should do is be sure to read the Divorce Remedy (DR) book by Michele Weiner-Davis. The following link is the first chapter:
Once your registration to the site has been completed you can post and start a thread. Please have only one thread active at a time (per forum); it keeps your situation organized and is easier for those following along and posting to you. There are a few forums which help categorize posters’ situations.
When your thread reaches 100 posts, it will be time for you to start a new thread. It is a good idea to link your old thread to your new one, and even link the new one back to the previous one. That makes it easier for the folks following your story. (There is a help thread on linking in the sticky threads at the top section of the forum’s display.) A moderator will “close” your full thread which prevents further posting to it. It is still available to read.
Post in small frequent replies on your thread. Especially on this Newcomers forum, where the posting activity can be very active, and your posts can quickly fall to the bottom of the page or even several pages down.
Post on other people’s thread to give support.
Keep journaling and asking questions - people will come! Most important - POST!
Get out and Get a Life (GAL).
DETACH.
Believe none of what he or she says and half of what he/she does.
Have NO EXPECTATIONS.
Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.
Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.
Here are a few links to threads that will help you immensely:
Thank you, I've just been working through this. I've ordered a copy of the DB book and I'm going to print out Sandi's rules and keep them handy.
The MLC information posted on another recent thread was eye-opening. DH has a lot of childhood and teen trauma that he's refused to seek help for and although I know it has a huge effect on him, I'd never thought that it could be rearing it's head and triggering the MLC. DH and the OW bonded over shared childhood trauma (both lost a parent young) and also had discussed delinquent instances, stemming from a realisation that their work colleagues had no idea of the sort of people they had been when younger and had roundly criticised others for things DH and the OW had both done as kids.
I'm currently reading the thread on pursuit and distance which is resonating so much! It explains all the blowing hot and cold and now that I've pulled back from him, he cannot do enough for me. Even buying me gifts when he's supposed to be saving up to move out and showering me with affection, staring at me like he can't get enough of me. Complaining that I'm messaging another man I've met, even though he is in a long distance relationship with OW.
MLC is a horrible thing. Long ago trauma(s) were inflicted upon them when they were young and immature by someone is a position of authority. As a youngster, they did not have the coping skills or mechanism to yet handle such things. So, they bury the experience, the shame, the guilt, the blame. These poor young souls are egocentric; the world revolves around them. As such, they take on the “fault” of what happened. The authority figure, the very person who is to protect the youngster, usually forces and gaslights them into a narrative. This sowed the seeds for a crisis.
The youngster buries this. And things buried alive come back to haunt. Realize the MLCer does not know what is going on.
About 18-24 months before bomb drop, something starts unravelling within them. Unrecognized pains and feelings start building. They do not understand why they feel like they do. Those long ago demons are wakened.
Some folks do experience their demons stirring around their quarter life. And unfortunately, most can and do re-bury them. However, at midlife, the pressures of mortality, marriage, life, kids, etc, those demons no longer will remain silent.
This emotional bubbling away is hidden from us, hidden from the world. The MLCer really has no reference to what they are feeling. These feelings are ceaseless. And it consumes them. The pain from long ago.
Our once loving spouse looks around trying desperately to find reason or answers. And desperate people do desperate things. They see us, they see their kids, their family, their life. Any resentments are seen as reason. They incorrectly blame current life and people for how they feel. And they explode! Bomb drop.
BD is the LBS’s first unmistakable sign of something having gone really off the rails. Our spouse changes and becomes the opposite of who they once were. Desperate to run from their unrelenting torment and pain. And they do run.
Originally Posted by MistyDD
He is (was) always very loyal, loving, trustworthy and honest and everyone is shocked that he could actually do this.
This replay, this attempt at reliving, recapturing their lost youth, is where the LBS see the start. Yet, the crisis started long ago - 18 to 24 months, or many many years ago depending on how you see things.
The MLCer needs to, is emotionally driven to, their path. They have to. They need to go back in time and grow up from when they were emotionally stunted. And as strange as it sounds, they do go back in time. Emotionally, the MLCer is that hurt lost youngster. A time when we were not around, they were not married, and they had no kids. This is “when” they live in. And why their empathy disappears.
The MLCer’s path is emotionally driven, and depression is ever constant. Their emotions are cranked to eleven! They simply have no bandwidth for the LBS, kids, pets, house, responsibilities, and so on. They are a rebellious teenager. A teenager with a huge bank account!
Remember, they run. This replay stage is them trying all kinds of things to both quash their unending pains and torment, and to feel something in their dark depression. They will spend, some in excess. As a LBS do keep an eye on the finances. And be prepared to protect yourself, if the need arises.
Most MLCers will partake in all manner of behaviours. Spending, drinking, drugs, fast cars, fast partners, affairs, illicit and illegal activities. A horrible teenager, on a scale of 1-10, the MLCer is a 15.
Depending on the person, and no two crisis are alike, they are as individual as the person themselves. Depending on the person, they will live in two (or more) worlds for a time. Hanging on their present life and their shinny new life. Very confusing.
Originally Posted by MistyDD
He tells me he still loves and cares for me deeply but he can't stay as he's 'in love' with the OW.
Ah, confusion. This is one of the hallmarks of a crisis. The MLCer exhibits confusion as they mask their desperate depression. They truly are tortured.
Originally Posted by MistyDD
I've got two heartbroken kids aged 11 and 13 who found out on Christmas Eve dad was leaving for someone else. He spent a week or so living in hotels and is now back home whilst we sort out the finances for him to move out. We don't own our home and he'll be moving into a room in a shared house.
(((Hugs)))
Yes, the kids are collateral damage in the blast of bomb drop.
Most MLCers become terrible parents. My W threw away her kids! Imagine that. She tossed them out like they were simply old clothes to discard. And she was an awesome Mom!
Have faith my dear, it only takes one strong and stable parent to raise kids. You can, you will, do fine. They will be fine.
Affairs are incredible commonplace. For these lost folks, the AP is a band-aid. A mere symptom of the deep torment. And the AP is a troubled person too, for who would attract to such a hot mess.
Most affair down. It’s a phycological pressure to place the affair partner as their long ago authority figure (usually a parent) so they can rebel properly and grow up from them. Of course, they don’t see it that way. To them it’s true love. Soulmates. All stemming from the unconditional love they were denied as a child.
Like I said, MLC is horrible!
You, the LBS, focus on you. GAL. Live and love your life.
A crisis has to run its course. Once entered it cannot stopped. It can be delayed, and the second start will be much worse than before.
Nothing you do matters, and everything you do does.
H’s path is about him. You didn’t break him, therefore you cannot fix him.
Any attempt to fix, manipulate, alter, speed up, etc, H’s path - at best is neutral, usually prolongs things, and at worst will stall things.
A crisis is very slow to progress. Years. And some MLCers never exit.
Originally Posted by MistyDD
My friends tell me to distance myself, put up barriers, stop letting him take advantage as he's getting the best of both worlds, being home with me and affectionate but having a long distance relationship (till summer when OW is back permanently). I did manage to do this when he was acting horribly but now he's being so nice and I'm really depressed so I've lost the strength to say no.
The basic tenet is focus on you and the kids. Find you. That gal before H. This is a long journey and if you are doing it for H, you won’t make it.
Cake eating, allowing H the best of both worlds, is not advised. More treat him like a roommate. Be kind and cordial. Be compassionate.
H’s journey is emotionally driven. He needs to feel the loss of you. And with all his torment swirling around, his running, any helpful feelings of shame, regret, loss, etc, are swimming upstream and quickly extinguished with his current behaviour.
Let go. Give him to the Man upstairs.
H has to burn through his feelings and then hopefully look around and realize his fate.
Time and space. These are your best allies in this. Give H plenty of both. Let him feel the weight of his life. Let him live it.
Become the best version of yourself. A woman only a fool would leave. Focus and invest into your life. No matter what happens, that will pay huge dividends.
This is a marathon, not a sprint.
You’ve got the gift of time. Use it well.
D
Feelings are fleeting. Be better, not bitter. Love the person, forgive the sin.
This is so helpful, thank you so much for the response. It's illuminating.
You are right about the AP. I didn't think he'd affaired down as she's younger, slimmer and more attractive. However she is childlike, immature and emotionally stunted and both lost a parent young so have similar trauma. He does say she is not as smart as me too.
I'm confused about the affection though, it seems that we are in the distancer-pursuit game with him in the role of pursuit at the minute. I'm not instigating affection in any way and rarely respond to it but I don't stop him (he was stroking my head/neck and gazing at me for half an hour this morning). I'm not sure how to handle that best. He can't even sit on the sofa with out having some part of him touching me, even if it's his head on a cushion by my feet.
Secondly, what's the advice on seeing other people? I know it's all about focusing on myself and the children but another man has come on my radar and I'd curious to get to know him a bit more. Is that not a good idea? My friends have very mixed views.
what's the advice on seeing other people? I know it's all about focusing on myself and the children but another man has come on my radar and I'd curious to get to know him a bit more. Is that not a good idea?
Martial problems never get better by bringing a third (of more) person into the mix. If you are looking to save the marriage, reconcile, it’s best not to go down that road.
You have to grieve the loss of the old marriage and relationship as well. And that takes time.
Most emotional decisions lead to regret. Look to your logic and reason.
Divorce Busting is pretty counterintuitive and it takes a bit for one to find their way.
D
Feelings are fleeting. Be better, not bitter. Love the person, forgive the sin.
I thought that might be the case. I just don't like the idea that if he's moved on so quickly and the MLC could take years, then it's a long time for me to be lonely hoping he'll come back.
H is due to be moving out in a month or so. I could cut the new guy off but then I'm scared that maybe he's been sent to me for a reason. Obviously there's the option to keep the new guy secret too whilst I see how it pans out.
H won't see the OW again till May as she's abroad. I'm not sure if he's clinging on to stay at home as long as possible whilst she isn't here.
I thought that might be the case. I just don't like the idea that if he's moved on so quickly and the MLC could take years, then it's a long time for me to be lonely hoping he'll come back.
Yep. And that’s why you keep moving forward. Focusing on your life with your kids.
Most of us define ourselves by our marriage. Our relationship. Yet, the biggest and best relationship you have is with yourself. (Re)Discover you.
The LBS has to save themselves first. We must put on our oxygen mask first.
You will find the advice is truly for you. DB truly will save you. And in saving you, gives you your best chance at saving your marriage.
A word on lonely.
Being with someone is just that - with someone. A person in a room full of people can feel utterly alone. A person living by themselves can feel fulfilled and flourish.
Loneliness and being alone (or by self) are not the same thing.
Yes, MLC takes years. That’s a long time. GAL. Get a life. Absolutely necessary. Your life. Not dependent upon H or someone else. Find you. Live and love your life.
Do things. Run, walk, redecorate, rebuild, garden, vacation, etc. Pick up those hobbies you likely set aside during marriage and kids. Learn new skills. Take music lessons. Learn an instruments. Or play the one you know.
I truly mean you have the gift of time. Use it wisely.
Originally Posted by MistyDD
H is due to be moving out in a month or so. I could cut the new guy off but then I'm scared that maybe he's been sent to me for a reason. Obviously there's the option to keep the new guy secret too whilst I see how it pans out.
Secrets won’t become you. Live in the light.
It obvious H is a mess. Do not get drawn into his mess. Let go. Let him move out.
Doing nothing is doing something. Embrace limbo. Embracing, choosing, gives you the power. You choose limbo only on the romantic facet of your life.
You can only control three things in this world. Your thoughts, your actions, and your reactions. And with what you control (do/think) you affect/influence all other aspects of your life.
Originally Posted by MistyDD
H won't see the OW again till May as she's abroad. I'm not sure if he's clinging on to stay at home as long as possible whilst she isn't here.
Likely. People often don’t let go of their current branch before they have a really good hold onto the next. And he is confused, living in two worlds.
Originally Posted by MistyDD
It's all so confusing.
Oh yes. It takes quite a while to sort out.
D
Feelings are fleeting. Be better, not bitter. Love the person, forgive the sin.
Hello Neffer. I am not wanting to highjack this post but was wondering if you could look at my thread and give any advise. my husband has been home 4 months now but i would like any advise on creating a connection and attraction. i know he is in a messed up spot and am doing my best with patents right now. ( I fail at that sometimes). But I also don't want to become so 180'd that he feels he doesn't have a place in my life. Thank you for your time. And am so happy you feel open enough to share your story.
