The bra and panties. Hm, you have to look at it with total objectivity. You haven't had sex in over 3 years.
1. She is buying them to entice you.
2. She is buying them to entice an OM.
3. She is buying them to look at herself in the mirror.
Only she knows for sure. I wouldn't dwell on this ans it will only make you crazy. Take a deep breath and focus.
I like the card, notes, and flowers but I must caution you to not go overboard with this stuff. Or you will come across like a desperate puppy trying to buy her affection through the standard fare.
Why I say this is you cannot discount that at some point Mrs. Choc might start to turn angry at your sudden newfound attentions and say to herself:
"Oh, so, NOW he notices me? Now he wants me and will fight for me when it's almost too late? When he gets a hint that he might lose me?"
Again, deep breath, measured love deposits. An alpha comes on steady and strong, not all jumpy and panting and impatient, kwis?
-Stigmata-
The difference between a warrior and an ordinary man is the warrior views everything as a challenge; the ordinary man views everything as either a blessing or a curse.
-Yaqui shaman Don Juan-
...and that holds 2x true for nice guy wussies, DJ
As long as the flowers, etc. are ALONG WITH a concerted effort to work out the "kinks" so to speak in your M, you are going in the right direction. As long as the affection and loving attention are along w/ knowing that you guys need to address and work on what has happened to your M/R over the years and work together on it, you're going in the right direction
Oh and the bras & panties could have been for her and only her to feel sexier, etc.
Me: 38 H: 35 S4, S5, S10 Bomb 01/07 Wanted D - nothing would change his mind Numerous A's prior to D bomb; EA prior/during D bomb Piecing 04/07 Deployed for a year 05/07 Still Piecing 2010 M 11 yrs 05/10
Loud and clear, Stig, as that is EXACTLY what I DON'T want to do, and is also what I've done before.
Measured. Got it.
Someone also said to me this week (and I'm sorry I keep forgetting who said what) that has been at the top of my mind the past 48 hours:
"Actions, not words."
I am a man to whom words come easy. I write well, but it's a gift, and so it doesn't mean much. Doesn't take much effort, and CERTAINLY doesn't take my commitment or consistency or stick-to-it-iveness.
My wife needs to see actions from me, not just words this time. And I need to lovingly convey to her that I need the same.
At some point (doesn't have to be right now) I'm going to need some additional help from you on this whole subject of how to respond to OM's responses. My W is a valued prize, and up until today she has probably been giving him nothing but "buying signs"; I am NOT anticipating that he will go away easily, as he's been smelling the blood in the water.
And this time you both need to remember to stick to it even when things tend to settle down a bit and don't get back in your old rut. I know I have to watch this at all times. It's that ol' effort thing and that's exactly what got us all to where we are or were at in allowing our R/M's to just grow stagnant.
Me: 38 H: 35 S4, S5, S10 Bomb 01/07 Wanted D - nothing would change his mind Numerous A's prior to D bomb; EA prior/during D bomb Piecing 04/07 Deployed for a year 05/07 Still Piecing 2010 M 11 yrs 05/10
Yes, and LFL is a nice perspective directly from an F.
There is another line taken from The Italian Job I like to remember. Said by one of the heisters to another about partners in crime.
I generally trust everyone. What I don't trust, however, is the devil inside.
-Stigmata-
The difference between a warrior and an ordinary man is the warrior views everything as a challenge; the ordinary man views everything as either a blessing or a curse.
-Yaqui shaman Don Juan-
...and that holds 2x true for nice guy wussies, DJ
Since Stig brought up the anger issue, let me just tell you outright. She IS GOING TO GET MAD.
Get used to the idea. She is going to be hurt over things going this far before you came after her. DO NOT let her anger deter you from the goal. You chicken out, she loses respect.
At the same time, the basic rules apply. No grabby/needy/desperate behavior.
-NOPkins-
I will ferret out an affair at any opportunity.
-An affair is the embodiment of entitlement, fueled by resentment and lack of respect. -An infidel will remain unreachable so long as their sense of entitlement exceeds their ability to reason.
I also like the stopping by the gym thing. Personally I don’t see the OM as much of a threat, though he could be if you let him. He works at the gym, with a bunch of other guys who will know what is going on. I doubt that they will encourage him to pursue a mother and break up a family. But without any action from you, they will brand you a “loser” and support the OM on rescuing your W.
There might be a way for you to take control of this situation without falling into an argument over whether there is really an affair going on or not (which she has already denied). Maybe one way would be for you to hang out at the gym, get to know the other guys personally, introduce your kids, then invite them all over to dinner, including the OM. I think that would be extremely intimidating to him. You can also let it be known that you know, but you just act like you don’t, KWIM. That way your W does not have to lose face by admitting to an EA, at such a delicate in your M. I think you need to be careful in balancing just how hard you push things right now.
Think of it this way, if you were the OM and were invited to dinner, with the ball in your court, how would you react? I would not want to be in that position. Should the OM up the ante with your W, make more assertive passes at her, tell his friend how he is fighting to win her over and break up the family? I think the peer pressure from the other employees at the gym can be used to your advantage, but behind the scene.
After all, your W does work there. You don’t want to get her fired. That won’t help her feel good about you. You don’t necessarily want the OM to get fired either because then he could really justify taking your W from you. You have the upper hand here, play it shrewdly.
Your W is on the fence just as you are. If she came around and pursued you, you would jump right off that fence and side with her. I think she will do the same, but she first needs her emotions to come around. That will take a little longer.
Schnarch mentioned your type of sitch as a potentially dangerous one, in which both people wait for the other to go first, and over time, the lack of assertiveness and the growing apathy destroys the marriage. IMO, everything you do from here on out needs to be leading.
I like your suggestion. In talking to my H about such issues, he very wisely said, "If someone can't me a friend to us and our M, then they shouldn't be a friend to either of us."
NOP
Avoidance is bad, confrontation is good. I agree. Indeed, avoidance is toxic, smelly,, gross, incredibly unattractive, self-defeating, and so on.
But, timing is everything. There is NO REASON for Mrs. Choc to try to work through the issue with Choc until she is invested in the M.
