So I'm ready to do what it takes to enforce my boundaries, for my own sanity and peace of mind if nothing else. I started down this path because these conversations with WAW are driving me crazy. One minute she's almost ready to try again and the next she thinks it's a choice between a relationship and being fulfilled in her career (she's overwhelming herself with work & grad program), all the while ignoring the fact that she had PA and it is still EA.
The A aside, her inability to balance ambition with her emotional life is unhealthy and already affected our R once. She snapped out of it before, which is what makes me hopeful she'll snap out of it again. But I can't be in a R with someone who will put M on line every time she wants to further her career. So this is where I put my foot down - she needs to recognize her problems and deal with them (she has started), and she needs to end it completely with OM. I guess the steps she's made are positive, but since her swinging back and forth is affecting me so much, I'm going to detach.
So, I need to regain my GALing, but I'm curious to know what your firm boundaries were and what you did to "shine a path" toward your M.
- W must agree to 100% no-contact and full transparency plan before I will agree to MC, engage in R talk, or engage her in any way other than the day-to-day business of running our HH and attending to our children;
- W cannot disrespect me by texting, e-mailing or phoning OM from inside of our home, or in front of me or our kids when we're out and about;
- I will absolutely no longer pay for (enable) the things that W was using to carry on her affair: cellphone, tummy tuck payments, botox, VS lingerie, hair coloring -- anything other than her daily basic needs;
- I would not tolerate her lying to me, including "I"m not having an A"; "We're just friends"; "I did not go to see him last night" -- ANYTHING that I had hard evidence that it was untrue, I would put my hand up, say "STOP. We both know you're lying to me right now, and it's disrespectful. Please stop it."
- She had to tell the truth about her affair to her parents and our adult children, and stop lying to them and -- even worse -- making ME about like I was paranoid or something. Either she did this, or I would (and I gave her 60 seconds to decide).
That's about it as far as "personal integrity" or "boundary" issues. Once she agreed to end her affair, the list of "dealbreakers" became:
1) Write a no-contact letter for me to send or deliver;
2) Quit your job immediately (they both worked at the same place);
3) Get a full-panel STD test;
4) Agree to full transparency (cell phone # changed, new detailed billing to come to me; I am to be able to look at her cellphone any time I wish; I can GPS her car if I ever feel the need to again).
She abided by my boundaries from the get-go. It took three full months for her to agree to end the affair and come back to the marriage. Once she did that, each of the "dealbreaker" items were done dragged kicking and screaming (she is a stubborn woman!), but she did them all except for the STD test, which she's consistently refused to do.
Which is why we still don't ML. I will not waver on this.
As far as "shining a light back towards the marriage," it was all the MWD DB stuff -- GAL, be positive, work on ME, and then letting her know that I was ready to forgive her, not lord it over her that she'd had an affair, not being "needy/grabby/pursuing", and all of the other positive things that we talk about on the board. So I DO believe in those things -- I just think you have to bust the affair FIRST, and get the wayward OFF of the thing they are addicted to, before any real progress can be made.
I hope that helps. btw, "DoingMyBest" (formerly "TryingMyBest") has some VERY exciting news to share with everyone, and should be posting later today. I'll let him tell it.
Can your W provide your needs? Right now, no. She's making that clear. What about when OM goes away? She will still have ambitions - which is fine but where will you rate? Will both of you be willing to find out whether or not you and your W can balance your marriage along with your SEPARATE lives (ambitions, career, external friends, etc.)? These all feed into the marriage but only because they are things that we as individuals bring. We share these things with our spouse and we do not view them as competitive entities to our marriage.
Michael McC,
Just re-read this and need to say thanks for it. I've been focusing so much on the PA/EA that I've been ignoring the much bigger problem - which is what you describe. She can't even have an A because of her ambitions and this is not a normal way of behaving. Certainly the EA is only making everything worse and keeping the sitch in limbo, but she also doesn't know how to balance a R with her work. And that may never change.
Keeping this in my mind will help me enforce my boundaries as I move forward with GAL and moving on. I deserve a loving and supportive relationship and even though I love WAW, she can't provide this long-term. I'll remain positive and open - maybe the C will help her work through her issues - but need to take care of myself first.
I know I'm repeating myself in these posts - just need to emblazon it in my head and make it real.
She had a PA but ended it because it didn't feel right. She continued having EA, but is so focused on work and her ambitions, she let contact with OM dwindle. So it's the idea of this OM and what he MIGHT offer that is her EA, along with work. They aren't spending much time together.
I started suspecting when I snooped through cell phone records and saw evidence of dwindling contact since beginning of Dec. When I sent WAW my "boundaries" email, I confronted her with this and she said I was right, she couldn't even balance her focus on work with an EA.
As far as I'm concerned, though, it's still an EA and I'm treating it as such. WAW and OM are working a little bit together on her PhD project, so that would have to end and she would have to stop focusing on her attraction to him and start focusing on our M in order for me to be willing to change my tune.
Her work obsession is the bigger problem and she'll either figure it out through counseling or be alone. I'm not willing to have my M thrown into crisis every time she wants to advance her career. When I talked to her sis, her sis said she didn't think WAW even knew how to give priority to R or M.
Spent some time this weekend writing down my beliefs/needs/boundaries to make sure I was clear about what I want and what I'm willing to put up with. I've decided it's time to end the cake-eating, so need to keep repeating these boundaries to myself in order to keep from sliding.
Had my last IC session today. C had said it was a conflict of interest to see both me and WAW individually; I decided she needed to work through her ambition issues, so I'd stop seeing him since she was wanting to continue. Anyway, I expressed all my frustrations and he pretty much suggested what everyone else has been saying - I can't do much about the EA or the focus on ambition. Sounds like it's time to detach.
So, when I got back to work, email from WAW. We were supposed to meet for dinner tomorrow, but I had removed it from our online calendar. Her email had the subject line "?" and in it she suggested another time to get together. Ostensibly, this dinner had been to discuss a work project. So I replied "Thanks for being willing to discuss, but I (and co-worker) have decided to focus differently." Saw her walking a little later and noticed she's starting to look a little haggard. That's what happens when you work 12 hour days and ignore your emotions.
I'm going to be a lot less available. No dinners, no conversations, no friendship. Will take her some time to notice because she's so work-focused right now, but at some point it's going to start sinking in. She made the choice, time to live with it.
WAW and I work at the same location, and we both have activities on Tuesday nights. Usually hers lets out before mine. Anyway, I went back to my office to change into my biking clothes and noticed her office light was still on. Went on, packed up my stuff, and went to get my bike. As I walked to the racks I noticed someone sort of hurrying out of her building. Where I keep my bike is tucked out of the way of the general walkway, but as I was unlocking my bike I heard her say "Hello". When I turned around, she said something about how funny it was to have just happened to have run into me.
Okay, pretty obvious that she had been waiting for my office light to go out to "happen by". I was distant, though. Should have reacted confidently, but was short, cold, and detached. Turned around after a few sentences and said, "well, see you" and biked off, rather than something more polite and casual.
Could have handled that better so that I didn't come across as hurting over her, but such is life. Will do better next time. She must be curious why I'm shutting her out.
