Zu, hey girl! Your sitch sounds a lot like mine and so many others. Besides him wanting a bit more "kinky" sex, it sounds just like most M's that just get in a rut -- life, work, kids, housework, cooking dinner, etc, etc. Unfortunately, he doesn't realize that a lot of this is just reality. The fact that you are actively working to try to spice up your M and not allow it to be put on the back burner is admirable, but until he realizes that a lot of this is just *normal life,* he may end up looking elsewhere for greener grass that will turn brown as soon as he realizes that that won't "fix" his issues/problems.
Me: 38 H: 35 S4, S5, S10 Bomb 01/07 Wanted D - nothing would change his mind Numerous A's prior to D bomb; EA prior/during D bomb Piecing 04/07 Deployed for a year 05/07 Still Piecing 2010 M 11 yrs 05/10
Zuzu, he is hurting and you cannot fix it. He is the only one who can. You can support whatever solution he comes up with, but you can't fix how he feels or how he sees his life. There are career counselors and life coaches and people who can help, but that's not your job.
I adamantly agree with Lillieperl. He is the only one that can seek a resolution. In fact, I think jumping up and going crazy to try and "fix" this problem would be a detriment. My suggestion would be to talk to him, but sit back and let him take the next move.
Originally Posted By: Lillieperl
BTW Did you or did you not [blank] Charlie?
If he asked the question, then the damage is done regardless of the response
By all means marry; if you get a good wife, you'll be happy. If you get a bad one, you'll become a philosopher. -- Socrates
Lil to Zuzu: BTW Did you or did you not [blank] Charlie?
Brian to Lil: If he asked the question, then the damage is done regardless of the response
But not the same amount of damage.
His asking the question indicates some damage, but I certainly think the answer to the question is important. I don't belong to the school that says that "lusting in your heart" is just as much an offense as doing the deed.
His asking the question indicates some damage, but I certainly think the answer to the question is important. I don't belong to the school that says that "lusting in your heart" is just as much an offense as doing the deed.
I'm surprised you are defending her H's irrational obsessions with ex-boyfriends from....what was it....15 years ago? Before they even got M? I don't blame zuzu one bit for not wanting to play into this insanity any longer. Her H sounds Extremely depressed and anxious to me.
I agree with LFL. As I understand Zu's situation (and correct me if I'm wrong, anybody), any time her husband feels discontented with life or insufficiently "loved" or "desired", he starts harping on this crap that happened 15 years ago WHEN THEY WERE BROKEN UP! Besides, historically (I believe), he has been disinclined to believe what she tells him about the past *anyway*, so what's the point? I'm not saying she's blameless for their *current* issues, but he's not going to fix the present in the past, no matter how much he think so. It has always struck me as morbidly obsessive and very unhelpful.
"Show me a completely smooth operation and I'll show you someone who's covering mistakes. Real boats rock." -- Frank Herbert
Okay, sorry, I wasn't familiar enough with her situation. My bad.
Anyway it wasn't my intention to specifically defend her H. My point was that it does matter whether you really {blanked} the person or just wish you had.
In your sitch, LFL, it would have mattered if you had had your talk after {blanking} the guy, instead of before.
You can't compare my situation with zuzu's. Mine was present day and we are M. Hers happened 15 years ago while single. Why he has to be so bothered by her past so much (whether she did IT or not) is beyond me. It seems a little irrational.
No major changes, but let me update as I've been away for a few days.
I truly believed H was in some kind of funk he couldn't help, and I am always struck with the fact that he doesn't really have guy friends that he hangs out with and talks to, other than work chit chat. He has a friend who lives a few hours away and I suggested he go visit for the weekend, which he did. A bit of drama on his way out the door, because our 1.5 year old son was sick and sounding wheezy and (to save money) a friend was going to give us an extra humidifier, so I wanted to pick it up asap. I was on the phone with the friend making the arrangements and he tried to just wave goodbye and leave like that. I said, "can you hang on just a second so you can say goodbye to me?!" He said "I meant to leave 24 min ago!" It was 9:24. Friend said I'll talk to you later (don't blame her - I apologized later.) Then I said I'd like you to go pick it up so we have it asap. He sounds like he has bronchitis. He replied with "what, you aren't leaving the house today?" I said I would have to feed them breakfast, bundle the kids up, then take them to this play place (business she just opened) and explain we're not staying to play. Couldn't he just run and get it so we could be done with it?! He did, but acted a bit put out which exasperated me.
He had a busy weekend with the friend, (recently engaged) working outside. He called once or twice, I was sick and son was sick, so not much to say. He came home Sun night after both kids were in bed. He had said before he left that he had been thinking about everything a lot and he felt it was mostly him. He seemed to be trying to talk and be a little affectionate. I was so sick I was not really jazzed about being intimate. I was also ... frustrated? irritable? I had cleaned up poop, pee, snot, food from the floor, broken up fights, my back hurt from picking up our son, leaning over to give baths, etc etc etc. I wanted (needed) a bit of appreciation and all would be fine. When we got to talking he did say (somewhat uncomfortably) "I appreciate you letting me have a few days to myself."
Well, he proceeded to try and hold my hand, say he loved me, but I was still feeling tension within myself. Finally when he tried to take my pants off, I said wait, I'm not saying no, I just need to talk for a second. He listened. I said, "You said some very hurtful things before you left, and while I do genuinely appreciate your affection right now, I feel like ignoring the fact that those things were said is allowing myself to be walked on." Silence...I think we were laying next to one another, so we couldn't see each other's faces. I then asked, "do you remember what you said?" He said, "not exactly." I told him, "When I told you the kids needed you, you said they were the only reason you came home and when I said I was tired of dealing with this, you said I was about to not have to deal with it any longer." He said (in a monotone) "I'm sorry, Robin, I love you." I tried to take that and run with it. It DID take me a while to warm up. I was not at ALLLLL stimulated/excited, so I was pretty jumpy/touch sensitive, but we did have nice sex. (Even though I could barely breathe because of my stuffy nose.) He went down on me for a long time and it felt really good, but I admit, I just laid there. As of late, I've been pretty good about letting myself go and "responding" but I wasn't in that place this time. I did tell him the next day that his technique was near perfect. He said you didn't act like it. I said there was a lot of tension, from both of us. It wasn't like normal, but I'm proud of us for both pushing through our own uncomfortable feelings and making one another a priority. We pulled ourselves out of something we would have in the past wallowed in for days of entitilement. He seemed to agree and said no more.
So LAST NIGHT, (Mon) we had agreed the night before that he would help me highlight my hair. He was obviously in "trying mode." Being a little more helpful with the kids, brought lunch home, saying he loved me, etc. Not passionate, not normal yet, but trying. I appreciated it and tried to show it by being cheerful and sweet back (hence, the "your technique was perfect" comment). He said something about wanting to be naughty with me and I kind of chuckled. He was doing something with his phone and said "look". He pulled up the pic I sent him when he was out of town last (that he asked for and I was uncomfortable taking and sending but I did it.) He held it up and said, look at that, that's awesome! and then imitated jacking off on it. I know, this is supposed to be flattering... I tried to take it for the compliment it was intended as.
9:00 or so, I had to run to the store for milk and juice. He said, "PLEASE don't be gone long, I wanted to be with you tonight." I said, "ok, did you remember about my highlights?" He said no he hadn't. I said also, I'm SICK! I'm not saying no, but there's too much to squeeze into too little time and I'm not feeling good. So I left, when I came back we watched a bit of tv together and I didn't mention the hair thing. I was still horribly stuffy, but we did have sex. When he initiated doing something kinky (can I lick your [censored]?), I gently asked why he liked to do that. He recoiled and said why do you have to ask? We had sex but no kinkiness.
This morning, I still felt terribly sick and he had to wake me up to take care of baby son who woke extra early and he had to leave for work early. I was dead tired, trying to make coffee. He hugged me, we hugged for a long time. I thought I had done a good thing to not get hung up on "you promised me we would have time to do my hair" or "I'm sick" and we had sex two nights in a row. After a moment, he said, "when you're not sick anymore," (I thought he was going to ask me to get the house in order), he said "will you be naughty with me?" I don't remember all the in between conversation, and it probably doesn't matter, but at one point said "but I guess I'm vague and blah blah blah (couldn't hear him) so I guess I'm F@c$ed!" He said he didn't want it to turn into a "pile of [censored] like this" and I said it's not, I'm listening. He walked out then came right back and said forcefully, almost in tears:
"Your (the?) past bothers me. I need you to make me feel special. You say I'm vague when I say I want you to be naughty. If just once you would turn over and say, "lick my a$$hole," it would blow my mind. I need you to be excited. That's all I'm gonna say!!"
Oh and to clear up the issue about the past. It is VERY confusing, I know, but basically the best way I can describe it is, I had TOTALLY changed for him, was feeling very tied down to a jealous boyfriend and we fought all the time. I broke it off when he was still madly in love with me. I TRIED to stand my ground and there was lots of breaking up/getting back together/more fighting. I was on theatre scholarship at the time and even asked to sit down with my teacher/mentor for help. (We both went). I remember saying I don't know whether to pay attention to the fact that we keep breaking up or keep getting back together. Well, during one of those back together periods, he went on a week long trip. With him not around, I found new people to hang out with. Joe was a friend from high school. He had a best friend I had not previously known. They were funny/cute skater boys and we hung out late at night, no funny business, but we drank, etc. Without realizing it, I probably started to fall for this friend, Charles. Joey came back. I told him all about how much fun we had and (surprise/surprise) he was very jealous and suspicious. I felt it was unwarranted b/c I hadn't done anything wrong, just had a good time. (I was stupid and selfish I admit.) The next couple of days drove a wedge between us and before long, we were broken up again and I started spending all my time with Joe and Charles. A relationship started with Charles. Joey and I were broken up for most of that summer and I dated Charles. I remember Joey had an extra ticket to Lollapalooza and I accepted. We got back together on that trip out of town. I can't even remember what the situation with Charles was at the time, but I do remember him being cold to me towards the end because he knew I was going to be going back to college in the same town as Joey and I never really fell out of love with him.
Now, the morning Joey is talking about, I remember I went to Charles' house late at night and I DON'T remember if we had sex, but I know I wouldn't have wanted Joey to know I was there! I seem to remember it was kind of saying goodbye. Like I said, Charles had started to sense our summer romance was almost over and I would be going back to school. He had pulled away. I think I was kind of saying goodbye. He had very dramatically given me a "prediction" in a sealed envelope at one point and when I opened it, it said something about "falling back into Joey's arms, like I always knew you would." I found out later he was very hurt by our breakup, but I never really got it at the time. I see how I was being insensitive and hurtful w/o meaning to be. So anyway, BANG BANG BANG. There was a loud knock at the door and I realize it's Joey and he is furious. I think I overslept and did not meet him somewhere right when I was supposed to and he saw my car at Charles' house. He was out front with HIS MOTHER IN THE CAR and I went with him to do whatever it was we had had planned that day. It was awful, but I was not undressed, I don't think. I really don't remember what happened the night before. I probably remembered back then and I'm sure we hashed it out a million times, like we did several other scenarios where I hurt him during that time. Everything was very blurred and to top it off, it was 1992. We went back to KU that fall and moved in together. Lived together from then on and I have always been faithful, except for some flirting while we were still boyfriend/girlfriend. Always faithful while we have been married which has been 10 years now.
