Man this is so hard. This afternoon was rough and then I snapped out of it after lunch. I hope I'm doing this right.
Journal:
I call down in-laws at 2:30. Left a message on the answering machine to have kids call me. Son calls at 6:30 from wifes cell and leaves a voice mail. He says he wants to stay over with me. I call them back. I can hear the wife in the background telling son to stay with her so that she can sleep in. He argues with her. I talk to daughter.
At 7 they all come to the house. She rings doorbell and comes in. She says your daughter wants to stay with you because she hasn't seen you. Son is staying over night. She said she is going home to take a shower. I said why don't you take one here. She says she doesn't know but she says all of her stuff is down her house. I try to walk in the other rooms and she follows. It looks like she is wanting some kind of attention or affection from me, but I'm not giving it out. She can come to me if she wants it. She walks closer to me and I try to avoid her a little. It looks like she wants the affection. I'm detached from that. She starts to walk outside and I go to the door. I said you look tired. She said she ways and said work sucks. I said I'm sorry you feel that way. I'm thinking yeah well you never worked our whole marriage it's plenty different when you are not the boss. A stay at home mother is the boss, she can decide when to do something on their own schedule. A stay at home mom is not an easy job, but it does give you freedom. If you don't want to do the dishes you don't do them.
She is walking towards her car and she said something about getting fat again and she raised her shirt to show me her stomach and started slapping it. I quickly turn away and go in the house. She says good bye, and I close the door. Showing me her flat stomach is a sexual thing and I'm not putting up with it. Look how skinny I am now and you can't have me. I mean she just about has six pack abs. I hate six pack abs on woman. She never had them, was never really fat to begin with. She always complained about that area. I always embraced all of her body images.
No, daughter is eight so we can scratch a lot of that post.
Opps, I remember that now. I don't know why I was thinking she was older.....reading too many posts at once, I guess. But I hate that your wife is acting like a "B" in front of her and teaching her those behavior patterns. It will be a miracle if your D doesn't act like her mom when she starts growning into a young woman....or earlier.
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She said it was nice having a wife wasn't it, and then she snickered.
You know what? When she started picking those weeds, I would just go back in the house and finish doing whatever you were doing before she arrived. She is only doing it to try to make you feel like you aren't doing a good job around the place without her. The above quote.....that was to get under you skin. Like I told you last time.....she gets her kicks out of upsetting you....so don't give her the power. If she wants to make a fool out of herself by standing out there pulling up weeds....let her go ahead and do it....but don't let her "guilt" you into feeling that you aren't doing a good job "without a wife". I think you are doing a fantastic job. If she asks why you haven't cut the grass, you could always laugh and tell her that you knew it would be just a matter of time before she would be out there picking it by hand!
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Son badgered me all day yesterday while shopping to get a hamster. I told him no. He asked his mother today and she told him yes. Now son wants to stay with her tonight,
Yeah, that is some of what I was talking about how kids play their parents against each other. They are so darn smart, too! I hope he won't do this, but don't be too suprised if when you don't allow him to have his way about something or give into whatever he wants you to buy....that he acts mad at you and wants to stay at his mom's out of spite for a day or so. Then he will get mad at her and want to go back to your house. I really hope that the you and your W can be united where the kids are concerned or they are going to be a big problem....but I'm doubting she is going to be mature enough to plan to big on that. However, there comes a time that you have to use that tough love with kids, b/c you can't give over to them on everything or you will ruin them and they won't be prepared for the real world later on. Stick to your guns about the hampster!
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Really my son has been driving me crazy all day. He constantly needs something. Wants something or is into something. Every 5 minutes they are either hungry or bored.
Well, I'm certainly no expert, but I wouldn't be surpirsed that this is a result of his not adjusting to being at one home and the unstableness of it all. Plus, you have shown him almost all of your undivided attention when he is with you.....and when a child gets used to that, he doesn't want to give it up....even for five minutes. At some point, he needs to learn to entertain himself while daddy does some things for himself. I had to learn this with one of our grandchildren. We gave her our undivided attention the first six years of her life and it got to the place that I was so exhausted with her coming to visit that I had to just tell her that I could not play with her or "entertain" her every moment and that she would have to find something to do on her own. Of course, she had plenty of toys and movies and coloring pages on the computer, etc. It was just that she loved having our attention and us spoiling her. However, I found out the other grandparents did not do that and she didn't expect them to. But, she did us, b/c we always had. You know, we can "spoil" our children with love and yet we still have to tell them that there comes a time that they can't have us every second of the day. It's hard when you want to eat them up b/c you love them so much or b/c you feel guilty that they are going through something that wasn't their fault. I think you have tried to give so much of yourself to your son b/c of the breakup of the M. My daughter use to say about her son that he may be "spoiled" but he wasn't a spoiled a "brat"....lol.
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Am I being tested?
Yes.....but I don't think it is by God, it's by your wife! She really does have some issues that are way out there and I know you are concerned about how this will affect your kids. You have a right to be worried!
One thing that I've noticed is that you talk about the church and you seem to be wanting to get more involved. That is good Phil, and not to sound like something more than what I am....but I do believe in God and I do believe He will help us if we turn it all over to Him. My problem is having patient to wait upon Him to do His work. But, when you stop and think about the mess "we" make out of our lives and then He has to straighten it all out and make it better.....then it should make us realize that it would even take God a while to make it better.
You do need to get rest once in a while. The strain you've been under is very draining on your health and your soul. So, let the wife take her turn with the kids while you get a good night's rest or even go out by yourself or a friend. You know, I don't remember hearing you talk about spending much time with anyone but family. Do you have some friends that you could get out with sometimes? You really need to do that for yourself.
I'll try to keep this post a little short than the last. It was good to hear from you again.
Take care......and don't quit doing what works.
Sandi
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
One of the best communication nights with her. I had both kids from 7 until 10. When she showed up she was just wearing normal grubby clothes. Why she wanted to be away from her kids is beyond me because that it not her normal typical behavior before bomb.
I said son is going to stay with you tonight. Children should be with their mother. She asked if I was going out. I said yes but nowhere in particular.
I tell her that son and I had a very sucessful progress of not wearing pull ups. And I said I was upset that you let him be lazy by wearing them, and you let him wear one last night. He has not wore one for four nights and he hasn't had an accident. You can't let him be lazy. Do not let him drink anything after a certain time and wake up with him in the morning and make him go. No more laziness from either side. If he knows he has one on then he will just do what he wants. She agreed. She said she would try and do what I did.
We walked out to the car and I carried son. I buckled him in. I kissed him. I said be with mommy, and be good. I asked daughter to tell mommy what she decided. Daughter started going off. Well Daddy asked me to play all star softball. I said no honey, I did not ask you to play tonight. I asked you to play the other night. Now what I told you when you told me you were bored was that you could have been playing baseball tonight on a team, but you didn't want too. Then you said well I'm not doing anything this summer maybe I could play for the allstar softball team.
Wife was real receptive. I told her that it will not cost nothing and there are only three games in July. I don't know the schedule yet but will find out by the end of the week.
Son started whinning I don't want to go to mommies I want to be with you dad. I said sorry son I'm going somewhere. I asked her to wait and I came to the other side of the car and I kissed daughter. Then I asked wife to roll down her window. Son was whining and she just wanted to leave. I said I'm making it easier on you so that you can sleep in. She said she knows. She was changing channels on the radio. I said what is wrong. She said nothing. I said could you please stop it with the radio. I would like to hear what is wrong. She said just let me go so he will stop whinning.
I said ok, have a good night.
I walked away, shut the door to the house before she was even out of the driveway.
She needs to think. She needs to think what she wants. I can't not give her what she wants.
I went out and things were slow. I even drove past her place. Only her car was there and every light in the house was on. Right she isn't scared...
You really are making great headway. And the way you handled things tonight was a terrific 180!!
Can I just point out one thing, and I am not trying to be negative, but even if she is acting like a *&()^^$^ please tone it down a bit with the pull-up stuff and your Son. She is not a child and doesn't need to keep being told how lazy she is.
I just know that for me when my Husband would make a big deal about certain things with the kids just to show me how much better he was then me it was a huge turn off and I became very defensive.
Words of encouragement........
There can be no testimony without a test. I am praying to go through this test and come out the other end with a new and better marriage then before.
Wow I should really read my post over again before writing so fast. I didn't tell wife how lazy she is, but the way I wrote it makes it sound like I did. "No more laziness from either side." I should have said. I'm thinking no more laziness from either side. I think I was harping on her about how the pull up issue makes him lazy.
Thanks for the encouragement. I could sure use it. It seems like I'm in and out of the funk. 15 minutes I'm functioning. 15 minutes I'm down. I was like that all day yesterday, until after the kids left.
Now I was like that all morning.
Yeah last night I felt like she came down from the mothership a little. I just wish she would have showed me some affection.
I was bad too. I went out and before I got home I drove past her place. I would say it was all clear. The TV was on in the livingroom, and she left the foyer lights on. I'm still thinking she is scared as hell being by herself. When she was at home she had to have a zillion night lights on. One night I counted 26 night lites.
Here is a funny story. The water company left me a note saying something was wrong with my meter. I called them and they said it was 10K less of what it usually is. I said there isn't a problem. Wife left and she was a chronic water user, because she had OCD. She would use 100 gallons to wash a few dishes. She would take a 1/2 hour shower. She has only been gone for a month and half and I would expect the water reading to become even less.
Water abuser, product abuser, night lite abuser, verbal abuser, is this anger detachment?
Thanks for responding. I have to agree with what you say. I think part of why I write on her so much and about everything is to prove I'm not the one nuts... Because this situation is sure making me crazy.
"The strain you've been under is very draining on your health and your soul." You are not kidding sister!
This is so infuriating. Every little thing. Every little button push.
Journal:
She text me at 4 o'clock can you be home 4 5:30 I text: I thought you were off today. She text: No I'm off tomorrow. I text: Ok She text: Thanks!
I get home and find her laundry in the washer. She didn't bother to take the dry clothes and put them in a basket and take them upstairs. She also didn't bother to take the clothes on the table upstairs and put anything away. Thanks? Oh and she didn't bother to call me and tell me she was going into the house.
She arrives at residence at 5:25. She brings in a change of clothes for D for tonight after baths. Says D wants to call her friend and I need to write the number down. She gives the I love you guys and says I need to go I'm already late. She starts to walk out and I close the door.
I count to ten. I walk outside. She is in the car with the windows up and the music is blarring. The back window is down halfway. I try to get her attention. She is putting on her lipstick. Then she is putting on eyeliner. I yell for her and walk towards the vehicle. She rolls down the window and screams at me. What, What do you want? You think you can slam the door on me and then try and talk to me. I'm late already. In a calm tone. I said please do not scream at me. I'm trying to get your attention and you have the music blarring. She says I'll listen to my music any way I want. Then she says you are the one slamming doors. Calmly I say, I did not slam the door, I'm sorry you felt I slammed it. She says that is what you have been doing lately, slamming the door on me. Again I say I'm sorry you feel that way, but I'm not slamming the door. I'm just trying to ask you if what is going on with kids tonight. She says D is coming with me, but S wants to stay with you. She says she doesn't want him too because she is off tomorrow. She continues to put on lipstick again. She said call me later, I got to go I'm really late. I say ok have a nice time at work. She rolls her eyes and says yeah right. I said ok, see you later. So I walk in the house and I shut the door.
More to the puzzle. Kids tell me that they were at the grandma's for a couple of hours while wife went and got a mattress for son. Looks like these windows of opportunity are opening up for a possible affair. I'm better about that though. We are still married. If she crosses the line that is something she will have to live with. The guilt in the future will eat her alive. I can't control it. I can control my immagination.
Son also told me that he didn't wear a pull up but had an accident. D told me that mommy tried to wake him up to go but he didn't get up.
(MAN YOU ARE THE PARENT GET YOUR A$$ UP AND MAKE HIM GET UP!)
I don't see how I continue this abuse. It appears she was in one of her manic phases being late for work and such. It is like a wave. One minute I think I'm making some kind of progress with her and the next bam.
Wow I can't believe she thought I was slamming doors. I mean in the past we would really slam doors when I was doing the addition. One door in particular got plenty of abuse.
I mean I closed the door, because the AC is not on and the house is still cool. No need to eat it up to turn on the AC.
I feel better writing this down. This morning I was really in the funk.
Hey.. LostPhil.. can I come do my laundry at your house?
"I get home and find her laundry in the washer. She didn't bother to take the dry clothes and put them in a basket and take them upstairs. She also didn't bother to take the clothes on the table upstairs and put anything away. Thanks? Oh and she didn't bother to call me and tell me she was going into the house."
She is walking all over you isn't she. WTF was she thinking. It is your house isn't it? What is all this clutter? I got clothes amongst my pirate stuff!! She did not even call.. GD it!
"She arrives at residence at 5:25. She brings in a change of clothes for D for tonight after baths. Says D wants to call her friend and I need to write the number down. She gives the I love you guys and says I need to go I'm already late. She starts to walk out and I close the door."
I think you said.. she knew she was stirring up some "Drama". Did you slam the door or not? Its ok if you did.
"I count to ten."
Ok.. so you slammed the door.
"I yell for her and walk towards the vehicle. She rolls down the window and screams at me. What, What do you want? You think you can slam the door on me and then try and talk to me. I'm late already."
She is confirming the "door slam". She heard it. The problem really is the door slamming?!
No.. wait.. the problem was the laundry..
"Calmly I say, I did not slam the door, I'm sorry you felt I slammed it. She says that is what you have been doing lately, slamming the door on me."
Oh.. Snap.. someone there is saying the same thing all of us have said.
"I'm trying to get your attention and you have the music blarring."
This said alot to me. You keep trying to get her attention.. and get pissed when she shows you none.
Seriously.. both of you feed on the drama.. it is the only way you know you are alive. Everything you (2) do.. Everything you (2)say.. its all about the drama. It is just fuel for the both of you. You wonder why she is so out of control.. and give her some more fuel. She wonders why you are so controlling.. and she gives you some fuel.
The thing about feeding off another person.. is eventually someone is going to get eaten up. I got a little tip for you.. she is disappearing with the quickness.
All I see is finger pointing. She did this.. She did that.. If she would just do this.. everything would be better.
You are the one posting here... I can only talk to you.. You are the ONLY one that can change.
Relax Eat Think Act normal React.. Smartly. Do something different. Emulate. Do Work.
Well, bless your heart......you really have your hands full. To be honest, I think your W acts more like a teenager than a WAW or a W in MLC. I don't know really what to make of her. Do you think she is bipolar?
I am so concerned about how she does her little boy. Again, she acts like a teenager that is not repsonsibile enough to take care of him! I understood what you meant by the statement of her not being lazy and not allowing him to get lazy on the job. when you are the parent that goes through all the pain in the butt to train a kid to not wet the bed. It is hard being the one to wein him from the bottle or potty trains, or learn any other new behavior or break bad habits........and then somebody else comes along about the time you have made progress and tears it all down.....I would be pissed too!
She really showed me how much like a silly rebellious teenager she was acting with the radio changing while you were trying to tell the kids good-night and talk to her. Her ignoring you sent a loud message. Did you pick up on it? I bet you did b/c you are beginning to see through some of the things she does to push your buttons. I also think that when the son started to change his mind about leaving with her and started the whinning, that she did just want to get away fast, b/c I don't think she can deal with him crying and throwing a fit to be with daddy. In fact, I think that is why they end up at the grandparents as much as they do. She cannot handle them any more. The daughter is older and not as much trouble. She can feed, bathe, and dress herself....and go to the bathroom by herself, so there isn't a lot of personal care that your W has to do for her.
I can't imagine the hell you go through every time you see her drive away with those kids! I couldn't even be angry with you for driving by her house to see if everything looked okay from the outside. I really think the son feels so insecure there is why he doesn't want to stay. How can you get a life when your kids are over there with that nut? (sorry)
Phil, I hate to say it, but I am thinking she has a lot more problems than that of a MLC or WAW. As much as you want her and love her.....I am thinking that you need to protect your children. She seems so unstable that who knows what may happen next. She certainly is a "drama queen", but I can't help but wonder if it doesn't go a lot deeper mentally.
I am going out on a long limb here.......but have you thought about how she would react to you asking to keep the children on a permanent basis? You would have to make sure that you chose the right time to talk to her about it and make it sound as though it would give her more "freedom" in her life......not that she was a bad mother or not responsible, etc. It would have to be planned out very well and sound like it was all for her best. Being in the self centered mode that she is in.....she might just go for it. If she thought she could see the kids once in a while....like every other weekend (like daddys used to have to do). What do you think? Have you thought about it? I know this is not your first choice in what you "want" to happen.....I realize that. You want her to come to her senses and return home and be normal.....but I don't think that is going to happen....not for a long time, Phil. Maybe you need to get some serious professional advice about what you should do for the children's welfare.
I don't think I ever remember telling anyone here on the board what I've told you just now. I did advise a mother to leave a very abusive H and take her children to safety.
I am not telling you to divorce her. That is up to you and how much of this you can continue to take. I am just so concerned about your children and the effect this is having on them. I know you are too. In spite of your pain....in spite of your backslides and mistakes......you have tried to take care of the children and see to their needs. You are trying to get stronger in your church and faith in God. You are doing better in your personal improvements. You are trying to take a day at a time. You are not crying and whinning and asking why isn't she coming home. You are dealing. You are trying to turn it over to God. That is a lot more than some have done. I know you have been hit hard with a lot of 2x4's and you would come back swinging. I have been there myself. We give our opinions and advice and none of it is really any of our business, but that is why we are all here, isn't it? Well, sweetie, I don't think this is working with the wife.....swapping the kids around like this and I don't think she has anything for you right now. Sorry to be so blunt. But, she likes to play games with you. She likes to tease you sexually....and that is mean. She wants to "mark her territory" at your house just as if she were an animal! Know how she does this? By way of the laundry and going about the house pointing out this & that. She disrespects you and walks on you. Even though you are getting better.....she isn't.
I am not sure she will get better until she has lost a lot......or until she hits rock bottom and the only way to go--is up. That is so sad, but that is what I'm afraid will happen. I don't know her, but I have a gut feeling about this one.
You have tried to keep the children in her life. You have tried to keep the house available to her b/c her name is on the deed and you have tried to do all you can to accomadate her with her job and the impossible hours she keeps and raising a family in two different households, etc. I can't remember, but I would dare say that you are providing her car and paying the insurance on it b/c her income is lower.....am I correct?
Have you thought what would happen if she were to have all of this taken away from her? If you filed for D and took her to court for child custody and she really did lose everything.....what do you honestly think would happen--b/c you know this woman better than anyone. What would she do? Would she be force to go live with her parents? Or, is it too scary to even consider? Would it shock her into changing her life? Or would it send her over the edge? If she hit rock bottom......she may still not want you to be the one to pick her up....you know you have to consider that. She may never have the feeling for you that she once did. Can you turn her lose? What do you think is the best route to take?
I have thrown a lot at you just now. You probably have thought about every single question long before I asked them tonight. It is scary, isn't it? My heart goes out to you. I hope you know that. I hate to see any family split up and a M end......but it may be the only chance in heaven or hell that you have in getting her back again.....some day. And Phil, there is no telling how low she may go before she hits rock bottom.
I may be beaten up by the others here on the board for what I have said to you tonight. It has been more of something to think upon and to know that there has to be a change b/c this is not working! That is very obvious. She isn't buying into this and so something extreme has to be done. The reason I say that, is b/c she is a drama queen and "extreme" is what she understands. So, instead of doing "small 180's"......maybe an extreme 180 is due. Just my thoughts out loud. I'm certainly not telling you to do any of it.....just throwing some stuff around.
Phil......take care of you and the kids, okay? I care about you all.
Sandi
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
