Oh and at least in my sitch, I think we may need to see a C to figure out what kind of arrangement is workable and what we can really handle emotionally in terms of flexibility. The arrangement with the kids is IMO not the appropriate arena for proving oneself or exhibiting changes. You've got to be very matter of fact and consider what kind of communication you two can handle (flexibility requires more communication and you two struggle with that already).
These sitches often start out more rigid and then get more flexible over time (or unfortunately sometimes is is the opposite or it ebbs and flows). To me, in your sitch, the clearer the better; up front, negotiated and maybe do 3 months at a time in advance.
I like the idea of having someone else involved so you can check in and see how things are going and diffuse any emotional baggage.
She does keep bringing up my past behavior, and she continues to say that I'm still that way! And I'm trying to use these opportunities where we do communicate to show her that I'm not that way anymore. I haven't argued/sparred with her about it at all. I haven't even responded to any of her accusations about me still being the way that I used to be...not one bit! I don't know if she's trying to be manipulative, or if she still has some big trust issues with me, or a combination of both, or whatever! I do know that my texts and E-mails (communication) with her have been much different than they have ever been with her...and maybe she notices that! Even if she says otherwise! And I'm sure the kids talk to her some also.
"Always go straight forward, and if you meet the devil, cut him in two and go between the pieces." - William Sturgis, clipper ship captain, 1830's.
I had to read back a few pages to catch up so fogive me if I've missed a few of the finer points in your situation and have to ask questions.
The arrangement you and W have now with the kids - both agreed to this? I'm guessing 'yes'.
How are your children doing under current schedule? This is really the heart of the matter. THIS IS REALLY THE HEART OF THE MATTER. Your children need the influence (translation - time) with both their mother and father. 50/50 as it is - is that need being met?
Sounds like she would like to make this about you being a jerk....again or still. Your concerns factor in your attention to her perception or your appearance of being flexible.
At the point that a woman (or a man - but women struggle more with this) makes the decision to split, she must take the good with the bad. It's been said here frequently - she's gotta put those Big Girl Panties on and deal...by herself...with the choice she has made. You, Antlers, are not obligated to make this easier for her. Any flexibility or provision or compromise you make now is to make it EASIER for your children. That's your role as father. And it is a bulletproof position. You can be proud of it. You won't regret it. Your children will respect it (someday ).
So, having said that, if being flexible in addressing her complaints go to addressing a need unmet in your children's lives ~ do what you can and make it work. If being flexible is more about pacifying a petulant, childish W who doesn't like the way the cookie is crumbling, well, you know what to do there.
Cheers ~~~
Me45 H46 T25 M22 S21 & 19 D13 Separated and filed 8/08 Moved home 11/08
She does keep bringing up my past behavior, and she continues to say that I'm still that way! And I'm trying to use these opportunities where we do communicate to show her that I'm not that way anymore. I haven't argued/sparred with her about it at all. I haven't even responded to any of her accusations about me still being the way that I used to be...not one bit! I don't know if she's trying to be manipulative, or if she still has some big trust issues with me, or a combination of both, or whatever! I do know that my texts and E-mails (communication) with her have been much different than they have ever been with her...and maybe she notices that! Even if she says otherwise! And I'm sure the kids talk to her some also.
Time and your new, improved, aware, insightful, DBing self may whittle this away. Sounds like your changes are poking holes in her reasons for staying apart. That sure does make a woman mad - haha! I was there. The better Coach got with communication, empathy, listening and setting boundaries, the more mad I got. He was working on most of my reasons for being gone which begged the question - well, why are you still gone? So - I got mad. Until I could see increasingly the changes could be relied upon - trusted. Then I wasn't AS mad. Time and consistency on his part helped. Just a little fyi for ya.
Me45 H46 T25 M22 S21 & 19 D13 Separated and filed 8/08 Moved home 11/08
Thanks for your response. I like it. I haven't been taking the bait on any of these responses that she sends to me where she makes accusations, etc. I haven't sparred/argued with her at all! But, I didn't have them for 2 weeks the end of June...we were 6 days in Colorado, then we came back so the kids could spend 3 nights with her, then the kids and I went to Texas for 3 nights. They are going nowhere with me the end of July. And now, it looks like they are going nowhere with me the end of August. I wasn't 50/50 in the past, it was always more one side than the other. But I haven't been like that since the end of last November! She still accuses me of being selfish...again, I haven't been like that since last November! And she accuses me of trying to make myself look better than her...she still accuses me of doing these things...still! She says she sees it and so do others! Notheing could be further from the truth! I know so much more now than I did then, and I'm learning and getting better as more time passes. Should I 'call' her on this stuff, and refute what she's saying about me now...or should I continue to do what I've been doing?
What about this? Should I refute any of this stuff that she's telling me?
"Always go straight forward, and if you meet the devil, cut him in two and go between the pieces." - William Sturgis, clipper ship captain, 1830's.
I had to read back a few pages to catch up so fogive me if I've missed a few of the finer points in your situation and have to ask questions.
The arrangement you and W have now with the kids - both agreed to this? I'm guessing 'yes'.
How are your children doing under current schedule? This is really the heart of the matter. THIS IS REALLY THE HEART OF THE MATTER. Your children need the influence (translation - time) with both their mother and father. 50/50 as it is - is that need being met?
Sounds like she would like to make this about you being a jerk....again or still. Your concerns factor in your attention to her perception or your appearance of being flexible.
At the point that a woman (or a man - but women struggle more with this) makes the decision to split, she must take the good with the bad. It's been said here frequently - she's gotta put those Big Girl Panties on and deal...by herself...with the choice she has made. You, Antlers, are not obligated to make this easier for her. Any flexibility or provision or compromise you make now is to make it EASIER for your children. That's your role as father. And it is a bulletproof position. You can be proud of it. You won't regret it. Your children will respect it (someday ).
So, having said that, if being flexible in addressing her complaints go to addressing a need unmet in your children's lives ~ do what you can and make it work. If being flexible is more about pacifying a petulant, childish W who doesn't like the way the cookie is crumbling, well, you know what to do there.
Cheers ~~~
Hi Greek! Thank you for responding.
Yes, we both agreed to 'sharing' the kids equally.
The kids are doing fine (under the circumstances) with the current schedule. Yes...the 50/50 need of our kids is being met.
I feel like I have been, and am, flexible.
There are consequences for her, too, for leaving! She got pissed at me because I took the kids on a nice vacation recently! I primarily want my flexibility and compromises/provisions to make it EASIER for our kids...but it would be nice, also, if these actions sent a positive message to my wife too!
I don't want to pacify her. She chose to leave and this is how things are right now.
"Always go straight forward, and if you meet the devil, cut him in two and go between the pieces." - William Sturgis, clipper ship captain, 1830's.
If you're going to call her on it - and I think that's in order - let her be the fact-checker on it.
W: You always.... you never..... everyone sees it....
Anters: How did our schedule work out in June? Not rhetorical, I really want to know from you what the schedule was in June.
W: (TBA)
Anters: Why did I come back from Colorado when I did? Not rhetorical, I really wnat to know from you why I did that.
W: (TBA)
If she doesn't report the facts, don't interrupt. When she finishes, "You know as well as I do that's not accurate." Otherwise, don't argue. Point made and no need to argue. But you have given her an opportunity to face up to what really happened, what you really did - not what her p!ssed off perception is. She'll take it or leave it. That you cannot control. But you've unleashed the Truth and Facts into the universe either way.
Me45 H46 T25 M22 S21 & 19 D13 Separated and filed 8/08 Moved home 11/08
She does keep bringing up my past behavior, and she continues to say that I'm still that way! And I'm trying to use these opportunities where we do communicate to show her that I'm not that way anymore. I haven't argued/sparred with her about it at all. I haven't even responded to any of her accusations about me still being the way that I used to be...not one bit! I don't know if she's trying to be manipulative, or if she still has some big trust issues with me, or a combination of both, or whatever! I do know that my texts and E-mails (communication) with her have been much different than they have ever been with her...and maybe she notices that! Even if she says otherwise! And I'm sure the kids talk to her some also.
Time and your new, improved, aware, insightful, DBing self may whittle this away. Sounds like your changes are poking holes in her reasons for staying apart. That sure does make a woman mad - haha! I was there. The better Coach got with communication, empathy, listening and setting boundaries, the more mad I got. He was working on most of my reasons for being gone which begged the question - well, why are you still gone? So - I got mad. Until I could see increasingly the changes could be relied upon - trusted. Then I wasn't AS mad. Time and consistency on his part helped. Just a little fyi for ya.
Makes sense, and this goes along with a lot of what I've been told since I've been here. I'm doin' it, and plan to continue.
"Always go straight forward, and if you meet the devil, cut him in two and go between the pieces." - William Sturgis, clipper ship captain, 1830's.
If you're going to call her on it - and I think that's in order - let her be the fact-checker on it.
W: You always.... you never..... everyone sees it....
Anters: How did our schedule work out in June? Not rhetorical, I really want to know from you what the schedule was in June.
W: (TBA)
Anters: Why did I come back from Colorado when I did? Not rhetorical, I really wnat to know from you why I did that.
W: (TBA)
If she doesn't report the facts, don't interrupt. When she finishes, "You know as well as I do that's not accurate." Otherwise, don't argue. Point made and no need to argue. But you have given her an opportunity to face up to what really happened, what you really did - not what her p!ssed off perception is. She'll take it or leave it. That you cannot control. But you've unleashed the Truth and Facts into the universe either way.
I like it! Thanks Greek!
What about her saying I'm still selfish and I'm still trying to make myself look better than her...and others' seeing this also?
"Always go straight forward, and if you meet the devil, cut him in two and go between the pieces." - William Sturgis, clipper ship captain, 1830's.
This is too subjective. I think it would help for you two to define what flexible is. It isn't impossible to account for most possibilities.
For example, if H has kids on Saturdays and I have kids on Sundays, what happens if something comes up on Saturday that H wants them to join him for? In my sitch, we are just working this out. For this weekend, I asked the kids what they wanted to do but I do not think that is appropriate. I think we should decide. And this is just the BITCH of separating, the kids will miss a lot and we have to balance the need for the kids to have time with each parent plus all of the other social events, etc. I find it daunting but I can't do the willy nilly thing with someone who is bitter and resentful toward me, too hard. Plus, I don't want to see him all the time so he can't just come by etc.
In my case, I am not considered "flexible" if I have any boundaries.
You've got to separate the issues.
Greek was so on the money and it was good for me to read those posts too. Thanks Greek
Quote:
The better Coach got with communication, empathy, listening and setting boundaries, the more mad I got.
This is so beautiful because it reminds me that I can really address H's grievances with me (I agree I need work in many of those areas) AND I can set boundaries. Also that H's anger does NOT mean I am doing something wrong.
).