Maybe it is a woman thing but I dont understand :"move on before you go back with your wife". Huh? SO, rob will not know himself unless he meets someone special (who wont be special because THEY are all the same anyway) other than his wife? Dont get it. Maybe because I am lacking testosterone...
For the record, I like gucci's approach. You cant force anyone to be honest, I tried that all last year. (I like gucci). Let her go thru the crisis. (Maybe I should have let H go thru it a while longer, more than 2-2,5 months, but our sitch was a bit different). K
PS rob, what the h$ll is a "european triple whatever". I live in Europe, where can I get it? LOLOL!!!
LOL!
Kalni you are funny!
Being triple teamed european style, I heard that expression used on an HBO sitcom and I've been quoting it regularly ever since. Triple teamed obviously means 3 guys and 1 girl (or 3 girls 1 guy), as for "european style", use your imagination as I don't know what that part would involve LOL!
I can't see any changes that your W has made. What good would it do to allow her to come home to you if nothing has changed? The only change I see in the stitch now and when you first came on board.....is your personal changes. That is good, but "she" hasn't done anything that I can see.
I think she still tries to control you by using sex. You may have seen it as fun, exciting, or whatever........but she was using it as a control hold on you. She knows that that has been your weak area....her body.
When you approached her about coming out of limbo and trying to have a R together (instead of just wild monkey sex), she didn't seem to have a problem turning you down. But as soon as you let her know you would be moving on......then that was her clue to play her game--but when she didn't get her way...she threw her usual fit (as I recall). Isn't that what she has always done when she didn't get her way?
So now she sees you as unavailable and she is getting overly obsessed with pursuing you. You know what you would tell another poster here on the board. You have good advice, Rob, so turn it around and use it on yourself.
I think she has had sex with somebody close to you. I think it would be a turn-on (to her) to accomplish that. It's not only a power thing for her, but it was somebody that should have been hands-off to her. Thus.....added excitement and challenge. (Kind of like you are to her, at the moment.)
She sees the changes you've made in yourself and she knows that if she tells you everything....it will be a dealbreaker for you.
You have this thing called self-respect.....and she knows that, now. So....unless you see that she is making changes in herself, why would you think she would even stop at having A's with OM if the two of you got back together? I think it is needs to go futher than her giving you details.
Sandi you're right, she does try to control me with the sex, honestly I was selfish and the sex was great so I can blame myself for a year and half of this kind of activity, I knew it was going on but I still allowed it to happen just because I enjoyed the sex so much
But that's also why I stopped and cut it off and that's what made her angry so I know that I cut off her ability to control me, without the sex, she had no other way to control me.
I don't see the changes, none of the changes she said she is in the process of making, she mentioned she's been seeing a counsellor for the past few months and I told her it was good to hear that and I hoped it worked out well for her, I didn't offer her any more than that.
... And there will be no sex, I won't let her "tag" me again. I'm in control, I know that now and I've held my ground for 2+ months now so I'm confident about rejecting her advances, she tried again last night to start something with a kiss while she was over "talking" and I pushed her away and told her "no thanks, I'm not falling for that anymore", it was her standard text book operating procedure, try to get me hard, worked up, have sex and resume her position in the driver's seat and I stopped it before anything happened and she got angry, true colors revealed yet again.
Actually, Ditto minus the part about moving forward with the divorce. You and you alone know what you want; don't be ashamed to ask for what you want. If your W complies, you win. If she is doesn't, you move on and you win.
Seems to me the only way you lose is by taking her back without getting what you really want (Honesty and an end to the lies).
Rob, It seems you know what the deal-breaker is for you. You have defined it pretty clear, even both the M & W see it here. You know your goal so what are the objectives to get you there?
M22,H45,W45 S21/18D12 Retain faith that you will prevail in the end, regardless of the difficulties and at the same time confront the most brutal facts of your current reality, whatever they might be.
Rob, honestly, man you do not want the details. It is not as simple as you say "pre-conceived notions."
It a MF'ing vision that will never go away once you really know.
You might think it does then one day a year or two or five or seven years down the road you are sitting at the kitchen table having a beer then BAM like a god''damn horror film the whole scene changes and BZZZZZZZZ its in your mind and thats all you see suddenly and you are pissed off for good.
It comes back from time to time before that, here and there. Anything you hear about it from her, things they did, places, stupid things like they drank budwiser, well $hit, hate the king of beers, you are drinking PBR from now on. He had an SUV. You'll never want to get in one again. and honestly, you might never put your mouth down there again.
and find out who he is 2 years later? you wont beat the daylights out of the guy next time you see him? honestly Rob, think about it.
Little F'ing details of this and that? they get in the crevices of your mind and mess you up down the road. Ask people who have been there. they are not the ones whose marriages survived infidelity.
When I read these young guys whose wife is having an affair or worse on her second or third and he professing his unconditional love to her in his posts, I some times sit back and think he hasnt seen it yet. He doesnt get the visions. There isnt really anyway to warn him. He wont listen; he isnt listening to anything anybody who isnt trying to comfort him is saying anyway.
So, I'm just giving you something to think about. A little counter-intuititive version of what you think it might be like for you.
strength, confidence, self respect have nothing to do with it; its some guy porking your wife and hearing the details from her mouth and then living with her and that knowledge afterwards. its hard to supress.
maybe she wont tell you because she knows you will walk away. should walk away after hearing.
Yes Steve, this crazy bastard still wants the truth, I don't need the intimate details (or at least I don't think I do) but I want to know who. I seriously need to know that I haven't been buddy buddy with the guy who had an affair with my wife and looked me straight in the eye as if he did nothing.
I can't be that chump, I won't be.
Will i knock his block off, seriously I don't know.
That's me being honest.
Part of me would want to, who wouldn't want knock out the guys teeth and make him spit them out like watermelon seeds after something like this.
I also have kids and I don't see myself going to jail after breaking this guy's jaw, I'm going to be their parent for as long as I live and I won't do something stupid like incur jail time.
But yeah I want to know who, when, how long the affair lasted, etc. Heck if they did it in the master bedroom of my house in the bed that I currently sleep in, I would want to know so that I can give the bed and the bedroom furniture away to good will and sleep in something untainted.
Honestly I do want to know, and yes I agree at the same time, the details will sit in the crevices of my brain for the rest of my life - maybe it's dumb for me to want this.
Steve for what it's worth, thanks for the post, I think you know me pretty well.
Sometimes the guy who gives advice wants advice too... it happens ;-)
Rob, It seems you know what the deal-breaker is for you. You have defined it pretty clear, even both the M & W see it here. You know your goal so what are the objectives to get you there?
Well it seems that these past few months of actually practicing what I preach have produced these results.
I didn't want to live in limbo anymore, I realized it was my choice, it's always tougher to take the appropriate action than say you are taking that appropriate action.
- My wife now knows that I'm selling the house in the spring.
- I'm still actively putting her things together in boxes
- our finances are being separated.
- the big one, I finally made her take the kids 50% of the time, previously I had them for easily 70,80,90% of the time. She struggles with this because she works part-time with a schedule that isn't fixed, lives at home with her parents, her parents are really good grandparents to my kids but they are older and my kids are our younger, the kids are a handful and she ends up fighting with her parents regularly because they feel like they are doing most of the parenting when they have our kids because my wife still enjoys going out, that is however her problem to deal with, no one said life is easy, and life with children can be difficult but nothing to complain about. I work full-time and I can handle it and I know my kids enjoy coming home when it's my week & weekend to have them (I'm the only adult in my house, I'm obviously not fighting with anyone to help take care of my kids LOL!), although it can be fun for them to visit grandma/grandpa and be with mom, life over there isn't always easy and I do take them for extra time when I'm told things are going that great at grandma's.
- there is a ton more that I could post as to what I did to get here
As far what I need to do to accomplish the objectives of getting her to be honest with me.... seriously I'm tapped out, I know the game plan of what usually works successfully for getting them to come back but what to do when she wants to come back (as in, she told me she wants to move back home and be with her husband and be a good wife and create a good environment with the kids).
I can't force her to be honest.
Honesty is the dealbreaker, I want the truth, I also know that the first few attempts at the truth are going to be half-assed, half truth/half lies, I don't see her coming clean with everything during her first attempt at this.
I do sense that she is ready to tell me something and she has never been at this point before because I'm checking out at this point.
Detachment is one thing but this is another. This was something I posted a year ago, what happens when you detach too much.
I have trust issues with her, she betrayed my trust, she lies to me, she cheated on me, she has dones things to hurt me, she has been uber selfish, etc. etc. etc.
Those aren't things that can be swept under the rug and forgotten.
I don't know if atonement is the right word but seriously what actions could she do to build trust again? Consistent action,maybe? But that would take a while, we're not talking days or weeks here, we're talking months & years to rebuild this trust and I'm not sure she has it in her.
My value is sky high right now, I'm not conceited but I think she can see that I'm high value so much so that maybe attempting to scale this mountain appears to be mission impossible.
I'm not sure I want to make it easy on her even if I was to forgive her and if I have to say it, I don't want to forgive her, if forgiveness was to take place it would take a while. Saying sorry isn't enough, you can't just say sorry and continue to act poorly without regard to someone's life and your affect on it.
I'm at a point where I've been in limbo for too long, my current path is out of limbo and back to a great place for me and that's where I am right now.
My real fear is that I bring her back into my life and the same bowl of $hit soup manifests itself and I can't eat that crap again.
I'm with Steve. I completely understand wanting to know "everything" but that's not what the transparency thing is about. Steve is absolutely right; the details are far worse in the knowing than in the imagining, believe it or not. Everything written about coming back from affairs says the same thing--minimal details. yes, identity is ok.
M60 H52 D20 M14 yrs OW-old gf from 1986 bomb-5/18/08 H filed for D-9/10/08 D final 4/24/09 xH remarried (not OW) 2012
Your situation is so similar to mine, except that I only found out about the affairs this summer. She had successfully hidden/lied/deceived me for the past couple of years, while continuing to play along with the charade of being my wife. Now that I know that entire truth, at least as far as who/when (not details), I'm going through so many of the same thoughts and feelings as you. I just wish that I was further along with my detachment like you, since it's still pretty fresh for me.
Just wanted to thank you for sharing your situation and let you know that you are not alone.
Me 45 WAW 36 S8 T 15 M 12 Multiple PA's since 6/07 W moved out 10/25/09 I filed D 12/29/09 Sitch
She struggles with this because she works part-time with a schedule that isn't fixed, lives at home with her parents, her parents are really good grandparents to my kids but they are older and my kids are our younger, the kids are a handful and she ends up fighting with her parents regularly because they feel like they are doing most of the parenting when they have our kids because my wife still enjoys going out, that is however her problem to deal with, no one said life is easy, and life with children can be difficult but nothing to complain about.
New World Record - Longest sentence ever! All kidding aside, your W sounds so similar to my XW who also thrives on the attention given her in night clubs by the guys trying to score. It is an addiction. And she still gets a babysitter to go out when it is the kids weekend with her. I can almost predict that her new husband is going to encounter similar problems with her down the road.
Originally Posted By: robx
This was something I posted a year ago, what happens when you detach too much.
Simple answer - one realizes that the grass is indeed greener away from someone who continually lies.
I know this is anti-divorce busting, but my opinion remains the same based upon my own similar experience - I would divorce her and move on. There are women out who have much higher morals and honorable traits.
