new chapter with strange WAW

[v1olin]

Well, find a different person to watch your kids. Simple as that. I know you like your mother in law but I would not trust her.

[BeingMe]

Perhaps you should tell her that if she needs an article for the kids, she should ask you and you will look for it, or since her mother was in charge, she could've checked. WAW doesn't live there anymore. She moved out. And has no rights in your home anymore. How would she feel if you came over to her house and rummaged through the kids rooms looking for something? This is something that would definitely irk me. It wasn't as if this was an emergency, like homework. I say stick to your boundaries and don't worry what she thinks of you --- she's already made that clear. Also, point out that you wanted to make the puppet with D, so you would appreciate her not taking over planned projects in your house. I feel you have to be firm with her, without being mean. If you don't say anything, she'll assume she can do it again and again, perhaps?

[futureunknown]

Well, find a different person to watch your kids. Simple as that. I know you like your mother in law but I would not trust her.

Oh, I trust her, but I appreciate the situation she's in. She's not going to block her daughter from playing with her own kids, although she probably was a bit uncomfortable allowing it in my house.

She's only going to be watching the kids through the end of the school year, then I'm on my own, so I guess I won't need to worry about it any more.

[futureunknown]

Perhaps you should tell her that if she needs an article for the kids, she should ask you and you will look for it, or since her mother was in charge, she could've checked. WAW doesn't live there anymore. She moved out. And has no rights in your home anymore. How would she feel if you came over to her house and rummaged through the kids rooms looking for something? This is something that would definitely irk me. It wasn't as if this was an emergency, like homework. I say stick to your boundaries and don't worry what she thinks of you --- she's already made that clear. Also, point out that you wanted to make the puppet with D, so you would appreciate her not taking over planned projects in your house. I feel you have to be firm with her, without being mean. If you don't say anything, she'll assume she can do it again and again, perhaps?

I'm sure if I try to talk to her, she'll immediately get very defensive and aggressive, and if I persist, she'll accuse me of being hostile and mean. The problem is, I'll FEEL petty doing it. Is it petty?

[BeingMe]

No, it's not petty! Again ... how would she feel if you came and rummaged through your daughter's bedroom in her house, looking for something unimportant such as a necklace? Would you call her petty if she complained? And then, on top of that, sat there with MIL playing with the kids, completing projects she had wanted to do with them? Who knows if she kept her search only in that bedroom and didn't look around yours, wondering if she will see evidence of another woman?

I hate to say this, but you sound a little afraid of her reaction. Perhaps you should leave it be, but don't allow her to make you feel you can't set your boundaries and stand by them.

You are doing so awesome with GAL, distancing yourself emotionally, etc. so if it will affect that in any way, then don't bring it up unless it becomes a habit.

[futureunknown]

Alright folks, I need advice.

I'm thinking it's time for me to make a change. The path my W and I are on is leading to nothing but ugliness and misery for me, her, and most of all, our kids.

Given how she's been acting, maybe I should throw her a bone and ask her if she really wants this legal nightmare we're about to enter, or is something else going on. If I drop my guard and reach out, she will probably be unable to resist the opportunity to "make me suffer" a little, as in make me work before she yields, but if I just see that as the way she is I can handle it. She is not happy. I think I've proved to her that I don't need her, and that I will stand up to her and not back down.

She is so manipulative though, by her nature. Have I learned enough, detached enough, and healed enough to manage her manipulative ways? That's what I ponder. Can I withstand the potential for reattachment if I open back up? Are these little stunts she's been pulling just tests to see if she can hook me back in to control me, or her attempts to open a dialog? I have been VERY tough for the last couple months. Haven't given her an inch. If I stay on this path, and if she remains on her path, even if she eventually breaks, I might hate her so much by then that I'd be unable to find any way back.

Do I take a chance? If I don't even try, or if I do and fail, either way I'm going to have to go on the legal offensive now, so what do I have to lose?

[futureunknown]

No, it's not petty! Again ... how would she feel if you came and rummaged through your daughter's bedroom in her house, looking for something unimportant such as a necklace? Would you call her petty if she complained? And then, on top of that, sat there with MIL playing with the kids, completing projects she had wanted to do with them? Who knows if she kept her search only in that bedroom and didn't look around yours, wondering if she will see evidence of another woman?

Yeah, that occurred to me as well. Did she look around elsewhere in the house too? Of course the question is, why would she look for evidence of another woman? Does she care?

I hate to say this, but you sound a little afraid of her reaction. Perhaps you should leave it be, but don't allow her to make you feel you can't set your boundaries and stand by them.

I'm just continually amazed at her gall, and it seems ridiculous that I need to point this stuff out to her. If I bring it up she'll say something like "What was I supposed to do? D5 asked me to do her sock puppet with her. Should I have said no?" How about "Sweetie, that's something Daddy bought for you. Why don't you save it to do with him?"

Regarding her being in my house, I have to be careful there. I don't want to put my MIL in the middle. She obviously invited W into the house, so I don't want her to feel like she betrayed me. She has been so good to me. Anything I say to W about it will immediately be relayed to MIL.

You are doing so awesome with GAL, distancing yourself emotionally, etc. so if it will affect that in any way, then don't bring it up unless it becomes a habit.

Thanks. I think so too. Along the lines of my prior post, if I do bring it up, maybe it should be in the context of trying to get her to open up about everything, and not as a challenge to her crossing a boundary. Ask her why she wants to come into my house and do an art project I bought for the kids? Seems so odd, along with other things she's doing.

[BeingMe]

You know your WAW best, but I would suspect she might want to see if another woman is sleeping there while the children are in the house, as a weapon against you legally? I know, she won't see the hypocrisy in that. I get the impression that your WAW goes over the top, to unbalance those she is attacking. Most people would be happy to have an amiable divorce with 50/50 child custody. But not her.

She doesn't seem to want to do things the easy way ... she wants you grovelling, without the children, for whatever reason. There's an itch there that she just wants scratched, and you're the post she's gonna do it on. (Think about her first husband and how she treated him during the D.)

Normally, I would say, yes, go for it. See what the problem is that caused her to suddenly try for full custody. Seek a friendly D with 50/50 custody. But, I think we all know why she's doing it .... she wants to take the children out of the country and she is resentful of you standing in the way, IMHO. She's throwing the dice, gambling with the possibility that she may win, and if she doesn't, nothing is lost (unless you sue for full custody, and she knows you are a reasonable person, who likely won't do that to her or the children.) I'm just not sure whether you will find out anything, and she won't capitulate unless she gets something out of it .... passports for the children and agreement to let them out of the country. I doubt if she will show her hand ... only what she wants you to see.

Remember that this is someone who feels no guilt over having an affair. You were not an evil H who beat her, isolated her, had multiple affairs. You tried to make her happy, and you love your children and you are a good dad. There is nothing she can say that justifies the A. And there is nothing she can say that justifies her having full custody of the children. If anything, you have more justification for that than she does, and she is lucky that you are a good man and don't want to deprive the kids of their mother. You just have to realize that she doesn't think the same way you do.

But, I end with what I began with ... you know her best. Only you can decide what the best course of action is. If you do approach her, I would make sure there is evidence, i.e. send an email and hope for a reply, or a letter (and make a copy), or have a witness present, so that you can show you tried to make it work outside the court system.

Take care.

[futureunknown]

Here is what happened this morning.

Our son and youngest daughter ad their annual checkups today. W and I have always both gone in the past, and given what’s going on, I particularly didn’t want to change that, so I went. W didn’t know I was coming, and she seemed a bit surprised. Our walls were up completely, and we barely spoke or looked at each other.

Our son's eye test was borderline, and it looks like he’s going to need glasses. He was upset about that, and we were both trying to console him. That made a tiny hole through the walls.

Then our daughter had to have three immunization shots, and she threw an absolute fit. She was screaming, and flailing around, and W and I both had to hold her down and try to help her. After it was done I got a little choked up, and my wall was definitely weakening a bit more.

On the way out W asked if I wanted to go to lunch with them. She didn’t have her swagger going, like she was flirting with me, or doing me some big favor, or manipulating me. She seemed very sincere. I said okay.

We met at a fast food place nearby. The kids had a fight over who could sit next to me, and W finally switched to a six person table so they could sit on either side of me and she sat on the other side by herself. She asked me how my job was going, and for the first time in months I actually chatted with her a little, but my guard was still WAY up. We had a nice lunch with the kids.

As we got up to leave she looked at me and with sadness asked “So how are you?” I said “I’m fine. How are you?” She said “I’m good", but she didn't say it like she was good.

We walked out to our cars. I helped get the kids loaded into her van. We were both on the passenger side, and after our daughter was buckled in we both started to walk over to her driver’s side, since my car was on that side. At the back of her van we stopped and looked at each other. She took her sunglasses off. She looked sad. I softly said “Hey.” She said “Hey.” I moved toward her until our faces were about two feet apart. It wasn’t any kind of flirtatious thing, we were dead serious, and I wanted to send a signal that my wall was coming down a bit. She stood her ground and we looked into each others’ eyes for a few moments. She asked “Hate it?” I slightly nodded and said “You?” She looked very sad and nodded and said “Yeah.” I asked “Wanna talk?” She said “Yeah.” I said “Okay” then I reached my arms out and hugged her. She wrapped her arms around me and held me tight for a good long while. We let go and I got in my car and drove away.

So let’s see. A grand total of ten words were spoken. By far the highest meaning/word ratio conversation I’ve ever had.

For the first time in YEARS, it was finally an even playing field. She had no swagger in her demeanor at all, and I had no longing in mine.

The whole thing took me by surprise, and now I don’t know what to do, if anything. I guess I should set up a time with her to get together to talk. About what I’m not exactly sure.

[BeingMe]

Wow! Looks like something positive and sounded so romantic (could it be that). If you do meet, I would advise letting her do most of the talking/explaining. I can't imagine you have a lot to say, so that leaves listening --- active listening. She knows now that you have nothing to lose and don't seem that eager to gain her back. So, watch out for the "what I can't have, I want most of all" syndrome, or "I'm lonely, let's be buddies." I would guess that you are the best friend she ever had, setting the marriage aside plus she knows that no-one can ever be the dad you are to the children equals "what the heck have I thrown away?" But, she might not want to admit that. And, that still leaves the lack of guilt over the A, and any feelings she may or may not have for you.

But, I am getting ahead here --- who knows what she would want to talk about? As I said before, this is a positive step and I hope it's good for you and the kids.