How To Tell The Kids

[DanF]

Thanks guys.

Based on discussions with my attorney, the court wasn't likely to make her find full-time work immediately, since she has been working part-time for 11 years. If we are going to continue to live in the same house, things would remain the same as they have been. She said that full-time would come eventually, but not immediately. Also, since I make so much more $ than W does, the plan would likely to have been to pay based on income percentages. I make 80% of the income, she makes 20% of the income. If she worked full-time, she would make 30% of the income.

Also, we can't "force" each other out of the house. I told my atty we should request that, but she said the court wasn't likely to foce the mother out, and if they did, I would end-up with a very large financial obligation based on W working part-time at the moment. I have asked her to leave voluntarily, but she won't, and I have been advised here and by many others not to leave the house.

I was going to ask W for her suggestion as to how to handle the bills, hoping it would be better for me than income % based, but in the very least I was going to require that we pay based on income percentages.

I would love to split the bills 50%/50%, but I don't think that is realistic or that is what the court would have ordered. Once separated, I am looking at payments for both child support 9 years and alimony/maintenance 5-7 years. I certainly do want her to pay her share and not to have $ to blow on so many events though.

She says she wants to live together until the divorce is final because we can't afford to live separate. If that is so, how will we be able to afford it later? It is becuase she won't get a full-time job now, because she wants this done on her time and in her way. She wants a D, she just does not want the consequences of it right now.

She has told me she plans to get a full time job, but can't do it now because "there are no full-time positions available" in her preferred location/line of work and because she "needs to be there for the kids." I said we both need to be there for the kids. The fact is, she wants her part-time summer with the kids and it doesn't look like the court will force it. I can't find a way to force her to go back to work except to get her to pay more of the bills so she doesn't have fun time $. I continue to look for job postings available to her on the state jobs website. You can bet I will bring it to my atty when I find one.

You are right about saving $ bluestar, but if I save it, she will just get half of it anyway, right? Plus, she continues to spend, but I am not going to stand for this anymore.

I really wish this court date had gone off and we had gotten some legal clarity.

I'll have to think about the kid thing. So I would just go along on whatever events get planned? Like to her brother's house to visit the cousins next weekend? Hmmm......

Thanks again for the advice.

[Ready2Change]

I also ask my W if she want to do something that I have planned for me and the kids, I never exclude her. She never includes me. Now, if we are doing something, I may say, "I'm taking the kids swimming at such and such, you're welcome to come." I then keep walking out the door, not waiting for her to say yes or no. It doesn't matter. Last week, I had made plans for the 4th and she said she would come. Then she said she was coming to help keep an eye on the kids. I said I didn't need any help, you can just stay home. Screw her. I can handle the kids just fine and we always have a good time. There is no yelling and screaming, we have fun and play and relax.

As far as continuing to ask, IDK. I guess I do let her know what we are doing but I don't care if she comes or not. Do you know what I mean? It doesn't affect me one way or the other. Yes, the kids notice, but they also notice that she never asks me. Just one more thing for them to adjust to. I guess I try to ask in a way that I don't really need an answer. Me and the kids are going, she know she can come if she wants.

Stay strong and continue doing the hard work. Be the better person.

Wise words.....let her miss you...The kids talk anyways, so give them good times to talk about.....

[Ready2Change]

Hi Dan,

The things that work go against your natural instinct. I hope you don't mind, but here are my thoughts:

Based on discussions with my attorney

Listen to him, but with the understanding that he is out to make a buck from your emotional distress. the more you and W argue, the more money he makes....Know what you want and have him fight for it...IE 50/50 custody of your kids.

the court wasn't likely to make her find full-time work immediately, since she has been working part-time for 11 years.

Well things are changing....

If we are going to continue to live in the same house, things would remain the same as they have been.

I would reevaluate this. This is a time for you to LEAD your family. Things are different now. BE DIFFERENT.

She said that full-time would come eventually, but not immediately.

Tell me the db rule about what they say.....

Also, since I make so much more $ than W does, the plan would likely to have been to pay based on income percentages. I make 80% of the income, she makes 20% of the income. If she worked full-time, she would make 30% of the income.

Perfect! You have decided to cover 70% of the bills and expect W to cover 30%. You could even start at 60/40... "W, I have decided to pay the Morgage, and the XYZ bills. I expect you to pay for the ABC bills and to see proof that you paid them. This is fair based on the differences in money we bring in."

Also, we can't "force" each other out of the house.

"I have no intentions of leaving our families home. You are free to decide if you want to stay here with us."

I told my atty we should request that, but she said the court wasn't likely to force the mother out, and if they did, I would end-up with a very large financial obligation based on W working part-time at the moment. I have asked her to leave voluntarily, but she won't, and I have been advised here and by many others not to leave the house.

Who wants out her or you? Do you want the house or not?

I was going to ask W for her suggestion as to how to handle the bills, hoping it would be better for me than income % based, but in the very least I was going to require that we pay based on income percentages.

What is the right thing to do? Pay your fair share....

I would love to split the bills 50%/50%,

Ask for what you want. let her counter. respond with "I'll think about that"

but I don't think that is realistic or that is what the court would have ordered. Once separated, I am looking at payments for both child support 9 years and alimony/maintenance 5-7 years.

Are you fighting for joint custody? Your R with the kids is very important. Frequent and equal as W.

She says she wants to live together until the divorce is final because we can't afford to live separate.

Shine and lead. Be confident, happy and decisive....Be the BEST DAD EVER.....

She has told me she plans to get a full time job, but can't do it now because "there are no full-time positions available" in her preferred location/line of work

Let your L know this. She sounds fully capable of working...

and because she "needs to be there for the kids."

Are you going to be there for the kids??? Best choice I made was to fight for my 50/50 parenting agreement.

I said we both need to be there for the kids. The fact is, she wants her part-time summer with the kids and it doesn't look like the court will force it. I can't find a way to force her to go back to work except to get her to pay more of the bills so she doesn't have fun time $.

PERFECT.

I really wish this court date had gone off and we had gotten some legal clarity.

Set precedence NOW! Get things in place and say "This is working fine"....

So I would just go along on whatever events get planned? Like to her brother's house to visit the cousins next weekend?

NO! you LEAD. I am going to the beach with the kids. I am going to the fair with the kids. I am going to the swimming pool woth the kids. I am going skiing with the kids....."Kids, ready to have FUN!!! "

Thanks again for the advice.

I would like to strongly suggest that you search PuppyDogTails, Gucci, Coach, Sandi2,Allen A and Greek and read all the posts they have made in the last week......It just might save your M.

[DanF]

Hi Dan,

The things that work go against your natural instinct. I hope you don't mind, but here are my thoughts:

I don't mind in the least. In fact, I couldn't appreciate it more!

Based on discussions with my attorney

Listen to him, but with the understanding that he is out to make a buck from your emotional distress. the more you and W argue, the more money he makes....Know what you want and have him fight for it...IE 50/50 custody of your kids.

My attorney says she will do what I ask of her. We are definately going for 50%/50% and it sounds like W is accepting that now. At least in her conversations with our kids.

the court wasn't likely to make her find full-time work immediately, since she has been working part-time for 11 years.

Well things are changing....

Things ARE changing and it is likely they will require her to work full-time, just not right away. They will give her time to find a position. We are also going to argue that she should have a higher level job given her 20 years of experience. She is in an entry level position and never wanted to take a promotion or becomse a supervisor because she didn't want to have to deal with the politics and headaches that come with it. I supported that while we were married, but shouldn't have to support it any longer. I got her supervisor's salary and recalculated payments using it as my W's salary. May not hold in court, but at least I am trying.

If we are going to continue to live in the same house, things would remain the same as they have been.

I would reevaluate this. This is a time for you to LEAD your family. Things are different now. BE DIFFERENT.

I meant financially here, but you are giving me good advice in terms of leading the family. I will start to be more demanding here.

She said that full-time would come eventually, but not immediately.

Tell me the db rule about what they say.....

Time to put on the Big Girl Panties....and I agree with you, but I can't make her go back and I have to make sure at least the critical bills are paid, such as the mortgage and utilities. Maybe I let her pay cable and things that aren't necessities?

Also, since I make so much more $ than W does, the plan would likely to have been to pay based on income percentages. I make 80% of the income, she makes 20% of the income. If she worked full-time, she would make 30% of the income.

Perfect! You have decided to cover 70% of the bills and expect W to cover 30%. You could even start at 60/40... "W, I have decided to pay the Morgage, and the XYZ bills. I expect you to pay for the ABC bills and to see proof that you paid them. This is fair based on the differences in money we bring in."

Also, we can't "force" each other out of the house.

"I have no intentions of leaving our families home. You are free to decide if you want to stay here with us."

I am with you on this one and have told her I am not leaving. Her atty wanted to request me out of the house, but she said she had the atty remove that language from the petition because "we can't afford it". There is no more we, right?

I told my atty we should request that, but she said the court wasn't likely to force the mother out, and if they did, I would end-up with a very large financial obligation based on W working part-time at the moment. I have asked her to leave voluntarily, but she won't, and I have been advised here and by many others not to leave the house.

Who wants out her or you? Do you want the house or not?

I do want the house, but we have to see what we can agree to in terms of a bouy-out. I can't afford a much larger payment on my own as we stretched to buy this place together. We won't get what we have into it, but our equity may still be too much for me to overcome. I hope not.

I was going to ask W for her suggestion as to how to handle the bills, hoping it would be better for me than income % based, but in the very least I was going to require that we pay based on income percentages.

What is the right thing to do? Pay your fair share....

Is fair 50/50, 60/40, 70/30 or 80/20? Right now atty says that court would say 80/20 and 70/30 later after she goes full time at the end of the proceedings. I was going to let her make a suggestion that I hoped would be more favorable to me.

I would love to split the bills 50%/50%,

Ask for what you want. let her counter. respond with "I'll think about that"

but I don't think that is realistic or that is what the court would have ordered. Once separated, I am looking at payments for both child support 9 years and alimony/maintenance 5-7 years.

Are you fighting for joint custody? Your R with the kids is very important. Frequent and equal as W.

We will do 50/50 split on the kids, but according to the formula, I will still have to pay child support because I make so much more $. Even if we get to use full-time and a promoted position for her. This is all working against me right now because I have been too successful.

She says she wants to live together until the divorce is final because we can't afford to live separate.

Shine and lead. Be confident, happy and decisive....Be the BEST DAD EVER.....

She has told me she plans to get a full time job, but can't do it now because "there are no full-time positions available" in her preferred location/line of work

Let your L know this. She sounds fully capable of working...

She definately is capable.

and because she "needs to be there for the kids."

Are you going to be there for the kids??? Best choice I made was to fight for my 50/50 parenting agreement.

I said we both need to be there for the kids. The fact is, she wants her part-time summer with the kids and it doesn't look like the court will force it. I can't find a way to force her to go back to work except to get her to pay more of the bills so she doesn't have fun time $.

PERFECT.

I really wish this court date had gone off and we had gotten some legal clarity.

Set precedence NOW! Get things in place and say "This is working fine"....

So I would just go along on whatever events get planned? Like to her brother's house to visit the cousins next weekend?

NO! you LEAD. I am going to the beach with the kids. I am going to the fair with the kids. I am going to the swimming pool woth the kids. I am going skiing with the kids....."Kids, ready to have FUN!!! "

Been doing a lot more of this, but will try harder going forward.

Thanks again for the advice.

I would like to strongly suggest that you search PuppyDogTails, Gucci, Coach, Sandi2,Allen A and Greek and read all the posts they have made in the last week......It just might save your M.

All their advice to everyone? Or just to me? I want to do whatever it takes to get this M saved.

Thanks again for everyone's help.

[DanF]

The money conversation:

So last night W gets home after taking the kids and 2 of their friends to Great America theme park yesterday. All the kids tickets were free or paid for by their parents.

The kids were very excited and I was excited with them. The park was not very busy and they got to go on a lot of rides, including the rollercoasters, which usually have long lines.

W is in a very good mood and starts telling me all about it. Then she gets into the fact that one of the kids didn't have any of her own money to spend, so W ended up buying everything for her, which was ok at first, but this girl then complained about everything she was given....ALL DAY LONG. She always wanted the upgrade, bigger sandwich, bigger ice cream, etc. I showed empathy for her and decided that I wouldn't bring up the $ issue that night. She told me that she spent at least $25 on this friend. I imagine that she spent about that on all the kids. Again, we can't afford to live separate, but we can spend all kinds of money on entertainment, even for other people's kids!

So this morning, I am going down the stairs and she asks me write a check to pay the babysitter. I said, "ok, but since our court date has been delayed, I would like to come to some kind of agreement as to how the bills are going to be split going forward. 50/50 works for me."

W: I can't pay 50% of the bills.

Me: OK, make a proposal as to what you can pay.

Then she started to get heated and loud.

W: I'm not talking about this. You are just doing this because you are mad!

Me: No, I am just tired of financing all of your entertainment. I have been paying all the bills and you need to start paying your share.

W: You haven't been paying all the bills. I paid the cable bill and bought groceries and have been running out to buy coke.

Me: I've paid for your car repairs, insurance, utilities, furniture, electronics, mortgage, etc., etc.

Me: Ok, let's write it all down going forward and keep track of it.

W: Ok, well then I'm getting the court date moved up.

Me: Good. I wanted this to go today. Get it moved up!

W: I can't pay 50% and you know, I don't get paid for the work I do around here.

Missed a chance to tell her that she needs to get a job that she gets paid for then! Go full time!!

Me: Ok, make a proposal on what you can afford. 60/40? 70/30? I'm not paying the mortgage until we have an agreement in place and you pay your share.

W: Ok, then let's not pay any of the bills.

Me: Ok.

W: You are the finance whiz. You can probably figure out what I can afford to pay.

Me: It is not my job to figure out how to finance your divorce. What was your attorney going to propose today?

W: I don't know.

Me: That is part of the problem.

W: So you are saying you are not going to pay the mortgage?

Me: Not until we have an agreement in place.

Later she is in the kitchen with me and says something about me moving out. I said, you are the one who wants the divorce, you move out. She said I'm not going anywhere and goes back upstairs to finish getting ready for work.

Before I leave for work, I go upstairs and say, "I didn't meant to yell about this stuff, but you got all belligerent with me. All I want is an agreement on what we are each going to pay, similar to what we would have gotten in court today. Think about it today and we can talk tonight."

W says - "are you going to write a check for the babysitter then ($80). So I say yes. She says, "Ok, then you can take $30 out of my purse. So I did.

When I left she was still upstairs and I said "Bye." She also said bye.

She is going to stew on this all day and it is going to eat her-up.

[dday101798]

W: I'm not talking about this. You are just doing this because you are mad!

hmmmm, remember that day you coughed up your SSN# and vitals?

[idontunderstand]

Sounds like you handled it pretty well. Just remember(and it's hard to in the heat of the moment, I know) to not raise your voice; calm, cool and confident. It's business, not personal. Let her feel the financial hardships.

Keep it up! Don't roll over for her anymore. She will have to respect what you are doing. I'm sure she won't like it but who cares? She will respect it and that's a good thing.

[Coach]

W: I'm not talking about this. You are just doing this because you are mad!

I hope all you guys see how this mind reading is used to control you. She tells you how you think and feel.

"No wife I am not mad. I am doing this because it's what divorcing couples do."

Let the brutal reality hit her.

[bluestar]

BTW Dan, we can't afford to live separately really should read SHE can't afford it. I also don't think she realizes if you move out, you don't have to pay the mortage after a certain point. She'd be on her own with that.

She hasn't discussed this with her L, really? I don't think so. She just wants it all her way and thought you were playing along.

[Ready2Change]

I would like to strongly suggest that you search PuppyDogTails, Gucci, Coach, Sandi2,Allen A and Greek and read ALL the posts they have made in the last week......It just might save your M.

All the posts to everyone. If you read and disect their posts from the last week, go back a week earlier. Knowing how to respond BEFORE you need to helps a lot. I have put some of their gems of wisdom in the quotes thread.