the explanation and examples helped. sometimes i read advice about how one should be 'actively listening' and i hadn't a clue what that meant.
i'm usually the one who tries to logically reason with the other person. so this is something i really need to work on.
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What is it they are really saying? Are they trying to tell you how they feel?
how do i know when my answers to the above questions are due to 'mind-reading'?
R2C - sorry for the mini-hijack. i think greek's explanation deserved to be sticky-ed here. i hope it helps others who don't know what active listening is.
how do i know when my answers to the above questions are due to 'mind-reading'?
Not asking you to read minds. I gave you an example for a reason.
In the example, the child says "I wish mom were here".
Now, you could argue with the child and say, "Mom cannot be here" and invalidate what the child is trying to tell you which is "I wish she were [I miss mom]", or you could validate "I know you do, and I wish she were too", and the child sees you understand. You have communicated.
The idea is to listen more objectively. People will tell you all of the time how they feel indirectly. If you try to fix them or argue or reason, you basically invalidate them. If you are really listening, you will see they are just trying to tell you how they feel however.
You have to stop making your whole experience about YOU for a minute, and just listen to them. If you filter everything people say through your own experience, you miss a lot, and if you aren't paying attention because you are too focused on you, that doesn't work either.
It isn't that hard, but it takes practice. Con men can do it. So can you
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i'm usually the one who tries to logically reason with the other person. so this is something i really need to work on.
There you go. You can do it. Just stop trying to fix things, teach, and reason Let people share their experiences without trying to influence them.
Don't feel too badly about doing what you have done. I don't have any statistics on-hand, but I routinely get reasoning and how-to-fix that responses from people when I tell them how I feel, so I would say active listening isn't the norm. It's the exception.
Be exceptional
Last edited by TimeHeals; 09/15/1011:23 AM.
M-47,W-40,No kids D-filed 5/27/2010 Piecing - 10/21/2010 -=Soon to be banned=-
It's more "redirecting" your emotions by thinking of something more pleasant...
It's not that at all. It's thinking through why you feel a certain way, understanding it then challenging that thinking to find a better outcome. Once you think of possibilities your mind get's off the hopeless loop.
Read up on Aaron Beck, Albert Ellis and Martin Seligman.
"What is best for my kids is best for me" Amor Fati Link to quotes: https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2879712
Having hobbies and going out a few times a week aren't real issues.
If you aren't allowed to go out for an hour every other day to the gym or some other activity, what kind of life will you have where you just get to go to work, go home, pay bills, take care of the kids and then go to bed, wash rinse repeat, day in and day out?!
Her yelling at you in public, "...she cursed me out in the middle of the street in front of our friends while holding our son. I was so devastated."
Telling you how $hitty you are, telling your parents and everyone else how pathetic you are, it's abuse, plain & simple.
You have a victim mentality and you don't realize it.
You keep trying to do more & more to please her, and she keeps treating you even more poorly for it. It confuses you, no matter what you do, you can't make her happy and that is your first lesson in all of this, you can't make her happy. No one can make someone else "happy", you can add to another person's happiness but you can't make them "happy".
Happiness is a DIY job.
She has an anger problem, she is extremely abusive, she is never happy, she is never satisfied with anything, no matter how hard you try to please her, you work hard to gain her favor and approval, you've moved out of the home to give her "space" and hopefully she'll want to be with you again.
How is any of this working for you so far?
Positive results?
Nope.
Keep doing this stuff, I guarantee more of the same crap behavior from her.
Here is my advice:
Move back home.
When she throws a $hit tantrum, let her explode, you remain calm during all of this. Then tell her that you don't want to be married to her anymore, she treats you poorly, doesn't appreciate anything you do, no matter what you do, you can't make her happy because she doesn't want to be happy, she would prefer to be angry and bully you constantly and be abusive to you. Tell her you will look into selling the house, splitting up your assets and filing for joint custody of your kid and then you will file for divorce. She can be free from you and you will be free from her and her abusive ways. Tell her that if she doesn't like that you moved back home (your home as well as hers, moving out to give a spouse "space" NEVER WORKS!), she is free to move out and live somewhere else.
This is what I would do.
You don't have the guts to do this yet and I understand why, you've been abused for so long, you feel weak in comparison to your wife, she has all the power and that's part of what killed the attraction in your relationship, you don't act like a man, she acts more like a man than you do, you are more feminine than she is. I bet you are quiet, soft spoken, don't complain much when people abuse or hurt you or take advantage of you, you probably just shrug your shoulders because you are used to that kind of treatment. You are a nice guy, you really sound like one, helping common friends, having innocent hobbies, being a family man, working hard, not asking much for yourself, afraid to initiate sex because you are afraid that you will bother your wife which is probably what happens with most other things that the two of you interact on, you have an opinion, she has an opinion, she wins, you offer no challenge whatsoever. You work hard at work and then come home, take on the bulk of the household chores, cooking, cleaning, etc. and it's still never enough.
Newsflash...
It will never be enough.
You can't please an angry person that is used to treating you horribly. The only thing you can do in this situation if you have any hope of turning your marriage & relationship around is to stand up for yourself, turn that mouse into a man and stand up for yourself for once in your life.
Your wife doesn't respect you and she doesn't love you. Regardless of the few morsels and crumbs she throws your way with a txt or spoken word, she doesn't love you. If she does love you, it's not the right kind of love. If you love someone would you tell them how $hitty they are constantly? Would you contact their family and tell them the same? Would you yell at them and curse at them in public in front of other people showing everyone how little you value them? Would you be constantly abusive always demanding more and more and more of your spouse while offering nothing in return? Would you tell your spouse that they have to go work full time and then come home take care of every household task and that they are not allowed to go out for an hour every other day?
No you wouldn't.
You're too much of a nice guy.
Doing all of the above, that's how you would treat an enemy or a prisoner. That's the successful way to abuse someone for years & years and train them to believe that they are bad, train them to never question the bad treatment and just accept it.
It's horrible.
Your wife doesn't respect you because you don't respect yourself enough to stand up for yourself. If you can't stand up for yourself, if you can't stand up to her, how could you ever be expected to stand up for her should the need ever arise to protect her and your family. I'm sure you would but you've pretty much convinced your wife and me at this point that you don't have a lot of self-respect, no one with a healthy amount of self-respect and self-esteem would allow someone to walk all over them the way you allow her to.
If you wife can't respect you, she can't love you. Plain & simple.
The advice I've given is counter-intuitive, it goes against everything you FEEL you should be doing which is continuing to kiss her a$$, take her abuse, move out, supplicate her, etc. etc. etc.
Unfortunately continuing to do what you've done in the past is going to get you the same results over & over again. Could you really live like this for the rest of your life? Are you willing to set this example for your children who will learn by watching you to accept the same kind of treatment and abuse from their spouse when they're in the same situation. If not for you, do it for your kid.
This is my advice, given freely, not forced on you, in the end it's your life, you have to choose to do what's best for you, you have to determine the value of your own life and how much it's worth to you and how much you can tolerate for the rest of your life. Your situation will only change when you decide that you really want it to change and when you decide to start doing things differently to get different results.
Good luck bro ;-)
Originally Posted By: robx
one other thing, this isn't about you having hobbies, this isn't about your wife having hobbies, this has to do with sexual polarity being switched between the two of you, her being more masculine and you being more feminine, this has to do with her being abusive and no one standing up to her: not you, her family, your family, no one, everyone pretty much gets beat up by her because everyone lets her.
Originally Posted By: Coach
You would be wise to go back and read what Rob posted. If you don't understand then ask or do your homework.
Coach and Robx are wise men...I strongly suggest listening to their words....
"What is best for my kids is best for me" Amor Fati Link to quotes: https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2879712
