I have never asserted that HD partners have things figured out. I have asserted that as the HD partner I have taken efforts and in some ways extraordinary efforts to sort this out.
I have also asserted, many times, that a primary problem to deal with is taking what is said (and the actions associated with the words) and interpreting in a different way and then acting upon the interpretation, in this case your interpretation, as if it were the TRUTH rather than the words and/or actions themselves.
I was very clear in my suggestion that it came from my perspective/experience and if I am aware of that (and you are not or more conveniently left that out) which of us is dealing with reality?
You claim I am "hurting people" with no evidence to justify your position (which fundamentally incorrect to begin with since you make an asserion about my view of HD people). If your partner is reading what I write and then telling you "see, he get's it and you don't" I can see where what I write could be interpreted as hurting you directly. If that is what is going on, then address that.
If you wish me to just shut up, then be honest and say so and own up to it. Don't dress it up behind some interpretation of your own imagination. That IS behavior I have observed before, regardless of whether someone may be classified as HD or LD, and I have said so.
The Captain
Last sex: 04/06/1997 Last attempt: 11/11/1997 W Issues "No Means No" Declaration: 11/11/1997 W chooses to terminate sex 05/1998 I gained 60, then lost 85 pounds. Start running again (marathons)
I think it would be worth rereading what SO Bear has written, without dismissing it out of hand. I find all his writings to be compassionate, helpful and objective. It would probably be worth looking at why you feel compelled to shoot him down.
I have also found that some of the posters on the SSM forum are intrenched in their bitterness against the LD partner that they have mind-read them into being extremely and even sadistically happy with their half-marriages. Attempts to project this onto other SSM spouses seems like an attempt to promote defeatism.
I have observed that in every case where the HD spouse managed to break through the LD spouses defences, they discovered that the LD spouse was hurting just as much as they were.
"Margali, it's not about hanging in without fighting, and it's not about getting used to anything. It's about facing the fight head on, admitting to yourself what the stakes are, and steadfastly defending your own integrity. It's about not giving up and accepting a false choice limited to either sacrificing your integrity so you can accept a sexless marriage on the one hand or pre-emptively walking out because 'it shouldn't be this hard' on the other."
Well, I'm not ready to walk out. I still love him, and I don't think anyone else would ever suit me as well. But I'm not sure how to solve problems that involve both of us, without talking about it. And he hates it when I talk about it. That just makes it worse.
So, realizing that talking about it just makes it worse, I've tried doing a 180 (backing off from him), giving him space, and reading some of these books that everyone keeps suggesting. I'm still waiting for something to actually work.
SillyOld:
"[Captain], you keep insisting that the HD partner has everything figured out and knows what goes on in the LD partner's head."
Ha! If only. I have no idea what's going on in his head. I don't understand LD people at all. They might as well be space aliens.
"[Captain], maybe Margali's husband (and your wife) really are just bad, shallow people who only care about appearances and are willing to hurt her (and you) as much as it takes to have the appearances without loving sex...."
I don't believe this. I do know my DH well enough to know that he would hate, hate, hate the idea of hurting anybody on purpose. He's very tenderhearted.
No, I really think there must be something wrong with me. Either long relationships just get this way, and I'm being childish by expecting anything else; or something about me is putting him off me sexually.
You're still accepting a false dichotomy. You and your husband have a problem to solve. That doesn't require you to decide that it's a problem with him or a problem with you. It's a problem you share.
I know how frustrating it is that he seems not to care, or that he seems to think everything is OK the way it is. All you can do is show, not tell. If he won't talk about it, just go on without him. Follow your plan and get a life. Do what you think is right, with him if he wants to join you, or without him if he doesn't.
Yes, eventually he will face a choice and have to decide whether he is willing to be left behind that way, and he may decide to leave, and he may decide to stay just the way he is and try to outlast you. At that point, you will have your own tough choice to make. But what if he decides that the way you're living your life is attractive and he wants in on it?
In a way, it's about acknowledging your limitations. We want a way to make these people fall in love with us the way we understand love, but we don't have the power to do that. We don't that level of control over the world. We have to make good lives for ourselves and then, if we still want to share our lives with our spouses, they have to choose whether to share them with us.
The only thing that I would add is that sometimes by GAL, we can serve as a role model to our spouse to let them see that change is possible even for them. As you point out, if your GAL makes you interesting to your spouse it can also become a magnet that helps make them want to follow you.
>43 years of marriage--My wife and I are now closer than we have been in decades. I believe that my SSM is over.
OK, I will go back and redouble my efforts at GAL. FWIW, I've been having some painful issues w/ my family lately, so I'm feeling more needy than usual.
Luckily, my job is a good resource for me so I don't become too needy or dependent on DH for getting affirmation.
Update: I'm feeling a lot of emotional pain right now. Last night after dinner, DH wanted to cuddle and kiss on the couch, which is often the precursor to sex. Also, he's spent the past almost-a-week being more loving than usual (more compliments, cuddling, better kissing, that happy look on his face, etc.)
Anyway, after we'd cuddled a while and I was starting to feel encouraged, he gently told me he just didn't feel like it tonight (he had sensed I was believing we were leading up to it). He added that he had been in the mood on Tuesday night, but I was late getting home from work.
I then said if I'd known he was in the mood Tuesday, I would have made a better effort to get home earlier. He then said I should get home on time anyway for better balance, not just bcs we're going to have sex.
I can't help feeling like last night, he was punishing me for being late on Tues. by acting the way he normally does to start sex, then stopping it.
We haven't done it since Aug. 31. The best thing I have for him is the thing he doesn't seem to want. Sometimes he gets in bad moods over things that have been happening in his family. Lately, I've been having some bad things happen in my family, too; and I've been very unhappy about it. For me, sex would be a comfort - it would make everything all better. Probably for him, when he's unhappy, that's the last thing he wants. I can respect that, and I don't pester him when he's bumming about his family.
Not really asking for advice here; I know what I need to do (GAL, 180, read all the damn books [g], etc.) I'm feeling very hurt and sad and confused, and I just need to vent.
Is it possible that your DH is not trying to punish you for coming home late, but choosing a safe time to tell you that he does occassionally experience sexual feelings? Also, coming from the perspective of being the lower desire spouse, is it possible that he feels too much stress about your sexual relationship and finds the cuddling to be most comforting or a stepping stone right now? As an outsider, it appears that the cuddling and kissing are a good thing and I hope for you that he is trying to find his way to engage in a more sexual relationship.
I know it hurts. I wish it didn't . . . but the hurt is a message that something's wrong.
First, you're right not to pester him, of course, but you can tell him how you feel. If you feel like you're being punished for coming home late, you can talk to him about that. It might not solve the problem, but you won't have to carry it around alone. If I were taking wild guesses (and I am!) I would say he probably didn't intend to say anything about you being late. He probably started out to tell you as nicely as he could that he wasn't in the mood, thinking he was going to do the right thing and be honest . . . he probably had the best of intentions. But because he was still carrying some resentment from you being late the night before, once he got rolling it had to come out. Part of him probably feels bad about bringing it out the way he did, and part of him is probably proud of saying something.
Now it's your turn to pick a better moment than he did and tell him how you feel about this. I know you weren't asking for advice, but that's my advice. You're the one in the situation, so if you don't follow it, it's probably because you see something I don't.
I'm glad you're venting here. This is a safe place to talk about these feelings with other people who have them, too.
If you do talk to him about how you feel, don't forget to talk about how much you like the cuddling and kisses. He needs to understand that you're talking about how you feel, not about whether he's a bad guy or how much he screws up.
And don't forget that there are people out here who don't know who you are or where you live, but are pulling for you both and thinking about you both.
