I guess its MLC-new need advice 6 months in

[25yearsmlc]

I feel I have life2.

I know I tried.

Sorry if that's not clear.

[beatrice]

MLC I am not sure it is about 'blame' but about understanding what we did contribute to and what we didn't. No point beating ourselves up about things we cannot change or alter.

I am not perfect, Lord knows - people who need to be right or perfect have their own problems.

An index for me is the depth of alienation that has taken place with his [adult] children. Up until 6 years ago he loved them and they were the centre of his life, and then quite suddenly he appeared not to care for them at all. He did go on loving them but stopped acting as if he did. They have all tried, and I have encouraged them to go on having a relationship with their father, but it has been impossible [not difficult, plain impossible] for a long time. Slowly that appears to be changing on his part, but it is a long slow process.

They were there, and they saw the huge change that took place in their father. I really really questioned whether it was a MLC and I have come to the view that it is.

Sorry for the threadjack

[25yearsmlc]

Spoke with H. Convo about bills. I asked what the plan was. I have kids at home crying wondering when they were going to see him, etc. I suppose not a good excuse but I did it.

And how's that workin' for ya?

He said if he knew what he wanted he would have done that by now.

Believe him. Act as if this is true.

After talking for awhile-he says he thinks its best if we are done. I said so there is nothing more to say? He said you seem to think so. I said no I am asking you. He said yes lets get together today or tomorrow. H will call me.

Are you trying to talk him in or out of this M? Seriously. Stop talking. Start listening.

He brought up he can't be forgiven for OW. And, I am too good for him. The kids will be fine.

Typical rationalization and self loathing.

I know I told my stbxH over and over again that I could forgive him. I said it very quickly because I wanted to make it work at any cost. Is it really true life? Are you there yet? Or do you still feel desperate, like it's your job to do or say whatever you can that brings your marriage back together? There's the thing ... if it's not genuine, if it's not real ... change, forgiveness, peace ... it won't stick.

And all he ever wanted was to be loved for who he was. Just the way he was.

These are his valid feelings right now, perhaps for a long time. vvv

Yes, I admit I tried to "fix" but really help him.

Even if he wasn't an alcoholic it wasn't your job to "fix" ... errrr ... I mean help him.

life, you are getting some great advice here. And you keep shooting yourself in the foot. I have no idea if your marriage will reconcile or not, but I can tell you this is the best shot you have. Thing is, you have to let go ... not NEED it.

It's scary. The thought of letting go of someone, something, we have defined ourselves by for so long. I thought he wouldn't know I loved him anymore. I thought it would be his permission to continue moving away from me. I thought if I could just get through to him ...

life ... he never needed my permission to walk away. And I don't need his approval to love him either.

As far as answers go ... helping understand MLC (as much as anyone can) helped me find peace. Some days I still struggle, but they are few and far between. Compassion, more often than not, is what I feel when I think about what happened. Not anger, not jealousy, not resentment. I don't need answers anymore ... they aren't mine to find and they won't change anything. There is no explanation that is going to make any of this "better". It got "better" because I chose to change my focus.

Those answers, are his. I hope he does it for himself. I hope they all do, but I have no expecation, therefore no disappointment. Their path, their journey ...

Now let's get back to business ...

What are your plans for the long weekend?

Peace
PEI

and this^^^

[beatrice]

Life, sorry we got involved in a long threadjack: you didn't fail. You may have done things wrong, but ultimately what others decide to do is up to them.

Someone who is somewhat covertly alcoholic can display very difficult and perplexing behaviour, and will try and 'blame' others for their drinking related behaviours

As for other people, well yes, people do like to butt in. In my case everyone simply wanted to tell me what a terrible person my h was for what he was doing, and I found that difficult, because I believed then and still believe that he is going through a profound crisis. That is not to let him off the hook of personal responsibility.

A few people got that he needed, but was unlikely to seek help. I largely kept my own counsel - very few people change their views, and once I had stated my case politely I didn't try and change their mind. How you deal with people probably depends on how well you know them. You can thank them graciously for their help and say you really don't want to talk about it right now. Intrusive is intrusive, howeer much they want to help. Personal support is much more valuable like being invited round for a meal or coffee to talk about something else!

If you want to talk, choose people carefully with whom you share.

Very often this is a nine days wonder for others and they get back to their own concerns.

[PEI]

I never thought of myself as trying to "fix" but really trying to help. There was something that didn't seem right about him but I couldn't put my finger on it. I would express concern and now this I get thrown in my face.

Read Co-dependant No More.

Some of which hurts to hear. THings I never even thought of which now adds to my own thoughts -how I failed-and really makes things seem to be impossible. The thought of R anyway.

We have a saying around here about "if it stings then look at it" (paraphrasing, but nickle J3B). In all the stuff my husband said when he dropped the bomb, there were two nuggets that really stood out for me. Two things that "stung". I focussed on doing what I could to explore those behaviours in myself, focussed on doing better now, and figuring out why I behaved as such in the first place. The WHYs are where the real change will eventually come from. I needed to change my programming and self talk in order for some of these changes to stick. I'm a work in progress, but I know what direction I'm headed in. This does not make me responsible for his choices. It does not make me responsible for his MLC (and for the record I do believe my stbxH is having an MLC, but I also think he was a budding WAS before it hit, and it's that part that forces me to acknowledge that I do have some responsibility for the state of our relationship).

Also, hurts because now our M is put under such scrutiny by everyone!! Embarressing for me.

Why do you give a flying fig what anyone else thinks of your marriage? What embarrasses you?

What do I say to these people who think they are helping?

Tell them you don't want to talk about it. Tell them you appreciate their concern.

Also, why is it the MLC'ers rewrite history? Or, is that really how they feel/felt all this time?

They over emphasis the bad because they are focussed on it. They HAVE to be in order to justify and rationalize their behaviour. They can't sit there and say "well my marriage was good and my partner was fantastic but I'm going to walk away and have an affair and treat all the people I love like hell" now, can they?

[25yearsmlc]

as we have said before

they rewrite history b/c they are justifying their actions. They will vilify those who guilt them.


That does not make ALL their views inaccurate b/c some truth may exist in them

and we may well have missed some things. We're not perfect either.

And we have our own bias too.

But by and large a man who leaves his family

and who was once a loved member, more or less,

has a lot of "splainin' to do!"

So he begins that "splainin'" with himself,

and goes on to tell YOU all the things he's "glad he's out of!"

You can only take so much before you're going to want to react.

If it stings, as PEI says, take a look. Own your part, learn from it, and MOVE ON...

if it's just BS (and at some level you'll often just 'know' it is)

LET IT GO...

otherwise

it's like the time I let a nutty homeless guy who lived on a grill, who did not know me at all,

but hated something about me harrass and hound me.

He'd yell the most vulgar things my way and

I recall wondering if I'd worn something ugly or looked like someone mean in his life..."wth?"

I literally had no idea who he was (i.e., he was not a former client of mine from court)

but I let his "opinion" of me affect me until one day when my boss heard him yelling at me as I left court.

Then my boss made some funny remark about how that "must be your old bf"...and it hit me that this homeless guy living on a grill, had NO idea who I was

and his "data about me, was not real"...so it did not matter...at all.


Why on earth had I wasted a single brain cell caring or wondering what this guy thought of me?

He might have had some broken synapses, or a chemical imbalance, or a head trauma

NONE OF WHICH HAD TO DO WITH ME....

Similarly, your h's bias about things right now, makes his

"data" NOT REAL and

so it cannot matter so much to you. You have to let it roll off your back.

[lifejustgothard2]

Thank you thank you.

I will read the codependent book. But, honestly thought a spouse helps each other especially when they don't see it themselves cause maybe they are too sick. I would hope H would do the same to me.

I guess I am a slow learner or am very stubborn. But, I do see where I have failed both during the R and now while DBing.

My point with the other people or friends is that they have a theory and share it with you and then I am struck with "wow, never thought of it like that?" Could it be? I don't need any extra ideas put in my head. I do need to say I don't want to talk about it. Hurts way too much.

I feel like my life is on display and every ugly detail.

The rewriting of history is exactely why I need to continue with NC. Day 5- again.

[lifejustgothard2]

Day 8 NC. Pathetic but good for me! Can anyone recommend some good sites or books with info on how to help our kids while going through this?

I feel I am doing my best but always willing to learn more.

[lifejustgothard2]

bump...
day 9

[Jack_Three_Beans]

My point with the other people or friends is that they have a theory and share it with you and then I am struck with "wow, never thought of it like that?"

You get that here too, hopefully.

The idea I had was the goal. What was my goal? Well...to be married. I listened to the people (friends and family) who told me to get out as quick as possible.

After they spoke I thanked them for their advice, but I told them what I WANTED from them. I also told them that if they couldn't support my choice then I didn't want their advice. If they couldn't stop telling me their advice then I would not be around them.

I basically told them how they could support me and if they couldn't I just wouldn't be around them.

Good sites for kids or books...

I didn't really go that route. I just spent more time with them and answered their questions without demonizing their mother. I told them that me and mom were having problems but that it was not their fault, it would never be their fault and that we both loved them very very much no matter what happened between me and mom.

The books are pretty much going to say the same things. Spend time and love your kids.