Val, I am sorry you have unresolved things with your dad. We all would like to have the fantasy we see in 60 min. with commercials. You work in the industry, and you know how many hours and how much effort goes into what we finally see. Real life is messier than that, and we cannot edit in the best sequence. We can only do our best and try again given the opportunity.
In real life not every relationship can be saved. Sometimes we need to triage and save ourselves first then work on the remaining ones with the greatest chances. It is not what I was raised to believe. It is what I am coming to accept. Like you I am working on it. I read through my journal today and found a post. I think it was from 2Step. It is speaking to me. Perhaps you will hear something also.
Quote:
There’s only one kind of love that can fill us up, make us whole, and give us the happiness we all want: unconditional love or true love. It is unconditional love that we all seek, and somehow we intuitively realize that anything other than that kind of love isn’t really love at all—it’s an imitation of the real thing.
Unconditional love—true love—is so different from the kind of love most of us have known all our lives that it deserves both a name—Real Love—and definition of its own: Real Love is caring about the happiness of another person without any thought for what we might get for ourselves. It’s also Real Love when other people care about our happiness unconditionally. It is not Real Love when other people like us for doing what they want. Under those conditions we’re just paying for love again. We can be certain that we’re receiving Real Love only when we make foolish mistakes, when we fail to do what other people want, and even when we get in their way, but they don’t feel disappointed or irritated at us. That is Real Love (true unconditional love), and that love alone has the power to heal all wounds, bind people together, and create relationships quite beyond our present capacity to imagine.
When you feel enough of the unconditional love of others, you'll have the most important treasure in life. The wounds of the past will heal—wounds caused by insufficient Real Love—and you'll feel whole and happy. As your emptiness and fear are eliminated by Real Love, you'll simply have no need to use Getting and Protecting Behaviors. Without those behaviors, you'll find relationships with others relatively effortless and will begin finding the happiness you've always wanted.
It is important to understand that as much as you may wish, you simply cannot control another person's thoughts or feelings. Even if you feel they are unjustly ending the relationship or you do not see any logic in their choice, they possess the freewill to do with their life as they wish. It is sometimes enormously painful to accept this fact, especially if you feel you have given so much of yourself to this other person. When they choose to walk away from you, you may feel a very strong craving to stop the progress of their actions. When feeling that you deserve something from this person, it can cause you to behave in very improper way. This behavior is detrimental to your emotional wellbeing.
There is no debate regarding the poignant pain that is involved in a breakup or divorce. There is not a magic way to completely stop the misery you will feel from the loss of this person. However, there is a way to control these feelings. No amount of pleading, begging or bribery can change how a person feels about you. Once you accept this fact, you can then move on to take actions to behave dignified and accept the end of the relationship with your esteem intact.
When pleading with another person to "begin loving you again", you are setting yourself up for disaster. You cannot talk someone into loving you. You may be a wonderful, caring, kind and compassionate person, however if someone who was in your life does not feel they want continue the relationship, you cannot force them. You already must deal with the loss of the relationship. Love is a choice of freewill. To beg, plead or otherwise, will only lead to feeling defeated once again.
It is exceedingly difficult indeed, to control the desire to reach out to the person who left you. When you are so used to conversations with them or seeing this person everyday, it will throw your world upside-down when you must deal with a sudden end of communication and a physical connection. Realizing that calling the person, trying to "accidentally run into them" or other means of contact is futile, you must learn to distance yourself. This must be done in the name of self-respect.
It is one of the most frequently used clichés when a relationship ends; however, time does heal all wounds. When using the term "heal" this does not mean that you forget this person forever. It does not mean that you will live the rest of your life without this person's name or image appearing in your mind. It does mean that given a certain amount of time, the image and memories of this person will fade.
One of the things I’ve had to relearn is I don’t need approval. It would be nice, but I’ll be fine without it. I was a whole person before. I am becoming one again. Running around slaying dragons, saving damsels, rendering King Solomon decisions to have approval and admiration is exhausting. Approval isn’t love anyway.
I am not suggesting giving up on your Dad. I am suggesting giving yourself a break. Rome wasn’t built in a day. Some nuts are harder to crack. Step back and appreciate the good in your visit home.
BITS Me 55, ACK, when did that happen? Doesn't feel like 55 D 30 S 27
You create your own universe as you go along - Winston Churchill
I've been dealing with my situation and similar to you I needed some time away from the board. I'll update my situation on my thread, but I had to say THANK YOU for your support and helpful words during my journey. I know you'll find happiness in the future, you're an amazing person.
((Hug))
--W
_______________________ M: 47; W: 39 M: 4.5 yrs; T: 18 years No children Separated: 01/19/11 Wife Served Papers: 02/1/11 Wife moved: 03/05/11 Responded: 04/14/11
Thanks for all the advice and kind words everyone.
Journaling:
Happy New Years Everyone!
I hope everyone survived the best they could.
My trip home is coming to an end. It's hard to believe 3 weeks went by so fast.
As usual, it has been full of emotion.
There has been much good coming from this trip.
The biggest is for my mom. Having me home has been wonderful for her. She has pushed herself too much - and tires easily. But I can't stop her.. it brings joy to her heart.
My older sister and I spent our first new years together. I bought her a dress and allowed her to pick out my outfit. She acts strong but I can see the tears in her eyes.. she is sad that I am leaving.
I have watched 3 basketball games of my eldest nephew. He definitely has my family's talent.
My mom had a big prayer answered. My eldest sister handled the physical and emotional abuse between my parents alot differently than my middle sister and myself - she chose not to have a relationship with them really. She is very cold.. and very distant.
For years my mom has been praying for her to come to my mom's house and that we all sit down as a family and have a holiday dinner... well it happened and it was wonderful.
I encouraged my mom to reach out to my eldest sister again to have coffee whilst I take my nieces to see Chipwrecked. My sister agreed and they had a great time.
My eldest niece taught me the world of getting manicures.... everyday tasks were VERY difficult for the first 48 hrs.
I'm scheduled to get 2nd holes in my ears and take one of my nephews to get his ears pierced for the first time. As much as I want to show him how it's done.. I'm afraid he will get scared.
One of this surprising things has been how close I grew to one of my nephews. He (and his brother who is getting his ears pierced) have an alcoholic father... who treats them awful. Actually, since my sister won custody... the dad doesn't have anything to do with them other than send nasty texts.
My nephew is handling it hard. Failing school. He just doesn't understand why his dad doesn't want anything to do with him... won't answer his texts.. or sends random mean ones... he misses the small things they did together.. makes excuses for him.....
.... man it's like holding up a big..GIGANTIC.. mirror.
I listen and validate. I try to help him through. We went running a couple of times. He's very angry. He's a train wreck.
He has expressed to me that he wants to come to LA to get his "sh!t" straight. It will be something to think about. I want to help but I work 60-70 hrs a week. Having a 15 year old at home would be interesting.
So lots of good things to be appreciative of. My first trip home in August felt like it was for me. I worked through alot of pain and had many breakthroughs in that time.
This trip feels like it was for others. This holiday season seemed to be very little about what I wanted, missed, or hated (although I did have my moments of crying") and really about how my changes have/continue to impact other people. I don't know if that makes sense.
All of what I journaled about wouldn't have happened if I had not been separated. Now I don't believe God causes us pain, but I do think he allows it to happen (I've mentioned it many times) so we can grow and he can bring out the best in us.
Although this holiday season was hard and like many of you - I cried, and got angry, and ran my gambit of emotions... I also know God reminded me of all the changes my life was and have far he has brought me.
I was also reminded that time is very short. For those of you who are curious - It is clear that both my mom and sister's illnesses are progressing... however both are fighting (for the lives literally) and me moving home to "take care of the family" would actually cause them more harm. They both said that as much as they would love it, they aren't ready to roll over and die.
Guess I know where I get that from..
So I will plan to go home more often. My sister has planned her first trip to LA this summer as well as trip to the ocean. As long as she continues to fight and plan for the future.. I will do my damndest to make sure I can be part of it.
I will continue to water and care for the positive seeds planted over the holiday season - both in my friends and family.
Here's to a better 2012!
To answer your question 25 - Yes I know more change will occur and there is still much work to be done on my end... and Yes I too believe it WILL be better!
M(f): 40 D'ed: 8/12
Show empathy when there's pain. Show grace when warranted. Kindness in the midst of anger. Faith in the face of fear.
Sounds like you're doing great, Val! One thing our sitches are great for are acting as a launching pad to reconnect with family. I have come to realize that my family has been the true constant in my life when I always thought my W would be instead.
I'm also glad that you're doing so much to help out your nephew. It sounds like your "sitches" share some pretty similar elements. Sometimes, just being around someone who's going through something like what you're going through is helpful in itself.
Journal: Sitting at the airport to head back to LA. Have a ton of emotions going on so I thought I would journal a bit.
I cried saying goodbye to my family. I haven't done that in awhile. I will miss them greatly. For almost 9 yrs. I really only missed my w.. Now I'm homesick for several people. I guess that what happens when you stop focusing/loving only one person.
I have a ton of feelings going on towards wife lately. It's all very confusing to me.
I do not look forward to going back to deal with D. There is still a small part of me that holds on to hope. I keep trying to make it die.. But it lingers. And I know everything is almost complete.
I also know that I am scared. All of our positive or weird interactions really took a number on me emotionally.. And although I realized that I allow it, honestly I'm not sure how to stop it.
It's a constant battle between wanting to work on my m and wanting to save myself and move on. Because for me... I just don't believe I can do both nor do I believe that by working on myself... I will potentially have a better r with my w one day.
Unless she changes... I believe the more I work on me.. The less likely I'll have anything to do with her.
In August, I dyed my hair blonde. Well I decided to do tips and although I originally wanted to dye them black.. I lived a little and got a pink purple...
...... And though I think my hair is kinda sexy, i had nightmares about w hating it. I'm afraid of what she'll say when she sees me.
And I'm trying my best to say "who cares what she thinks!!".. It's not really so much that I care if she likes it... It's more on if she is vocal about it and how she says it.
Why do I still want to be with a person who scares me??
Queen posted a link about passive aggressive relationships. Alot of it hit home for me.
And I don't want to be in one.. And even though my w and I aren't in a together.. The dynamic is still there.
I'm working on breaking the cycle. It's easy to do when w spews venom and acts like a fool.. But this being nice and seeming interested in me is much harder.
Because as much I would love to believe that the last several interactions could be the little positives mwd says to keep an eye out for, i am more inclined to think that she is feeling like she is losing control so that's what the past month was about.
Maybe that's me just trying to protect my heart.
My w didn't really open up and I think we both are to blame.. I also know that rather than tell me.. She would control. Ie.. Being fearful about me having friends because she was afraid I wouldn't need her anymore= the silent treatment when I got home from going out.
But I don't know how accept her feelings.. Because I feel like acceptance = right.
I mean.. I get the fear, but punishing me wasn't right.
Or the comments about my family.. Which again I understand.. But they are dying... So it's getting hard to not lash out.
Her Christmas is interesting because she chose it. Her dad would have loved for her to come home but she chose it. She s still angry at him. She makes comments about my family because she won't forgive.
And those are her demons... And although I still have compassion for her... There is a part of me (growing part) that is like "I understand, but quit taking it out on me." or "do something about it!"
Neither did I really express in our marriage. I just always let her be.. And never pushed her ( a complaint she had)
It's hard to push when you re scared.
I understand why she does what she does, says what she says..
.. But I'm seriously getting to where... I wouldnt say I don't care... But I don't want to be exposed to it anymore.
I feel like what I've been doing (Not reacting mostly) is good and working to a point, but only for me. It does not bring me closer to w.
And I keep telling myself that getting healthy Is the only shot I have at a great r.
That all of this is me still trying to hold onto my codependent ways. That its not unloving to want to walk away from a r that causes me harm. It's not wrong to not validate her feelings when she expresses them in abusive or hurtful ways.
But it still feels wrong. I still feel like I haven't tried everything.
I'm rambling.. Does this make sense? Am I falling off the db train?
I just don't know anymore.
How do I love her and myself at the same time because I constantly feel like I have to choose?
Feel free to slap me with a 2x4.
M(f): 40 D'ed: 8/12
Show empathy when there's pain. Show grace when warranted. Kindness in the midst of anger. Faith in the face of fear.
I cried saying goodbye to my family. I haven't done that in awhile. I will miss them greatly. For almost 9 yrs. I really only missed my w.. Now I'm homesick for several people. I guess that what happens when you stop focusing/loving only one person.
It is what healthy people feel and it is healthy, very healthy to have more people in your life
I have a ton of feelings going on towards wife lately. It's all very confusing to me.
I do not look forward to going back to deal with D. There is still a small part of me that holds on to hope. I keep trying to make it die.. But it lingers. And I know everything is almost complete.
I also know that I am scared. All of our positive or weird interactions really took a number on me emotionally.. And although I realized that I allow it, honestly I'm not sure how to stop it.
As long as we hope for a different outcome we will continue to fear what we anticipate. We know it will hurt and we fear it will hurt more than we can bear. We can bear a lot more than we think we can. Courage is continuing on in the face of fear, remaining committed to the process of improvement
It's a constant battle between wanting to work on my m and wanting to save myself and move on. Because for me... I just don't believe I can do both nor do I believe that by working on myself... I will potentially have a better r with my w one day.
Unless she changes... I believe the more I work on me.. The less likely I'll have anything to do with her.
How could it be different? The very actions she took changed you in manners she did not anticipate. You’ve done and continue to do the work. Addressing what has been revealed to you as shortfalls. You are not the same person you were. Her actions and your response to those actions have irrevocably challenged you to improvement. Do not lose sight of who you have become. You know you are much better than before. You deserve better than what you had do not lose sight of that. Do not devalue yourself.
In August, I dyed my hair blonde. Well I decided to do tips and although I originally wanted to dye them black.. I lived a little and got a pink purple...
...... And though I think my hair is kinda sexy, i had nightmares about w hating it. I'm afraid of what she'll say when she sees me.
And I'm trying my best to say "who cares what she thinks!!".. It's not really so much that I care if she likes it... It's more on if she is vocal about it and how she says it.
Why do I still want to be with a person who scares me??
More importantly why do you allow her to?
Queen posted a link about passive aggressive relationships. Alot of it hit home for me.
And I don't want to be in one.. And even though my w and I aren't in a together.. The dynamic is still there.
I'm working on breaking the cycle. It's easy to do when w spews venom and acts like a fool.. But this being nice and seeming interested in me is much harder.
Because as much I would love to believe that the last several interactions could be the little positives mwd says to keep an eye out for, i am more inclined to think that she is feeling like she is losing control so that's what the past month was about.
She is losing control. You are not cowling in a corner wringing your hand with tears in your eyes. My old R was/had many elements of CoDe, when my W left she predicted to family I would self destruct. My W has not made conciliatory gestures or attempted friendly interactions, she has persecuted and thrown tantrums. Accept that your W has been less angry and somewhat pleasant it is better than some of the alternatives. Do not pin your hopes to a few positives, rather recognize them. Remember you are the improved Val, and the improved Val deserves better than the same old same old. There is a lot of improvement needed there because you deserve it
Maybe that's me just trying to protect my heart.
My w didn't really open up and I think we both are to blame.. I also know that rather than tell me.. She would control. Ie.. Being fearful about me having friends because she was afraid I wouldn't need her anymore= the silent treatment when I got home from going out.
But I don't know how accept her feelings.. Because I feel like acceptance = right.
I mean.. I get the fear, but punishing me wasn't right.
Or the comments about my family.. Which again I understand.. But they are dying... So it's getting hard to not lash out.
Her Christmas is interesting because she chose it. Her dad would have loved for her to come home but she chose it. She s still angry at him. She makes comments about my family because she won't forgive.
And those are her demons... And although I still have compassion for her... There is a part of me (growing part) that is like "I understand, but quit taking it out on me." or "do something about it!"
She needs to grow. It takes time and you cannot do it for her
Neither did I really express in our marriage. I just always let her be.. And never pushed her ( a complaint she had)
It's hard to push when you re scared.
I understand why she does what she does, says what she says..
.. But I'm seriously getting to where... I wouldnt say I don't care... But I don't want to be exposed to it anymore.
I feel like what I've been doing (Not reacting mostly) is good and working to a point, but only for me. It does not bring me closer to w.
And I keep telling myself that getting healthy Is the only shot I have at a great r.
I firmly believe this and IMO it is the reason many of us have come to remain here
That all of this is me still trying to hold onto my codependent ways. That its not unloving to want to walk away from a r that causes me harm. It's not wrong to not validate her feelings when she expresses them in abusive or hurtful ways.
But it still feels wrong. I still feel like I haven't tried everything.
I'm rambling.. Does this make sense? Am I falling off the db train?
I just don't know anymore.
How do I love her and myself at the same time because I constantly feel like I have to choose?
Feel free to slap me with a 2x4.
Ahhhh, no, at least none intentionally as you are not running away
Val: IMO the confusion you’re feeling is perfectly normal. We all question our decisions and actions when we are not seeing progress toward our desires. It is not turning out as it was meant to when we began. So we revisit and in doing so dredge up the emotions of the past. How much they affect us depends upon how well we dealt with them the last time. That they still cause angst means we did not get to a resolution the last time.
To get through my day I compartmentalize a lot. It is an old skill. Focusing upon the mission or the components of the mission before me at the moment and boxing everything else to be dealt with later. So it is later and perhaps you have open too many boxes at the same time. Don’t sweat it too much as you have the skills to slow it down.
You're doing fine, you will be more than fine, step out of the squirrel cage and stand proudly! ((()))
BITS Me 55, ACK, when did that happen? Doesn't feel like 55 D 30 S 27
You create your own universe as you go along - Winston Churchill
(((Val))) no 2x4 you are just having some anxieties. Nothing wrong with you or the feelings. I think you have tried more than most people so don't beat yourself up. I think it is time for some detaching. Hang in there
M 53 D 20 Separated 6/22/11 moved out 10/24 Together 26 yrs Married 16 W Filed for D 7/21/11 Served 9/6/11 D final 8/28/12
“Failure is not fatal, but failure to change might be.”
Your "ramblings" are perfectly normal, even healthy to get out in writing...with people to share it with, who know exactly what you're going through, too! This is a hellacious process no matter where things will end up. People here call life with a WAS "being on the rollercoaster"...well, it applies to our personal process of change, too.
But you are definitely making progress, so never fear! It may not feel like progress, but each step forward counts! I'm quite sure that you've made much distance from the Val who first posted on this site.
I say embrace your new purple tips. Sounds like fun! Maybe your W might like them...maybe not. But heck, they weren't for her, were they? I think that, paradoxically, living your life more for YOU makes you a heck of a lot more compelling than building a life based around what your W wants. I get it, I sometimes think stuff like that, too. But I feel more empowered as time goes on. Now I often think to myself, "Who cares what W thinks? It's my life now, not hers!"
Hate to say it, but between the choice between your R with your W and YOU, you've gotta go with you. You can still love both you and her, but right now, YOU need YOU more than your W needs you.
Right now, your W does not desire to repair your R, so it will only serve as an anchor to drag you under. You can certainly "leave the door open" in case she wishes to return -- making sure not to do things to make things between you guys worse. But until you truly start living your life for YOU, you won't really be living at all.
