Ho hum, this is going to be a long one (and, yes, I now that's not unusual for me).
Got the full deal tonight. It was a phone conversation as I sat in the car after an hour of root canal at the dentist. We got into an argument about money - the only thing we ever argue about these days.
He said: Your car is ready to be picked up from being repaired - the work costs $5,000.
I said: I can't pay for that.
He said: You'll have to leave it there then.
I said: OK.
He was infuriated by this and started to tell me it was all my fault for not buying a new car like he'd told me to... blah blah blah. We argued a little, but I was calm for the most part.
Relationship talk came up and I just felt like it was time to get stuff out in the open, so instead of trying to shut it down, I went with it.
I know I shouldn't read anything into any of this, but I would be so glad to hear any observations that people might like to make about any of it.
H said he was a thief and a con-man just like I'd told him he was.
I said that I regretted saying those things in anger.
He admitted to living with OW - just a few streets away from us as it turns out.
He said the kids don't miss him at all because they don't ring him or text him to come over.
He said that everything was his fault and that I did nothing wrong. A couple of minutes later, he said that he forgave me.
Later still, he said i hurt him more than he could ever recover from.
When I asked him if he could tell me more about this he said, crying, that I'd kept him away from his family for 15 years and he could never get that time back.
I said I was so sorry, but I didn't realise that this was his prime reason for being hurt and he lashed out saying it wasn't his main reason and it was so like me to talk like that.
I said I didn't realise I had been keeping him away from his family and there were many things i'd do differently if i had my time over.
In my view, he's rewriting our marital history in saying this, and I see it as part of his regret that he didn't spend enough time with his 3 grandparents who passed away in the last 4 years, one of whom was more like a father to H.
On the day before this grandfather died, H told his parents, when they rang to say that he should visit him, that this man was only mildly ill with a cold and they were overreacting. He didn't visit. No wonder he was traumatised.
He kept his grandfather's diary as a momento and had it on his bedside table. I'd find him looking through it at various times of the day and night, repeatedly, in the last 4 years.
And then, about 12 months ago, his grandmother died and he was the only family member available when the hospital rang to say she had passed away.
He hadn't been to visit her for 6 months prior to this, but he had to sit alone with the body for several hours that night.
He wouldn't let me come with him (it was just 3 weeks before Bomb Drop and he was already 6 months into full-on angry spew with me). But again, major trauma for H.
He said all the script things like: He was sick of the way i over-analysed everything. That he didn't want to talk any more.
Said he was just going through life in a mechanical way, focusing on work and paying the bills.
When I jokingly asked if he had any tips on how to become 'mechanical' in dealing with things, he said "Try drinking".
I asked him if he was happy and he said: 'Do I sound happy?' I said 'No'.
He said he was just no good at having personal relationships.
Said that we were no longer married (This one really made me bite my tongue!)
Said that i made him so angry by not doing what he told me to do about money and the cars. That I was making everything so much worse.
Said that I didn't listen to him.
Said that things will be much better between us once the business of settlement and divorce are sorted out - said he had so much trouble with these aspects.
Said i was always trying to manipulate him.
Said we are just not good together.
Oh blimey, how much more 'by the book' can he spout?
He agreed with me that we'd had a great marriage and when i said 'Yes, I had the time of my life', he said 'So did I.'
By the time I'd driven home, he'd been there and left $500 cash for me (i'd told him I had nothing left) and put $500 in my cheque account. he'd also left a new phone for me (as mine has pretty much broken down).
I am confused by all of this but obviously not as confused as he is.
Still unsure as to whether the best thing for me is to keep the door open (literally and metaphorically) by allowing him to come into our home to see how warm and nice it is to be with us OR whether I'd be better off telling him to keep away, pack up his things and get used to a life without us in it while-ever he chooses to continue with OW.
I'd rather do the former, but I don't know if i'm just prolonging the agony of his cake-eating. I really wouldn't feel true to my feelings if i went NC/dark. But then, the wisdom is that you have to do what feels like the wrong thing.
I want to show him unconditional love and forgiveness. I don't pursue anymore. I don't beg him to come back, or ever mention a future with him as any sort of possibility. i'm just a happy, confident doppelgänger whenever he's around.
But I do have to admit, that if all i show him is my back, my greatest fear is that he will punish me by doing the ultimate betrayal: OW becoming pregnant.
She is just at the age (late 30s) where she'll have her last chance to reproduce. She's used every other manipulative trick to get him into her life over the last 4 years so I figure this will be her final exultant manoeuvre, too.
My perennial issue - and I know what Bustorama would say.
Anyone else want to weigh in with any observations?
Feeling pretty low, but glad somehow as well. Seems like we cleared the air a bit and things don't seem quite so surreal to me.
Hi NLW- I understand and relate to your dilemma. But I am not sure about the proper approach myself.
But I am with you....
((( )))
TPS Me: 44 H: 42 M14 T17 S10 D7 10/10 H moves out after death of his father-same month 21/04/12 H is 'DONE' 04/05/12 OW/PA confirmed (rumors from 2010) July '14 H ends affair May '15 H moves back home
I just realised that reading my previous post (if you stayed awake long enough) might make it sound like I didn't want any response from you - i.e. 'anyone else want to weigh in...'
What I really meant was (!) that I'm embarrassed in advance for looking like I haven't paid attention to what you've suggested previously. That is, show him that you are done; don't allow him to come into and out of your life on a whim; regulate/formalize, move him out, etc.
It's just that I have been noticing big steps forward again lately associated with my being welcoming, yet acquaintance-like; confident and interesting/sexy (if I do say so myself). So I am loathe to turn out the lights while this seems to be improving our level of interaction.
I didn't want to imply that i wasn't interested in more input from you at all.
I know, I know - no expectations... But my goodness it feels great to see something positive, FINALLY.
After yesterday's BIG R talk. I texted H late last night to say, simply, thank U for being willing to talk to me today.
This morning at 8am, I get a text saying "Anytime you need someone to yell at you give me a call".
I replied LOL.
Then he rang and asked if I'd like to come with him to pick up the car from the repair shop.
I took a deep breath, waited to get my head right (thanks Busto) and then said 'Yes'.
I was still in my jammies, so rushed around and got ready. Made sure I was wearing my sexiest lingerie under my robe - with knee length Uggs (a sort of Elle Macpherson look - Oh yes, I'm the dead spit of Elle, but you get my drift, I hope) when I answered the door.
He noticed. I got dressed in my skin tight pencil skirt with leather boots (now channelling Kolinda Sharma from TGW) and strutted out to his car.
Asked if i could drive (a big 180 for me as I would never do so in the past). he said no at first and then relented.
I drove like a pro and said how much I loved driving the car.
When we got to the car dealership, the execs nearly fell over me - I look like a cashed-up car buyer. H, OTOH, looked a bit like he slept in his clothes on a park bench.
He didn't ever mention that I should pay for the car repair. He then suggested we go for a coffee. As I got in my car (with some difficulty, although very alluringly, i assure you) he commented "nice skirt action".
I flirted back outrageously "you should see my skirt off action" and drove away.
When I walked in to the cafe to meet him a little later, he was smiling to himself and when i asked why he said "It's funny seeing all those guys staring at you". Even the guys at BMW couldn't take their eyes off you.
I said "When you've got this body, i figure it's a good time to flaunt it."
He said "And you do". I said "again, you should see my skirt off action. He said "I have, (he groaned) you are formidable". He seemed genuinely to be lamenting what he was missing.
TMI, I know. I apologise for this - would normally make me cringe, but I've been paying attention to Zig's posts and the sorts of things DB coaches seem to say to others about flirting and being the OW.
I can't really believe I did it - but I gave it a go AND IT WORKS!
He was putty in my hands. He bought me eggs bendict and sat chatting about all his recent business successes, interesting, funny stuff, for over an hour.
He also apologised profusely and kept trying to explain why he felt so angry. I listened, looked him in the eyes and VALIDATED.
So far so brilliant. Then it was time to leave. We stood at his car and he kept talking - more R stuff and how everything would be great financially in about 6-12 months time (how many times have I heard this!!).
But still, it was nice to see how hard he was trying to be reasonable and decent. Said he would try really hard to make sure all my bills were paid etc, etc.
I ended the conversation, but went in for kiss (cheek) to say 'thanks for this morning and for a great breakfast. He hugged me tight.
Nothing like this has happened between us since BD.
Maybe he's just starting to be convinced that i'm moving on and he is relieved. I don't know and I don't really care. I just feel good, finally, about an interaction with him.
Re the above, lest it be thought that i'm some sort of crazed narcissist, the body that i have now is due to almost 12 months of LBS diet. No joy there. But it does have its fashion advantages.
I am so thin I can wear my D16s skinny jeans. And all sorts of fashion that i wouldn't have had a chance to get on before, now looks tailor-made for me. Hence the pencil skirts. My look is: very tight and lots of zips.
It helps with my PMA-maintenance. And I know it makes my H stir crazy....
I love this! Cheryl (DB coach) told me to become H's girlfriend again. And when I'm on my A-game, it REALLY works. I've kind of been struggling since he told me last week he still plans on moving out. But decided tonight, I'm getting back on the horse. I'll let you know how it went. LOL
H also promises that our finances will be better in a couple months. Funny thing is somehow a wrench is always thrown into those plans. Hs paycheck was supposed to be almost double today. Turns out payroll didn't mark him as tax exempt so you can imagine his reaction when he saw his check. He said he wanted to cry.
I did a 180, was optimistic. Told him that even if we have 5cents in the bank we'll be ok and to enjoy his time with S4 today. I also gave him a hug and he stroked my back. WHOA! BIG LL for me!!
And as for the sexy outfit! WTG!!!! I was imagining you swaying your hair in slow motion as you got off the car and that song coming on, oooooh yeah! bam bam, ooooh yeah! LMAO!!! and all the men checking you out ;-) Work it girl!!!
M 42 H 39 T10 (-2yrs separation) S8 D5 DD 7/30/11 (EA&PA) Reconciled 6/2013 Separation in works 1/2017
Hi NLW I love this! Cheryl said something something similar to me. I am going to see what I can do next time I see him.
I just love it! Good for you!
TPS Me: 44 H: 42 M14 T17 S10 D7 10/10 H moves out after death of his father-same month 21/04/12 H is 'DONE' 04/05/12 OW/PA confirmed (rumors from 2010) July '14 H ends affair May '15 H moves back home
Thanks guys, something in the universe just 'clicked' for me yesterday and it suddenly became OK to act like that. Never would have thought it was possible if you'd asked me beforehand.
I'm going to strut my stuff more often in future. I feel more confident and less victim-like as a result.
