M:46 H:49 T:20yrs myD:22 H distant summer/12 H sleeping in b'ment: Nov/12 BD: Dec 2/12 asked me begin to move end of Jan/13 moved Jan 7/13 (left my stuff) "agreed" to "working on r" Mar 3/13(lipservice!)
She said she tried and waited and suffered and hoped and prayed and held onto "us" until she just couldn't anymore. And then when she finally had nothing left and let go, she couldn't get it back.
It's what I said before. I'm afraid if I move forward I won't be able to come back, and I don't know if I'm okay with that.
I don't know if this is a sign or a test.
-PM
M:12y - BD:12/11 - D:6/13 - 4Ds
"The ultimate measure of a man is not where he stands in moments of comfort and convenience, but where he stands at times of challenge and controversy." -MLK Jr.
She said she tried and waited and suffered and hoped and prayed and held onto "us" until she just couldn't anymore. And then when she finally had nothing left and let go, she couldn't get it back.
It's what I said before. I'm afraid if I move forward I won't be able to come back, and I don't know if I'm okay with that.
Moving forward doesn't mean giving up all hope. W informed me a few weeks ago that she will file when the kids get out of school (they get out this week). I just bought an SUV because I don't have the use of W's van anymore (and I'm taking the kids on vacation next week). I've worked out my expenses and projections for life without W and have been living that for some time now. I've even gone out on several dates. I simply do not expect W to return, ever. But I do still have a kernel of hope in there. People have reconciled against much greater odds than W and I are facing, and it could happen to us too. I don't expect it to and I'm living my life accordingly. But if W were to suddenly have a change of heart, I'd be open to reconciling.
You can have hope without having expectations, and you can have hope without clinging to your W. I can't remember if this is in DR or just here on the forums, but the mantra about getting to the point where you know you will not just survive, but you will thrive whether your W is part of your life or not; that's where you need to be. That's a lot different than surrendering hope.
On a positive note, today is the 18 month anniversary of BD. That certainly doesn't sound very positive, but at the time I was spiraling farther and farther down the toilet bowl. I needed help. I asked God for it, and He tried to get my attention many other times, but I wasn't listening. Apparently, I had to lose the very most important thing (by a mile) in my life to stimulate the change(s) I needed to make.
I have done a lot of growing and learning, and it is an ongoing process, but I don't think I've changed more in an instant than that moment that the bomb dropped. She had tried to get through to me before, but I didn't respond. In the exact instant that I actually realized/believed that there wasn't an "us" anymore, all the fog lifted and I could finally see everything clearly. Everything that has happened since is just me assessing all the damage done that is now visible, trying to make up for what I did, trying to become a better man who doesn't make the same mistakes.
But that instant? I have three experiences in my life where there was an INSTANTANEOUS and MAJOR change in me. I'm not sure if I could actually rank them, but I can't see how BD could be beat.
So it's 18 months to the day that I started a new life...a new me. I put her through a lot to get to that point, but ultimately she figured out a way to save me. I made myself pay a terrible price for it, and I am determined to make certain that payment was not in vain.
But yes, I'm questioning what I am supposed to do. I want to be in a place where I have moved forward and am good in life, but not moved so far past her that I can't come back. I don't know if that's possible once I take the first step in that direction, so I'm apprehensive to take it. The process has already begun without me allowing it, so if I actually go along with it I'm not sure what's going to happen.
I guess what I'm saying is, I know where I want to go, I just don't trust that I won't change my mind once I get started on that path. I'm afraid the path will change me, so I stand here stuck. And you all are trying to help me, and maybe you're all right. But maybe not. I don't know.
-PM
M:12y - BD:12/11 - D:6/13 - 4Ds
"The ultimate measure of a man is not where he stands in moments of comfort and convenience, but where he stands at times of challenge and controversy." -MLK Jr.
She said she tried and waited and suffered and hoped and prayed and held onto "us" until she just couldn't anymore. And then when she finally had nothing left and let go, she couldn't get it back.
It's what I said before. I'm afraid if I move forward I won't be able to come back, and I don't know if I'm okay with that.
I don't know if this is a sign or a test.
Maybe it is both, a sign AND a test.
That's a pretty script feeling that most WASs feel. They feel as though they carried the load for years, and when they couldn't anymore, they set it down only to have the LBS try and pick it up.
That is the reason for the anger , resentment, and such. Most of what she describes is similar to what you may be feeling today, that you did everything that you could, and it just "didn't work out".
And the "just a piece of paper" statement is kinda correct, although until a person has held that "just a piece of paper" in their hands, it surely isn't that in the beginning.
It depends on how you view it, and how you process those emotions that will make the difference for you. Your perspective of what it actually means, and how you choose to move forward from it.
It doesn't change your heart and mind, only your marital status.
It doesn't change your morals, or your conviction, nor who you really are inside. It only changes a box that you check occasionally.....if you work through it...
And that is the perspective you will ALWAYS have, if you truly love her. You will always honor your vows, because your vows are for you, to use within the marriage, yet they are always gonna be with you. You will always love her, you will always cherish the memories that you have, and you will honor her choice to end the "legal" side of the marriage.
That is for you...
The "just a piece of paper" doesn't mean that YOU choose to end those things, and you don't magically become detached, or the pain doesn't end just because you are holing that paper. The "legal" and "emotional" side of a Divorce are entirely different.
PM, try and feel all of that, and process it, and let those emotions wash over you and continue to fight for you. You deserve your best shot.
I don't think I've changed more in an instant than that moment that the bomb dropped. She had tried to get through to me before, but I didn't respond. In the exact instant that I actually realized/believed that there wasn't an "us" anymore, all the fog lifted and I could finally see everything clearly. Everything that has happened since is just me assessing all the damage done that is now visible, trying to make up for what I did, trying to become a better man who doesn't make the same mistakes.
So it's 18 months to the day that I started a new life...a new me. I put her through a lot to get to that point, but ultimately she figured out a way to save me. I made myself pay a terrible price for it, and I am determined to make certain that payment was not in vain.
I feel as if you are me saying those words, as they fit perfectly for me.
That instant... For me, nothing and I mean nothing will ever trump that instant for me.
And what my W did to save herself, yeah it saved me too. the guilt I feel that it took her going through hell trying to open my eyes...
Originally Posted By: PatientMan
I guess what I'm saying is, I know where I want to go, I just don't trust that I won't change my mind once I get started on that path. I'm afraid the path will change me, so I stand here stuck. And you all are trying to help me, and maybe you're all right. But maybe not. I don't know.
-PM
IMO... Don't ever forget that you have to do what is right for you, no matter what we say, your therapist says, a book says.
Reading this was not easy for me, it brought me to tears.
I get it and it is honest.
Thank you.
M46,W41 D16,D18 M22,T25 BD 11/12 W moved out 01/13 Piecing 10/13 Divorced 01/15 "Whether you worry or not has no affect on the outcome. But, moving forward, letting go, and making changes can." UrWorthy
Hey PM..... Hope you woke up on the right side of the bed after the hearing. Best of luck. My Mrs has had a change of heart and is discussing with me a potential to try, but I feel like I even need to be more patient now. What a ride.....
By the way, congrats! And yes! Take it slow.
-PM
M:12y - BD:12/11 - D:6/13 - 4Ds
"The ultimate measure of a man is not where he stands in moments of comfort and convenience, but where he stands at times of challenge and controversy." -MLK Jr.
Moving forward doesn't mean giving up all hope. W informed me a few weeks ago that she will file when the kids get out of school (they get out this week). I just bought an SUV because I don't have the use of W's van anymore (and I'm taking the kids on vacation next week). I've worked out my expenses and projections for life without W and have been living that for some time now. I've even gone out on several dates. I simply do not expect W to return, ever. But I do still have a kernel of hope in there. People have reconciled against much greater odds than W and I are facing, and it could happen to us too. I don't expect it to and I'm living my life accordingly. But if W were to suddenly have a change of heart, I'd be open to reconciling.
You can have hope without having expectations, and you can have hope without clinging to your W. I can't remember if this is in DR or just here on the forums, but the mantra about getting to the point where you know you will not just survive, but you will thrive whether your W is part of your life or not; that's where you need to be. That's a lot different than surrendering hope.
I have taken or am taking those steps. Getting a bigger place. Scheduling vacation with just me and the girls. Budgeting. Etc. I think I am doing the things I need to be doing, and I see mistakes that I made before beginning the DB process.
I feel optimistic about the future. About my four girls and my life with them. About my career. About becoming who I am supposed to be.
To be perfectly honest, I think I have been holding onto some form of expectation the entire time. Not intentionally, but I just can't seem to convince myself that it is over. It's this last little kernel of "expectation" that I can't seem to let go of.
Inside of me, down at the very core, there is this little voice that says, "not yet." It's coming from the same place that knew I was in love with her months before my brain knew. And so I feel like I should listen to that voice, but in the end it may be just me fooling myself so I can survive today without having to change.
For me, "hope" and "expectation" intertwine easily and it's difficult to have the latter without the former. I haven't solved the riddle of how to do this yet.
I *feel* like moving forward is a form of giving up, and I can't seem to give that last piece of it up. I said it last week. That I need to get to where I was 14 years ago. There was this girl that I liked and the chance that we would end up together was so remote that the thought of dating her never even crossed my mind. Literally.
I know it isn't so easy with all the baggage that comes along with fourteen years and four kids, but I think that's where I want to be.
I am told that couples have come back from far worse, and I think I am told that because people see me in pain and want to comfort me. I don't know if it really is doing me any good, though, if I can't trim the fat of expectation off the meat of hope.
I need to simplify and regroup.
-PM
M:12y - BD:12/11 - D:6/13 - 4Ds
"The ultimate measure of a man is not where he stands in moments of comfort and convenience, but where he stands at times of challenge and controversy." -MLK Jr.
I hear ya on the life changing moment that BD was. I remember the feeling that I lost everything important to me in life. It was the catalyst to force change in my life. As someone tells me often, we had to do all the wrong things to learn what the right things are and how to live them consistently. It was a hell of a price to pay but I'm happy with me and still hold hope for sitch...
Originally Posted By: PatientMan
But yes, I'm questioning what I am supposed to do. I want to be in a place where I have moved forward and am good in life, but not moved so far past her that I can't come back. I don't know if that's possible once I take the first step in that direction, so I'm apprehensive to take it. The process has already begun without me allowing it, so if I actually go along with it I'm not sure what's going to happen.
Like Mach said, I don't think it's all or nothing. I truly don't think I'll ever not love or cherish my w. It also doesn't mean that while I'm moving forward it doesn't mean I have to lose hope. From your words on here my guess is you will always have feelings for your W also which is perfectly fine in my opinion.
Quote:
I guess what I'm saying is, I know where I want to go, I just don't trust that I won't change my mind once I get started on that path. I'm afraid the path will change me, so I stand here stuck. And you all are trying to help me, and maybe you're all right. But maybe not. I don't know.
Let me ask you this, how is standing here stuck helping you, or your sitch?
Personality is who the world sees, character is who you are
Let me ask you this, how is standing here stuck helping you, or your sitch?
It might be keeping me from starting down a path I don't want to or shouldn't be on. At best.
But I do realize I am in a "paralysis by analysis" mode right now, and that is no good. I am going to simplify and regroup:
Core convictions + clear goals = plan of action.
-PM
M:12y - BD:12/11 - D:6/13 - 4Ds
"The ultimate measure of a man is not where he stands in moments of comfort and convenience, but where he stands at times of challenge and controversy." -MLK Jr.
