Just saying hello.

[prometheus]

......Keep posting and read other thread's. (((hug)))

I meant to also say in that last post that coming here and reading other peoples threads seems to help me "back off the ledge" when i am feeling particularly low. I will try to post more often. Maybe that will help me to focus and plan...sounds like a plan!

[prometheus]

When you get a chance, please let us know what complaints you have worked on.

I have had a think about this. When i faced my wife late last year, one thing i remember her saying was that i didn't look after myself. I took that as a complaint. It was true. Although i had started to make improvements before then, i suppose that my wife may not have seen them as such.

For instance, i gave up a 27 year smoking habit five years ago. Also, i have an illness which i had avoided investigating further for 15 years. Two years ago i finally went through the procedures i needed to, in order that treatment options could be presented for my case.

Both of those things were very big things for me, and i think that they symbolise the beginning of my own self awakening to the nurturing of self. They also demonstrate some move towards looking after myself - something i am not too clever at.

Since September (BD?), i have have started exercising 3 - 5 times a week and lost 9kg(20 pounds) in weight. I have studied up on nutrition and now ensure that i eat properly, am well hydrated, and that i get adequate sleep(have some trouble with this).

I sure feel a lot better for having instituted these changes. I have stacks more energy, and i would like to think that my mood would have been improved. I'm having trouble noticing *that* improvement. Even daily exercise seems no match for some of my emotions which can seem to well up despite my best efforts to "keep a stiff upper lip".

Which leads me on to another complaint - not being available emotionally?? or emotionally supportive.

All that i can say is that i tend to be very present these days. Am i a cold fish? No. I am very shy though, have a lot of emotional issues myself. Does that preclude me from being able to love and support other people? Gee, i hope not. I would rate myself as very unskilled and clueless though. Can you offer emotional support/safety to someone who does not trust/believe in you, as my wife seems to?

Being less sulky has got to be a part of the answer, no?

[~ kd ~]

It's interesting how sometimes, changes in a LBS can trigger a WAS/MLCer to BD. Which is where script like, "too little, too late" can be heard.

Obviously, those two major changes were a big step for you in a good direction. And yes, your W may not have recognized them as such... or... she DID... and your changes then triggered her because YOU were suddenly different. You changed yourself, the sitch changed, and she could not follow the same patterns.

Give your chemicals a chance to catch up with your physical changes. Eventually, you are likely to notice a positive change in your emotions. If you don't notice any changes in a few weeks, maybe seek a dr. regarding that.

There's a big difference between emotionally available and emotionally supportive. And no, right now it is OK for you to be neither, for your W. You can be physically available and physically supportive if she were to ask, but you need to be emotionally detached if you are to stay off the roller coaster.

That said, are you emotionally OPEN with others? That means, shy or not, do you find it difficult to be emotionally open and vulnerable with friends?

On emotionally supportive, are you able to be empathetic (rather than rescuer) with others who might be down?

[prometheus]

...changes in a LBS can trigger a WAS/MLCer to BD.

I realise that i have left out some pertinent info...W was thinking about this stuff before i brought it up. She went away for a couple of days in July, 2012, to have a bit of a think about things. Then, in October, 2012, she went on a week long spiritual/healing retreat(for her birthday).

I came across the notes that she had written during that trip that she took in July. I found them some time after W had written back to me saying that she could not be / did not want to be married to me any longer (towards the end of August). :-( I was snooping, looking for answers for what was happening. They revealed that she was weighing up the pros and cons of staying married, detailed some events that she believes were significant (i can go into this if deemed advisable).

There was also a page of "wants" as well as a page of "do not wants". I photographed the notes. I was so overjoyed to find them, because it meant that my W was at least still thinking about our relationship, only a month or two before, whereas i, was under the impression from her letter to me, that we were done, and had been for a long time....

Give your chemicals a chance to catch up with your physical changes. Eventually, you are likely to notice a positive change in your emotions. If you don't notice any changes in a few weeks, maybe seek a dr. regarding that.

I am not sure what you mean here. Are you talking about the exercise? I have been doing this for months but have had no real respite from becoming emotionally overwhelmed from time to time. I have had a stint on AD's about eight or so years ago. I had no plan and just turned into an emotionless zombie. I have wondered about chemical imbalances, heard exercise helped emotionally. I think that i am too embroiled in my own personal crisis to be very objective about it though. I *really* do not want to be taking pills for this stuff. Also, my liver is compromised, so the less toxins going in the better.

That said, are you emotionally OPEN with others? That means, shy or not, do you find it difficult to be emotionally open and vulnerable with friends?

I have found this ^^^ to be true in the past. I am working on it though, but would still consider myself to be reserved in nature. I tend to avoid confrontation like the plague, apart from friendly banter - that, i love!

On emotionally supportive, are you able to be empathetic (rather than rescuer) with others who might be down?

I would say that i am able to be most of the time. If i am feeling down myself, then i can have difficulty in being supportive. Also, if i am angry or annoyed at someone then i can be somewhat withholding in my support, i have noticed. In a work setting, i deal with situations every day where i have cause to offer such empathy to people who are down, or otherwise suffering or anguished. Seeing as how these people are rarely close friends, i don't know if that counts or not.

Thanks for listening.

[prometheus]

I have a couple of questions...

I have decided to make a point of being alert for an opportunity to make a positive comment to my wife each day. This has evolved from a suggestion by Kaffe Diem to make a list of the things that i like/admire/value/etc about my W. Is this at odds with detaching, or otherwise the wrong thing to be doing? I have tried it a couple of times since resolving to do so.

I have tried to be honest with myself as to my motives, and i believe that i am acting without expectation. I am just worried that i may be unconsciously ???? (insert unhealthy behaviour here) i don't know what.... aarrggh, i am prone to being over analytical.

[prometheus]

Hi,

I seem to be stuck for direction. How small are peoples goals? Any ideas on mustering enthusiasm? (kind of like make it 'til you fake it.)

[~ kd ~]

It sounds that while your W was contemplating the M, she had not yet come to a conclusion as to WHEN she might BD. Also, many BDs also include language that denies any indecision. Rather, it's "I am done", even though in their mind they might still be undecided.

Of course at this point it's probably moot whether your action directly contributed to the BD timing. Certainly it was bound to come, yet she may have thought longer on it if she didn't feel a need to BD at that specific time, what ever her reason to do so was.

Anyhow, it sounds like you did get some valuable information out of her notes. Something that you have been able to consider and work on. Do you know if anything appears to have changed for her, from that past "laundry list"?

Regarding the "chemicals", yes I was talking about the exercise possibly taking time for your self generated chemicals to catch up. Certainly you'd get some immediate, positive affect, although things that get you down will obviously have negative affect. If you prefer not to go on ADs, maybe find a herbalist in your area that comes with some good recommendations. Your diet and possible herbal supplements, rather than pharmaceuticals, might be able to help you out. Just be sure the herbalist is aware of any medication you ARE on. It can make a difference in what might be helpful.

I'm not necessarily a huge proponent of it either, although it is (subjectively) known to be helpful, if you seek out a Reiki practitioner or Acupuncturist.

Regarding being open and vulnerable with people, certainly you would want to be careful with strangers, although anyone is great to have practice with, within a level of safety that you would need to determine, for yourself. Do keep working on that, it is not to change who you are, although it will serve you well.

Because of your fear of being vulnerable, it might be "safe" for you to be empathetic with people who are not close friends, as you would not be otherwise emotionally invested in them. See if you can continue to work on that in your close relationships.

As far as making positive comments to your W each day, it is not necessarily contrary to detaching. Detaching really is about not being emotionally attached to things others say or do and also about not having expectations. So that said, if you can make positive comments to your W without expectations that she will respond positively to them and also without expecting that she will reciprocate and finally that if she speaks or acts negatively to those positive comments, then certainly do so. If you do it consistently and find it consistently to make her upset, then stop doing it.

Truth is, you are likely (unconsciously) hoping that it will have positive results. That is OK. If you aren't reacting negatively to lack of positive feedback from her on your comments, then your unconscious expectations are likely in check and healthy.

On goals, if you find it difficult to move towards your current goals, then break them down into smaller pieces until you find they are a challenge, yet you still work towards them.

Hope that helps.

[prometheus]

Wow! That is phenomenal assistance, Kaffe. I thank you once again for your continued support.

It sounds that while your W was contemplating the M, she had not yet come to a conclusion as to WHEN she might BD.

Yes, I think that my letter may have prompted her to act. After all, i gave her a perfect opening...

Do you know if anything appears to have changed for her, from that past "laundry list"?

I am unsure what you mean. Do you mean are there any other items that she has added to the list, or taken off? I certainly have been working on the list and believe that i have made great strides forward in addressing the items on the list. My wife dod not want to talk about the list when i brought it up. Instead she chided me for reading her personal stuff. Later on she removed the notes from her book...i don't know where they are now. Probably the bin. It matters not to me because just knowing that they existed is enough for me. My W plays things very close to her chest and i have trouble getting her to talk....so i have stopped that! More soon...

[prometheus]

Your diet and possible herbal supplements, rather than pharmaceuticals, might be able to help you out.

Thanks for reminding me of that! I have been meaning to do this; i have seen that St Marys thistle may be of help. I will seek out a herbalist though. Great idea. I might have to give meditation a go. ...although,,, I tend to fall asleep...

Regarding being open and vulnerable with people

...
What would an/some example/s of this look like. I don't want to sound emotionally challenged or anything(although i could be), it is just that i have not been in the habit of thinking about this stuff and am unsure.

Off to work now. Thanks for all of the help.

[prometheus]

I have had lots of practice being vulnerable and open with the tree at the bottom of the garden lately...i suppose that does not count though. Just back from a visit there.

Seriously, i just don't seem to be able to resist lapsing into complete lack of emotional control. I know that it is unhelpful, but i do not seem to be able to catch myself before i crack. I am probably particularly stressed at the moment because i am waiting for my wife to break the news to me that she has formally separated from me. We live under the same roof. I am finding it all very hard to stay strong, even though i know that i have to, for my own sake, and for that of my children. In fact, for every body.

I feel ashamed to admit that i found a letter addressed to my wife when i was snooping. The letter was for an appointment for an interview to obtain assistance from the government as a single parent. The appointment date has passed. I am assuming that she attended.

Aaarrrgghhh!! I don't want to be separated. Why cant' i let go?