Unlearning conflict avoidance 5

[MrBond]

"Okay, I slept upstairs last night, without any further blowback from W."

Stop expecting her to get upset. After reading through your posts about how your W "prowls" around and all the other things you've said about your W, you mindread ALOT. Stop that. Just observe and counter.

"What is the next challenge? "

Stop being afraid. Look her in the eye as a man would. What did you and your T discuss about this? What about your meetings with the other men that you were supposed to set up?

[Wonka]

Luke,

I've been following your sitch for a long time. My heart goes out to you and your family.

How to be pro-active toward W?

First things first. Your lack of self-respect, self-worth and self-confidence is projected outward and your family picks up on that...especially W. Because of that lack, W treats you with contempt and acts accordingly.

You come across in your posts as Eeyore. No wonder your W beats up on the 'horse' that's you.

To address your question above, my strong recommendation is for you to start walking with your shoulders thrown back and back straight. Start practicing that until it becomes comfortable and then it will seep into your pores. Then you'll start believing in yourself.

Start doing this with your work colleagues and the public EVERY single moment. Speak in friendly, confident, & steady tone.

Can you do this?

[LuckyLuke]

There is no let-up:

W is pushing it again, just asked me if I had had a chance to think about weekend's BD. Says she thinks D and new lives would be better for both of us. I said she may well be right, but that this was still a shock. She says you've known 10 years, I say, yes, but it is still a shock.

She explains that we should do paperwork now, as there is a 6 month waiting period, given that our daughter is still 15. After 16, there is no waiting period. I said I needed to think.

What to do? I leave for US in 36 hours. Filing here (Sweden) starts a clock ticking, as I understand it, D is final after a year:

A legal separation period is not a preliminary requirement under Swedish law. However, both parties will go through a reconsideration period under two scenarios: firstly, if both parties request for a reconsideration period. Secondly, they have a child below the age of 16.[20]

If one spouse does not consent to the divorce, a reconsideration of 6 months will follow before the divorce.

not very luck Luke

[LuckyLuke]

Wonka, Mr. Bond,

There is no hurry to file in one way, as we likely should have the house until the end of the school year (just a lot less hassle for everyone). I also do not think she can finish all the renovation in 6 months. I always have the option of not consenting to the divorce, and thereby get 6 months more. She wants to file however, that is clear, and mentioned that she didn't need me to agree.

Talk about repeated blows to the gut.

Mr. Bond: T and I discussed setting up a lunch club for men, which I am doing. First date is Oct. 17. I also saw my French guy friend this past Saturday, for drumming to the sunset and dinner. That front is advancing at least.

Wonka: the funny thing is that I am often good with people - I smiled at a woman with a nice dog today, she smiled back, and then also at the supermarket, getting a nice gaze back from the cashier. I walk tall, generally (being tall helps). So yes, I can do that.

* * *

Not sure any of this will make a difference in the slide toward D, but at least I can be happier.

* * *

What attitude to take toward W? Do I help her out in this, make the D mutual (by also signing the paperwork), help out renovating? I don't want an enemy later, as I imagine we will still need to communicate sometimes. Do I embrace the D or fight it? I treated her in a confident manner during this latest round.

What a lousy way to have my world messed with, a marvelous send-off present for Wednesday's long trip to the States.

I still think my W is beautiful and smart and sexy and my physical type, but boy, is she difficult to live with. I am changing for the better, more toward her type, but it is quite probably too late (she said so).

Do I start internet dating (the EE folks have helped me prepare a profile) or go see an old (divorced) girlfriend in Denmark or contact a woman I met on the plane this summer? If this is to the final act, how shall it be played?

L

[LuckyLuke]

Gonna start another thread before this one locks.

L

[25yearsmlc]

Okay, I slept upstairs last night, without any further blowback from W. What is the next challenge? If I am going to lose my W, how can I become a better person, learn something, get stronger, in doing so? I owe my daughter this.

Luke, you have already lost your wife. Now it's about not losing yourself. YOU JUST DO IT.

You have so little self respect and I cannot imagine what that shows your d. But you DO have a chance at change and showing your d that change has to be worth it.

You say you are not good at conflict. NO ONE HERE LIKES IT, seriously. But it's adult behavior. I don't know how you escaped ever needing to resolve conflict while growing up, maybe you were an only child. But for years now, you have avoided conflict so much that it made nearly everything WORSE.

WHen you stopped sleeping together, i asked you what reason she gave. You said you "never asked"....in all those YEARS??

Think about that. A wife stops sleeping with her h, has him kicked out of the room and you never asked her why....you never expressed your needs or how they are not met...you lack ANY intimacy with her and never discuss it. I think the issue of losing her has been answered. As she drifted farther and farther away, you were so afraid of taking ANY stand, she just kept drifting off and now seems too far away.

You want to know what you risk by standing up for yourself? You risk far more by NOT standing up for yourself. You need to see this.

So what are you afraid of losing? Your d will be moving off to college soon enough. Your w is making plans for the house to be sell better (hence the renovations) and you are ....just watching.

Show your d a man she'll want to spend time with, or she'll see you as the butler too.


How to be pro-active toward W?

Again, I am very thankful to you all,

Luke

What were your plans after the workshop? You had an action plan. Did you think then you'd save the marriage or you'd learn to stand up for yourself?

IF there is any chance of a reconcilation and I'm NOT saying there is, then it would be by your w seeing real change in you. She'll first react negatively, but it will trouble and eventually intrigue her.

But you cannot care about that. THis is for you. I know it's a paradox, but you must value yourself more.

Also don't you earn the bulk of the family income? How will SHE make it financially without you? And please stop talking about living in "the cellar" unless it has windows and is a real apartment. It sounds like a large house and she has relegated you for so long, you got used to it.

My advice is, Don't get used to alienation from your family. Sandi's words are true and spot on. Read her post again.

Don't enable your w to benefit more by staying married to you longer, legally, while not being married to you in any other way.

IS your T helping you understand your inherent worth? I know the specifics she gives you about how to create a social event are helpful, but there are deeper issues here going on. If you were once a happy man, a strong man and I know you are a gifted smart man, then what happened that you became a scared mistreated male, so frightened of his cold wife's disapproval that he'd sleep downstairs b/c she put HIS sleepwear downstairs...and let his daughter see that for years?

You have only one or two years left with your d in the home. What do you want her to see in you? What kinds of change do you want to show her? Hurry up and make those changes.

And Why NOT talk to your French friend a bit? You need to talk in real life to someone. Be discreet, no character assassination but yes, discuss...

and talk to your d! Let her get to know you - and you get to know her, away from your w.

You have my number so when you are in the US then feel free to call and we can discuss that too.