Unlearning conflict avoidance 6

[KenF]

I agree with MrBond.

my x would always nitpick and complain about what i did, and it wasnt until after i stopped being scared of her response, and let her clearly know i didnt care for it, that the nitpicking stopped. all those years of cowering and it took one time for me standing up for myself and it ended.

i believe you should stand up and be strong and solid, but not attacking. the less words the better. give her nothing to grab hold onto and argue against. dont call her anything negative, dont give reasons, dont make excuses.

just say "I will not tolerate this anymore."

setting boundaries is all about you. it should be about You not allowing her to hurt you. You cant control her actions, but you can control your response, and whether or not you'll allow it to continue.

if you want to wait till after your return from the states, then all you need to tell her is "I will address this when i return" you dont need to give a reason.

[PatientMan]

"Okay - we have a split opinion here. Confront or not? Tonight or when I am back? Agree to "working on D" tonight or not?"

This isn't a democracy, we're talking about YOUR M here.

Stop asking for "votes" and start getting some b@lls. A real man makes a decision on his own and sticks with it. He doesn't think about what others think or what they think of him. This HAS TO BE YOUR DECISION. If not, then you are going to second guess yourself.

For God's sake man, STOP BEING AFRAID AND MAKE A DECISION! There is NO right or wrong answer. Be confident enough to do what you want to do. Your W once asked you to do what James Dean would do. DO THAT!

Ditto x 1,000.

Luke,

1) What do you think the "right" thing to do is? Do that. Always.

2) All this wishy-washy, overly-specific querying of posters here has gone far past seeking the advice of others into outsourcing your decision making process. Stop it. Refer to #1.

3) Ask yourself this: were all the questions you have been asking recently - all the specific "what if she says this? what if I say that? what if she insists? What if she responds in this fashion?" Was all of that REALLY you asking for advice, or was it a means to delay you engaging in what you view as a conflict with your W until you safely left the country and wouldn't have to confront her? Unlearning conflict avoidance,eh?

4)This isn't even a conflict, it's simply you stating the terms of how you will allow yourself to be treated. You need to MASTER this because it is IMPERATIVE that you teach it to your children. It is an INVALUABLE life skill and it's your JOB to teach it to them.

Do what is right. Be honorable. Be someone only a fool would leave. Be cheerful, strong, outgoing, and confident at all times (even when you don't feel it).

Travel safe. And do some serious introspective thinking while you're away. Come back ready to be who you want and need to be. Be true and honest and respectful to YOURSELF. The rest will take care of itself.

-PM

[Fartiltre]

Luke,

I believe MrBond recommended that you read Hold on to your N.U.T.s
I have done this and I believe this book would be a good read for you if you haven’t read it already.
Audible has it as audio and I just want to suggest that you spend the time in the plane wisely.

I agree with the board: You need to man up and stand your ground. You make this about you and you make your decisions.

All the best and a safe trip!

F

[LuckyLuke]

Here is what happened - W comes home sometime after 9.30, when I had already gone to bed, upstairs. Following Bond's recommendation no speech was made, and W was civil the next morning, telling me about the parents' introduction to the school night she had been to, and how rainy all the driving was. Didn't come to the door to wave goodbye or anything, but called "have a good flight". In Newark now (I pass through here pretty often).

Okay, yes, I leaned too heavily on this board, instead of strongly acting. I have a copy of NUTS, will look at it again.

Thanks - Luke

[MrBond]

Spend the time away strategizing.

[LuckyLuke]

And working on myself.

[MrBond]

I don't know if you saw 25yrsmlc's post to you at the end of your last thread, but she made a great point.

"What were your plans after the workshop? You had an action plan. Did you think then you'd save the marriage or you'd learn to stand up for yourself?

IF there is any chance of a reconcilation and I'm NOT saying there is, then it would be by your w seeing real change in you. She'll first react negatively, but it will trouble and eventually intrigue her.

But you cannot care about that. THis is for you. I know it's a paradox, but you must value yourself more.

Also don't you earn the bulk of the family income? How will SHE make it financially without you? And please stop talking about living in "the cellar" unless it has windows and is a real apartment. It sounds like a large house and she has relegated you for so long, you got used to it.

My advice is, Don't get used to alienation from your family. Sandi's words are true and spot on. Read her post again.

IS your T helping you understand your inherent worth?

And Why NOT talk to your French friend a bit? You need to talk in real life to someone. Be discreet, no character assassination but yes, discuss...

and talk to your d! Let her get to know you - and you get to know her, away from your w."

[LuckyLuke]

Writing on cell so will be short - my plan is to develop trusting relationships with more people by inviting and engaging in activities with them. I am kicking off the mens lunch club 4 days after my return - ee friends and T are helping - I think my gal activity is improving - will read suggested posts again - also have wonderful supportive friends from ee now - cell typing is a pain - yes I make the big money in the family - W can get a chunk from selling house - L

[MrBond]

Here is a story today of someone who saved their M.

http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2386576#Post2386576

[25yearsmlc]

Signing D papers makes things painfully final and concrete. Do I fight or give in?

How would you fight it? If you were given 6 more months, what would you do differently?

AMEN....LUKE, I POSTED on your last thread before seeing this one.

You NEVER asked her why you two didn't sleep together...for 9 years.

WHat would fighting FOR your marriage look like anyhow? I mean, if no intimacy was acceptable to you so much so that you did not even raise the issue

then why on earth would you suddenly 1) want this marriage and or 2) act differently?

What would be different? Sounds to me as if you have been melancholy and lonely for a decade, but you didn't look inward enough, or around enough to notice.

That makes me sad for you and frankly, maybe a divorce or SOME MOVEMENT or some ACTION

doesn't seem harmful at this point. I feel as if you have been "WAITING" for your life to happen.

But that was always and only YOUR job...

do you get what I am saying? Please read my post to you.

I wonder about your daughter so much. What must she think of a man who would say nothing abnout his own needs for so long? Who would tolerate silence and zero affection for the bulk of the "marriage" ?

You only have your d another year or so. What do you want her to see in you?

I suggest CHANGE, which is movement. Your financial arguments make sense but the rest of this analysis is fear based and seems like you just woke up and realized a huge chunk of your life has passed

in a loveless r with a woman who does Not want to be married to you.

The only way to "fight her" on this would be to CHANGE and stop being afraid of her disapproval. Do what's right and let the cards fall where they fall.

A confident man is an attractive man. A scared fragile man is not.

A man who knows he has something to offer OTHER than pancakes is a desireable man. You're smart and witty and you are a good provider. You sound kind

but beaten down. What do you want to change in YOU? And why not do it now?

Is your T working with you on the bigger issues? I mean yes you need to be CLEAR and SPECIFIC when inviting people so it shows planning and inititave on your end

but are you working on the deeper issues about your self worth?

That's a biggie and it's key to ANY happiness in a r or marriage, or in you.

Keep at this!