on the edge...

[dingo]

bump - will update on recent events after the weekend.

[dingo]

We had a pretty nice weekend. Went for a hike on Saturday and got along great. She said she was happy to be out there in the woods with me and that she was happy that we were trying to work on things. We went to church together on Sunday and talked about continuing to go every week.

After church we went grocery shopping and after we got home, she left to do some shopping on her own. One of her friends was just diagnosed with breast cancer and she wanted to find a bunch of little things to put into a care package for her. Of course, this caused me some anxiety because shopping was a typical lie for when she would go see OM. I think she sensed some discomfort because she told me not to worry about it and that there would be no shenanigans. We agreed that when she was done, she would call me and we would meet at the hardware store to pick out a new ceiling fan for our bedroom. We had also picked out a bunch of flowers/pumpkins and other fall decorations earlier in the weekend. I took her willingness to do these things as good signs because recently, she's not wanted to invest anything into our house.

However, It did take her almost 4 hours to call me, which I think is probably a bit excessive for shopping. She also didnt have a lot to show for her efforts. A box of tea, a book and some soaps. She said she went to a number of different stores and browsed a bunch but didnt really find what she was looking for. She had also stopped a nearby apple orchard and picked up some things from there. Long story short is that to me, the story is somewhere on the borderline of 'did she have significant unaccounted for time or was her story fairly legit?'

So we picked up the fan, went home to cook dinner and watched some football. We decided not to see the MC again this week and opted out of a long weekend in Canada for our anniversary (10/8) in favor of going out to dinner and possibly a shorter trip. Her reasons for not wanting the long weekend were cost and lack of available vacation time (she needs to save some for minor surgery she has scheduled for later this month). Overall, the interactions between us were fairly lukewarm. Occasionally we would laugh and be really friendly and then other times she seemed distant. When we went to bed she was pretty friendly and cuddly.

When we woke up this morning, I reminded her that she had forgotten to tell me that she took care of the situation at work and ended things. She said that she didn't get a chance to last week because she was out of the office on Friday (which she was). I asked her if this is still what she wanted to do and when she said yes, told her that its very important for her to take care of that as soon as possible. She said that she would get it done today. We had a nice pleasant drive in to work, she gave me a kiss goodbye and that brings us to this moment.

I am still trying very hard to keep things easy, light and fun between us. I am trying to continue to not bring up relationship talk or pressure her. I am trying to give her space when she asks for it and I think I have been moderately successful at this. We havent really discussed plans for reconciliation or had any deep relationship talk in a while. However, I did mention that later this week we should try to come up with a plan for her to make sure there are no 'reverts' back to the affair and what I can do to help her with that. She said she would think about those topics and have some ideas before we talk. We have no had an argument in a while either.

My assessment is that she's still on the fence about things. Her failure to take care of business last week doesn't show a lot of initiative in my opinion although I understand that its probably a very difficult thing for her to do even if she does genuinely want to end it. So my next moves are just to continue to be there for her, be a good husband and not give her any opportunities to view me negatively.

[sandi2]

Sandi - I assume that when you refer to a marriage healing program, you are referring to a book or method that gives steps that we can take to work things through. Can you recommend one that we would both participate in?

I wish I could, but the ones I would like to recommend are not allowed b/c of board policy. You need a program that deals with the healing after an affair. There are more marriage improvement books and programs than you could shake a stick at, but they don't get down into the real meat of your problem. You can look in any woman's magazine or google marriage and find somebody's ten tips to have a happy MR. Most of that junk is useless. Search for authors, or marriage programs that have addressed the issues after the affair. Even doing a google search could lead you in the right direction.

There are some that are considered tough love, in comparison to what you may hear on this board. Then there's some that aren't tough enough. So, you just have to search. Don't take too long, however, b/c she needs the guidance and direction right now. You will discover pretty quickly if she is serious about ending the A and working on the M.

I will warn you, what you experienced and heard from your W this past weekend....has happened to others, but it was not enough to end the A.

When speaking with her about the steps to take to prevent repeating the same mistakes, it might be wise to choose your words carefully. Yes, she was the one who was unfaithful and had the A, but this will be a work that requires both of you determined to protect the M. She may be quite sensitive and feel you are placing all blame on her.

Good job in having a relaxed weekend. Keeping it light and fun was the way to go. It gives the mind & heart a mini-break for a couple of days.

Does your W have a little older & wiser respected lady for her role model?

[dingo]

Well - crap kinda hit the fan last night. On the way home I thanked her for taking care of the situation that day and she said that she hadn't. When I asked her why, she said she knows she needs to but can't bring herself to do it. Then she started in with, I'm not sure what I want, I told you that I would end it because our anniversary is coming up and I wanted to have a good time for that....blah blah blah.

I pressed her for a decision. That may not be the right move but I am getting pretty sick of being in limbo. Its gone on for 4 months now and I dont think giving her more time to have a solid husband and an OM is going to allow her to 'make up her mind.' She sat quietly for a while and then came up with 'I can end the affair and commit 100% to this marriage for the next two weeks.' Again, that just sounds like limbo to me and I said it wasn't something I was interested in doing. After some back and forth, she agreed to commit 100%. I then asked her to call the OM and end the affair and stuck to it when she pushed back with 'i'll tell him face to face in the morning.' She did call him that night and as of today, the affair is 'over.'

I took your advice Sandi and actually gave her a printout of portions of one of your earlier posts about finding someone she trusts and respects to help her through this and hold her accountable. She insisted that her other relationship is not an 'addiction', is more than just an infatuation, etc. and i told her that he is probably who she should be with then. She came back with 'well, he's not my knight in shining armor and i get more out of my relationship with you but i am not sure you can give me everything i want.'

To make a long story short, she says she wants to give the marriage a shot but isnt really taking any action to make it happen. I passed along some articles for her to read, suggested that she find a friend to talk to, told her some things she can do to help me so that I can help her and even passed along some job ads for her to look at. She drags her feet, seems uninterested or just does things with a sullen, passive-aggressive look on her face that tells me she's just patronizing me.

On paper right now, the marriage is on and the affair is off. I don't know if that's going to change after work today. I don't know if she will revert or how she'll maintain minimal contact (as they work together, its the best I can hope for....). She's told so many lies and revealed so many other motives for her actions (like saying she was in the marriage just to get to our anniversary) that I don't trust a single thing she says anymore. Hell, as she was making the call with the OM to end the affair, I found myself wondering if they weren't just going to shoot the breeze with each other for a few minutes and then come back and tell me it was taken care of. All of this and the utter lack of respect I have for him (I didn't have a whole lot of regard for him before I found out about the affair and obviously even less now) which is slowly turning into lack of respect for her for choosing that and betraying our marriage with that came crashing down on me last night.

Now I am not sure what I want. I don't want to get divorced but I don't know if there's a way to prevent it at this point. I don't even know why I don't want to get divorced anymore. I do know that don't have the energy to carry 100% of this anymore and she has just not showed any ability to take responsibility of her actions and take charge of her situation. She's admitted that she feels horribly guilty whenever she talks to him but can't stop herself; but cannot look critically at herself to recognize that thats exactly how an addiction works.

Tensions got a little elevated last night and while we didn't have a full on argument, voices were raised at times and we were on the verge. We had a relatively decent car ride in this morning and talked about weekend plans for our anniversary. She asked me to give her some space to find some friends and work things out, to let her get through her surgery and she'll quit her job and to just accept that she's going to be sullen and miserable for a few days. I don't think she'll follow up on any of it and am inclined to just file and put this chapter of my life behind me.

[Breakdown]

Sorry Dingo.

Pressuring her isn't going to work. She's going to have to really want it.

I don't think many people have the will the break off an affair without something dramatic happening, and most of the time I think they have to really sense the loss of their spouse. Until she really believes she may lose you, I think she will try to keep both of you in play.

Love Must be Tough is a really good book on self respect. You might want to check that out.

[Pudmuddle]

I don't think many people have the will the break off an affair without something dramatic happening, and most of the time I think they have to really sense the loss of their spouse. Until she really believes she may lose you, I think she will try to keep both of you in play.

Nicely said! I'm going to include this in my things to reread.

[dingo]

Thats a great point and something that I am realizing to be the case. Unfortunately, I was raised with some tough love, was a military officer, etc so I don't have a lot of patience for lack of character, integrity or determination. I don't know if I can divorce her until I want to and once I get to that point, I don't think I will be able to turn it back on. I don't know how many more betrayals I can take.

The only thing that keeps me in this right now is that given the chance, the last 2-3 times she's had to make a decision about us, she's opted for the marriage. Before that, it was always divorce. When Ive brought up divorce, she's always backed me off. I don't know if this further manipulation for her to hold on to both relationships or if its a slow but genuine realization.

With respect to the affair, before she used to say that its what she wanted. Her logic now is that she wants the marriage but since she can't seem to resist the affair, it must be whats best for her. Crazy logic...

[Spartan]

I agree with Breakdown. Pressuring her will not work and will likely only make things worse. This is a LONG process buddy and being in limbo for 4 months, while it $ucks and feels like an eternity, is really not very long at all.

I also agree that it usually takes something big to make the WAS change directions (especially when an A is involved).

Has she ever really felt like she's going to lose you? What things are you doing to begin moving forward with YOUR life (w/ or w/o her)?

Sigh, I have to agree with BD again here which isn't good for me . That is an excellent book to read

[jp787]

Hi Dingo.

Time and space. Don't push as that never works. I'm not saying don't stand up for yourself, but she needs to figure out what she wants.

What would you like from your W?

Can you forgive her?

I guess I am not sure what I want from her other than to just have her as a partner through the rest of our lives.

I don't know if I can forgive her but its something I think about and would like the chance to see if its possible.

M

It also looks as if you may need to think really hard about what you want...

[dingo]

so time and space, but stick up for myself. How do I give her time and space, knowing that that results in spending time with OM? Then she comes home and I am supposed to keep things light and easy and not talk about the affair or the relationship. One of the things that she complained about our marriage was that I didnt help enough in the kitchen. So I have been making an extra effort to keep it clean. She comes home after her time and space, the kitchen is clean, the dishes are done and she has zero accountability. How do i give her time and space and also maintain accountability??

how do i do that while still living in the same home, while still sleeping in the same bed, while still doing 70-80% of our activities together?

We cant afford for either of us to move out. I could go stay at my mom's but i dont really feel good about being the one that has to leave. I could ask her to stay with some of her friends but that will almost certainly result in staying with OM - do i set that possibility up?

I could sleep in the guest bedroom

Do I start doing the things that we always did together without her? What if she asks to come along (she always does)? Do I tell her she can't come along? That always raises more questions in her that she accuses me of lying about when i answer.

I do plenty of my own thing- with friends, by myself. That has never been the problem. I feel like I can't its impossible to get out of each others way right now...