on the edge pt 2

[dingo]

I guess my previous thread (link below) got too long so I will start a new one.

http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubb...955#Post2404955

A brief summary is that my situation is a lot like the classic walk away wife situation. She had issues with the marriage and i wasn't fully aware of them until she decided it was too late. I was made aware of this in May 2013 She had an affair with a person from work and we have been trying to hold things together since. I found out about the affair in July 2013, though it had supposedly started in May 2013. It has supposedly been over since September 2013. She did work with the OM for all of that time but has since accepted another job that she starts in a few weeks.

I haven't posted in a while to try to slow things down in my own head and figure out what I want from all of this. Last time I posted, she was going to move out and was about to sign a lease on an apartment. I had told her that crosses the line for me and that I would file for divorce if she did. She signed the lease and was served papers the next day. The following day she had another change of heart and claimed she wasn't ready to give up on us. She called the landlord and he let her get out of the lease. We agreed to let things sit through the holidays, let her get settled into her new job and that if on 2/1/14, she still felt like she needed to move out, I would be willing to do that without filing for divorce.

Things seemed to go mostly ok the last 10 days, nothing really special one way or the other - just kind of existing and falling back into our normal lives. I tried to give her space when she needed it but still tried to be affectionate and understanding. My brother and his girlfriend are up for the holiday and we did many family things together. We planned to go out to her family's house for Thanksgiving and were talking about plans for Christmas.

Apparently today, the landlord called her and said he didn't have another tenant and would be willing to drop the price. She agreed again to sign the lease. The reasons are the same as before: this is what I want to do, this is what I feel like I need to do, I can't get any clarity on the situation in the house, I don't know if I love you anymore, I don't know if we ever should have gotten married, I can't give you what you deserve, etc.

I think the advice here would be to allow her to move out and let things sit for a little while before I make a decision on what I want to do. I am having a very very hard time with that. I had not yet called my lawyer since she was served to cancel the filing and I am inclined to just move forward. I feel like this is the last way that I can stand up for our marriage and myself. I do see some merit in what she says but given the affair and her inability to live up to her own agreements, I don't see a good way out of this. I don't know if I would be able to trust her again, not only because of the affair but because she can't hold herself to her word.

I don't want to make a huge mistake but I just think that if being served papers isn't a wake-up call, the relationship and her feelings are a lot further gone than I ever could have suspected.

[melissag]

Hi dingo . . . sorry things have been such a roller coaster lately. One thing you wrote struck me, though - that filing for divorce would be the last way you can stand up for your marriage. That doesn't make much sense to me. How is filing for D sticking up for marriage?

It sounds to me like your W has some issues to work through, and she knows that. She is asking you for the space to get the clarity she needs. Perhaps she will become clear that she doesn't want to be married to you, but maybe she will realize she *does* want to be married to you.

What do you want? Do you want to be divorced? Or are you using it as a way to protect yourself? Put your guard up? Teach her a lesson? Try to make her change her mind? If it's not for reason #1, then you might want to rethink that decision. If you want to be married to her, then you need to decide whether "standing up for yourself" by pursuing the D is really worth it, keeping in mind that you cannot control what she does, and filing for D isn't going to change that.

If I were you, I would sit with this for a bit, for YOU. Not for her. But for yourself. I doubt you are in a sane enough frame of mind right now to be making big decisions.

Just my $.02.

[dingo]

I don't necessarily want to get divorced but in many ways, I feel like I already am. The love she had for me seems to be gone, at least at the level to where she is willing to commit to a life together and is willing to do the little things that make the relationship work. Regardless of whether there are still loving feelings there or whether a piece of paper says we are still married, the true connection is not there right now - maybe never to be regained.

I guess what I meant was that I wanted to stand up for my marriage and what it means to me. Commitment, perseverance, love, support, etc. Many of those characteristics she has not shown that she possesses - at least not now.

What I ultimately want is probably what everyone wants - to have someone to share my life with and have a family with. While I would want nothing more than for that person to be my wife, I am not naive enough to think that she is the only person in the world with which that is possible. I am also starting to wonder if, at this point, its not better to just end the chapter and start a new one with someone else. I know that's not being committed but how do you stay committed to someone who isn't committed to you? I am starting to feel like I am wasting my life and time.....

[dingo]

This has by far been the hardest couple of days since this whole thing started. For the first time I understand some of the first advice I got from the community here which was 'don't underestimate how done she really is.' We have argued back and forth the last 12 hours with me asking her not to move out and her asking me not to pursue the divorce. I have offered a couple of compromises but she won't entertain them.

She is envisioning that she will come over a few nights a week for dinner and we will meet for coffee in the morning after she moves out. I am envisioning going dark. We just can't seem to agree on anything right now. Even holiday plans are all over the place.

I am trying to be hopeful and caring but I just do not think I can go through a separation. I have been spinning things over and over in my head all morning trying to find some middle ground but it seems there is none.

I am also trying not to categorize all of our interactions as good or bad but she has said some hopeful things. Problem is, I get the impression that it's just to let me off easy. I don't think I am interested in just a friendship. At least not for a long time.

[dingo]

Well the lease is signed (again) and she is moving out. She is a lot less emotional about everything this time and it seems like she has firmly made up her mind that she needs to do this. I have accepted that she's leaving and will let her go without any further discussion.

Although I have not told her yet, I have also decided to give her the benefit of the doubt and be patient. I will not push the divorce right away but will see how things go for a while. At the moment it's because I don't really know what I want so I am going to do nothing until I am sure. As much as this hurts, there is no stopping it.

So here is where I need some advice. How do I handle the next few weeks? As I have said before, almost all of our iinteractions are positive except when we talk about the relationship. Do I continue these and act as if things are ok? How about when she leaves? Do I take her up on her offers to hang out? Do we spend the holidays together?

She insists that the affair is over and that it's not having a direct impact on her decision. That being said, I am sure that feelings that the affair awakened are why she is questioning everything.

She keeps saying that she thinks there's a real chance for us but it's 'too late' for any of the things I suggest - like taking some time before moving out or letting her get settled in her new job away from the OM.

I guess I feel like I can't make any more mistakes with her- like calling a lot, trying to compromise, etc. Relationship talks are just so hard because it's like we are speaking different languages.

[melissag]

What you should do depends on what you want to do. It seems like you are not sure. Take a couple of weeks and think about it. See her if you want to. If you don't, it's OK to tell her it hurts too much and you need some time to think. But either way, do NOT talk about the R. In fact, if I were you, I would follow the 37 rules regardless, because (a) they are to help YOU; and (b) if, after some thought, you decide you want to stand for your marriage, you will have already started. Everyone has to figure out for themselves how to handle the details - the holidays, etc. Don't plan too far ahead - just take one day at a time and see how you feel. If you see her and it's just too much for you, then don't see her for a while. But whatever you do, don't bring up your M, don't fight with her, and don't threaten that you will file for D.

IMO, if she is saying she wants to move out, but doesn't want D, then she is confused. I think she has already told you she needs space to figure out what is going on in her head. So you have two choices. You can give it to her kindly, or you can throw a tantrum. I know it's human instinct to throw a tantrum, but regardless of the outcome of all this, it won't do anyone any good. So whatever you do, just be sure you are handling yourself with dignity. If you decide you do want to stand, then sure, go hang out with her. Enjoy your positive interactions. But follow the 37 rules - biggest one being don't whine to her and don't bring up the M or the future.

The other thing you need, need, need to do, regardless, is GAL. Do NOT sit at home and wallow in your misery. Do not isolate yourself from others. I know it is REALLY hard to go out and do things when you are miserable, but do it anyway. It will get easier, and you will feel better. (Yes, it's all relative, but better is better, right?) Make sure you exercise. Endorphins are huge. Hang out with your friends. Post on here. Don't sit around constantly thinking about her and what she's doing and thinking.

After a little while of GALing, and just with the passage of time. you will start to calm down a little and be able to see more clearly and figure out how you feel and where you want to go from here. I think you are smart not to make any big decisions right now. Give it some time.

Hang in there!!

[jp787]

What you should do depends on what you want to do. It seems like you are not sure. Take a couple of weeks and think about it. See her if you want to. If you don't, it's OK to tell her it hurts too much and you need some time to think. But either way, do NOT talk about the R. In fact, if I were you, I would follow the 37 rules regardless, because (a) they are to help YOU; and (b) if, after some thought, you decide you want to stand for your marriage, you will have already started. Everyone has to figure out for themselves how to handle the details - the holidays, etc. Don't plan too far ahead - just take one day at a time and see how you feel. If you see her and it's just too much for you, then don't see her for a while. But whatever you do, don't bring up your M, don't fight with her, and don't threaten that you will file for D.

IMO, if she is saying she wants to move out, but doesn't want D, then she is confused. I think she has already told you she needs space to figure out what is going on in her head. So you have two choices. You can give it to her kindly, or you can throw a tantrum. I know it's human instinct to throw a tantrum, but regardless of the outcome of all this, it won't do anyone any good. So whatever you do, just be sure you are handling yourself with dignity. If you decide you do want to stand, then sure, go hang out with her. Enjoy your positive interactions. But follow the 37 rules - biggest one being don't whine to her and don't bring up the M or the future.

The other thing you need, need, need to do, regardless, is GAL. Do NOT sit at home and wallow in your misery. Do not isolate yourself from others. I know it is REALLY hard to go out and do things when you are miserable, but do it anyway. It will get easier, and you will feel better. (Yes, it's all relative, but better is better, right?) Make sure you exercise. Endorphins are huge. Hang out with your friends. Post on here. Don't sit around constantly thinking about her and what she's doing and thinking.

After a little while of GALing, and just with the passage of time. you will start to calm down a little and be able to see more clearly and figure out how you feel and where you want to go from here. I think you are smart not to make any big decisions right now. Give it some time.

Hang in there!!

Very nice post and great advice!!!

D, remember it is a choice to fight for your M and it is not quick or easy.

I think you are seeing some light with not pushing the D. If you want to save the M it will take lots of patience and doing some things that don't feel quite right.

Time, space and patience.

You work on you, focus on you, be the person you want to be.

[dingo]

I ended up going to her family's house for thanksgiving. We had a pretty ok ride out - I helped her set up a new cell phone and we had some light conversation. The holiday was great with her family but she was a little bit distant. I didn't let that bother me and enjoyed myself with the rest of her family. Yesterday we spent time at her uncles and it was more of the same. Great time with everyone else but she was just a bit strange. Its hard to explain but she treated me like we were just really good friends would be the best way to describe it. Not a lot of touching or closeness.

That evening, she went out with a couple of high school girlfriends and I went out for a couple of drinks with her sister and friends. She came and met us out after she was done with dinner and we had a fun time until we got back to her dad's house.

She decided she didn't like that I was having fun with her family and went out with her sister while she is trying to figure out what is going to happen with us. She accused me of coming out here and putting on a show for her. I assured her that it wasn't the case. then she started talking about how she was moving out and how we need to get a divorce because she can't be trusted. She admitted that she had called the om for a few minutes earlier in the evening and said she is just having a lot of trouble sticking to her no contact. She showed me the call log and it was a 5 minute call presumably just to say happy thanksgiving. It got a little messy after that with her saying a bunch of conflicting statements about her feelings and her hopes for us. She got frustrated with me again but I listened mostly but did tell her that a separation without a commitment to no contact would not work for me.

She agreed to it -again - and said she had looked into another counselor to help her maintain it. I offered up some of my sessions here that I still have and after some discussion, she told me I can give her the phone number.

What hasn't changed is her desire to move out, although I did find out that she hasn't signed the lease yet. Supposedly that will happen tomorrow. She is still obviously a mess of emotions and is less further along than I thought.

[dingo]

So things are better this morning. I have read some other threads and have resolved myself to act as if nothing is wrong on our car ride home. Interestingly enough, this morning she is once again 'leaning towards moving out.'

I have rrealized that the hardest part for me has been seeing results (or thinking I am seeing results) only to regress. As hard as it will be, I find myself wondering if I need the separation as much as she does. I just keep ggetting hung up on the OM and how deeply she's mired in that...

[dingo]

She's packing stuff now and everything is suddenly very real. I think I will be heading up to my mom's house shortly just to get away for the day.

We did end up talking about things in the car yesterday - she initiated. She said that we have great friendship and companionship but somehow the passion was lost and she hasn't been able to get it back. That and the standard grievances of me being selfish and controlling are why she has to move out and evaluate things. I tried to validate but I did say that since the beginning she has known the importance of getting away from the om and continuing to work with him doesn't help. She said that it's been difficult because she does have a passion and feelings for him and can see him as her partner but she doesnt know if thats real or just the affair feelings. That was a pretty tough blow to take.

I am trying to follow advice here but I think I am a terrible DBer. My mind is all over the place. Rationally I guess I think that while there is still some hope, there isn't much. The affair was really only going on for 4-5 months but she would rather lose me and keep him than the opposite. She can't stay away, misses him too much and always falls off the wagon when it comes to no contact. Of course my emotions come into play and I don't want to lose her or lose what we have.