Unlearning conflict avoidance - 10

[sandi2]

Good job!

[LuckyLuke]

Duds, not dudes!

[sandi2]

Funny!

[sandi2]

Have you written poems to her in the past? I think it is a lovely way to express one's thoughts and feelings. It could be a doorway for a guy who says he has a problem knowing how talk to his D.

To be honest, Luke, I was about to give up. But seeing you actually put forth some effort, has blessed my day! Please do not back out of giving her this poem. I think she will love it........especially the part about shopping.

[25yearsmlc]

MLC - I had a wonderful woman a long time ago, my W. I'd like to go back there, to then, where she called me a tender nickname, to where I had a companion, etc.

I don't know if you can get that woman back. When you came here in 2004, you said it had already been a few years of distance and loneliness. That's more time spent feeling bad in the marriage, than good.

Plus, I don't think you really believe she's in there for you. OR You don't want her. I say that b/c I think by now you'd have changed, if you wanted to.


Reading what I wrote in 2005 is really depressing - nothing changed from then to now.

I'd like to keep the kind, nice, me (clearly insufficient for M!), and learn or change enough to get back there.

Really? I mean, Luke, do you think being nice and kind is actually the problem? Do you think being an Alpha male means NOT being kind? I believe You know better.


If there were a class in alphaness I would go (*I would love any suggestions*). It might do something for my self esteem also.

Now this^^ is just NOT true. You have all the information you need in these posts and you have read books on it (and others have been suggested). YOU KNOW HOW...but you don't DO...

so if you took the class and got an A+, I don't believe a thing would change inside your home. Not significantly. It's not the lack of knowledge you lack, it's the inertia you succumb to under the guise of "pondering", OR your CHOICE Not to change.

Luke, for the record, you are entitled to NOT change. You are allowed to say "I cannot or will not become an Alpha male in any area of my life."

I'm just saying, you could have told her that a decade ago. I'm baffled by your presence here and the frequent asking "how???" when you're given a ton of advice on exactly that, but you choose or are Not able to follow through. So what difference would a class make?

I'd see an IC to figure out why that is. B/c there's no way you can say no one has told you anything like, say

-act confident around your w, be decisive
-be upbeat around your family, not needy
-have friends of your own, there, and socialize on your own or host things at the house yourself
-stop hiding. Sleep in your bedroom & eat in the kitchen/dining area.
-speak up for yourself every single day. That's NOT being a jerk, it's having self respect.
-confront your wife in the moment, when she's rude or inappropriate'
-make time for your children and you

^^ Those are things we have said dozens or a hundred times. Maybe you need to role play it out b/c of the paralyzing fears you seem to have of your w and now your d, but that's for your counselor or therapist to work on.

You DO have the information you need, but the ACTION is lacking.

That's where I'd dig deep if I were you. What stops you from DOING?


I have changed, at least a little, sometimes asserting myself ("occupy space!" as my T said). I have tried to be stylish (I read it is an alpha trait). I have sometimes confronted my W.

Insufficient.

Yes, and It has been insufficient for a long time. I think the changes you have made outside your family life are good. But it was your family life that mainly propelled you here and your changes within the family appear from where I sit, to be moving at a glacial pace. I'm so sorry to say that. But when you seem confused, I get baffled at that.

I think your w mapped out a way to her heart, years ago. You did not follow that path and it must have felt a lot like rejection, to her. Maybe you two were in a stand off about who'd make the first big move. In her eyes, you made zero moves.


If some alphaness is required for a good R with a woman, then this does not bode well for the future.

You won't have ten+ years of history however. And perhaps, perhaps you will meet someone worth communicating directly with. Going out on a limb, etc.

I can't speak for all women of course. But most healthy women I know, want a man who is at least their equal and that's not in the IQ department alone.

If we were in caves, the female would choose the mate most likely to keep her safe and protected, with food on the table and a roof over their heads...

we don't feel safe/protected by a man if he fears talking to us, or lets us walk all over him.


If my R with my d is lousier for my not being alpha, then this s----s even more.

Luke, we've said this^^ many times. All your d is aware of with you, is what she has seen...all her life. Of course it affects your R.


It makes me quite sad actually. And if my more alpha W gets the kids more than I do, then even more so, I would feel scr***d over in the place that hurts the most.


I think you need to figure out why you acted like a spectator with your own life.

As if you were in the audience watching, while the Story of your life was played out on stage, instead of YOU authoring and starring in it.


I have two visions of old age, one positive (with a woman who cares for me, socially integrated, happy) and one negative (bicycling from historical town to historical town, alone, until I get hit by a truck and it is all over).

Where is the class or training that fixes this? I do not want this pain.

You cannot repair the past. You can only go "from this day forward", and Luke, I promise you the answers are in you and this site, and all around you. It's the CHANGE IN BEHAVIOR you never really chose to do in any significant noticeable way...that's the rub of this. That's where you need to go before it's truly too late.


Thanks for caring, MLC.

Luke

I care a lot Luke. I do. I want to see you actualized so much more than you have been. You have scratched the surface and when you were AT the workshop and in the safest emotional place you'll ever find (outside a loving family) you did some good work.

But if you don't apply what you learned there, to the "real world" then it only does you so much good.

(((( ))))

[MrBond]

That was an extremely poignant and to-the-point post, 25. Great read.

[Wonka]

Luke,

Amen to what 25 summarized to you for all of us here. I'm gonna take your engineering mind here and hope to give you another perspective on what 25 said ^^^^.

Luke: 2 + 2 = 4 right? (I am not using Calculus here..I flunked it! )

25: Yeah, how about trying getting 2 apples and 2 oranges...then add them up.

Luke: I see the apple tree. How can I approach the tree? I am afraid of the tree smacking me.

Bond: Don't be afraid. Go and climb the tree!

Luke: Bond, thank you for the suggestion. Ummm...how do I go about it?

Bond: Get a ladder!

Luke: I don't know. The ladder just may jiggle and fall under my feet. That would hurt!

Wonka: How about going to the store and buy those 2 oranges.

Luke: Ah...not the right time. The oranges haven't ripened yet. Florida is shot with crop damage so I won't bother.

Then you end up not doing your math homework because of those "fears" and "excuses". Yep, it is overly simplistic...but pretty much parallel to your approach with W (and here in DB).

You're in the same exact place as the very first math question. Same here when you first came here to DB for support.

We are not saying you have to change your personality. You are who you are. Instead we are saying to you to step up and take ACTION. Isn't what your EE training was all about, right? What good is it if you don't implement those tools?

[LuckyLuke]

Action: poem given to d16. She liked it. We hugged as she left for school this morning.

Upcoming action: Wife criticized the present. I gave it in a plain brown envelope, so she says "it's probably another IOU for a trip or something". When she comes home I'll tell her that I did not appreciate her remark.

I appreciate all your help, but also feel quite defensive just now, having taken some action (documented in my posts), such as:

o confronted W last Monday, overcoming my fear in the process
o moved back upstairs, overcoming my fear in the process
o told d16 about EE, figuring what the he**
o went to EE (and have now emailed asking about new warrior training)
o texted W yesterday saying her anger about relative was unneeded, again figuring what the he**

etc. Clearly this is not enough. I do appreciate your pushing me, but sometimes feel like I am given no credit.

Enough for now. Plus being angry at you doesn't get us anywhere and I really do appreciate your help.

Thanks,

Luke

[LuckyLuke]

Action: criticism of W's remark given. Beard shaved off. Luke

[planet]

Wife criticized the present. I gave it in a plain brown envelope, so she says "it's probably another IOU for a trip or something". When she comes home I'll tell her that I did not appreciate her remark.

Did she say it with you present?
If so, why didn't you say something there and then itself?