Spoue tried I didn't, now opposite #2

[MrCAS]

I should've been smarter to know what was going on, all the warning signs were there, and in-laws kept reiterating it to W.

Smarter? How? When I started my business back in NY and was working crazy hours, I never saw what was happening. I was too busy. I was working hard to make a future for the two of us. Too bad I didn't see how resentful my w was becoming because of it.

It looks like JF did the same thing. I can think of many people that walked that path. Does that make us bad guys? Not by a long shot. It just means we made a mistake. Beating ourselves up about it isn't going to change anything. We do, however, have the knowledge and the power to not let it happen again.

Why we were feeling left out of all the fun, we didn't see all the work that they were doing making sure everything else got done. We were too focused on one facet our blinders allowed us to see.

In my case, my wife resented that was doing what I wanted for a living. She saw what she perceived as me having "fun" and getting paid for doing it. She didn't see all the BS I had to deal with.

I saw what I wanted to see and she saw what she wanted. We both couldn't have been more wrong about each other. I remember my Daddy telling me, "Son there is three sides to every story... Your side... her side... and the truth". He wasn't referring to truth as we see it, either.

JF was absolutely correct when he says you have to own your own part. "Owning it" means accepting responsibility and doing something to correct it to make sure it does not repeat itself.

I never invited my family into our struggles by being too proud to admit I couldn't handle it.

It is, IMO, never a good thing to bring friends and family into the marital issues. Ultimately, the family will divide into two camps of alliance. You will either be a no good SOB or your W will be a no good (fill in your own word). It turns into a no win situation.

You will be offered all kinds of advice or horror stories about Uncle Jack and his first wife or the best friend's wife's hairdresser's cousin's son's stepson adopted daughter... Not to mention the hard feelings generated when you didn't follow the "sage" advice that ensues.

Pride goes out the window at this point, buddy. As hard as it is to admit that you are broken, it is the first step into reclaiming your life. You are going to have to go to some painful places... Re-visit some painful times... and make some hard decisions.

Let us know what happens at the doctors.

[whytry]

Thanks MrCas. Y'all are both hitting the nail on the head. And the 3 sides to everything is definitely how our last few years have been. When I shut down I didn't hardly speak to anyone and obviously it was due to the shame. Not sure either side of our families had a clue except what W told them. She's honest as hell but still very opinionated.

I do now know how long my in laws have been giving advice and obviously like book, they always think they are protecting their child. My children have slipped up saying what goes on when they visit and S13 has really been hurt by it. I'm not saying they are wrong by any stretch but it's obvious it's affecting my kiddos. Truth be told my mom would take my W over me but as I said before my mom lived what my W went through and D my dad. She tried to reach out to W (this is what W told me) but W I'm sure assumes it's a plea to hang on. I'm not even sure my mom would have that opinion after the last 5 years.

And I agree I'm broken inside like you mention. I relive those painful places every day but use them as inspiration to keep my focus. I can see the beauty in life now compared to those times.

OK, this wasn't a negative reflection on M, just trying to fill in the blanks hoping it helps y'all. For every bad memory, I can give 10 amazing memories that everyone (me, W, & family) is/has ignored or forgotten.

[whytry]

I copied this from my post to T0324 so maybe someone can help them out on their issue if it's seen. Also, I forgot to post to keep y'all in the loop...sorry.


"Oh that's a tough sitch. Sorry to hear that happened. I bet some oldtimers like job, mrbond, wonka, MrCas or somebody might can help you.

Recently had issue with S13 mouthing to W, blaming her etc, but the acting out and disrespect was strongly discouraged. It was an unpleasant convo, but maybe your H needs to do the same (with both y'all present at time).

Since S13 issue, we had another flare up but it was without me. I had already gone to bed, when youngest son smarted off about W drinking (knowing him it was not completely malicious but again he learned crap like that from me). Well W defended herself honestly, but S13 & S15 defended youngest boy and a nice head butting match broke out. Please avoid this if possible. I've learned how negatively this divorce stuff affects our children and they pay way more attention than I realized. Like you I got the details after the issue happened."


Also forgot, crap my memory stinks, S15 has been giving up on school work. We are constantly now getting updates (school has automated email system from teacher grade updates) for missing school work, failing grades, etc. This from a kid that's honors everything, in sports, band, academic UIL, and several others. Granted this didn't start till after BD, but I have no idea how to address. W & oldest are so much alike and way close. Please help!

[MrCAS]

When I discuss revisiting and such I am referring to doing it in counseling. You have to get to the source of the infection in order to "cure" it.

For me, it was finding the source of my anger which was physical and sexual abuse, and dealing with. To do that I spent some time with my psychologist and talked and worked it out. It was probably one of the hardest things I have ever had to do.

As far as the kids "spilling the beans", you and your W are going to have deal with the fallout already going on and tell them that Mom and Dad's business is just that... Mom and dad'd business. No one elses... What happens at home needs to stay at home. I am betting that you can do this in a clean and respectable manner.

[MrCAS]

Smarting off to my mother like that would have earned me a trip to the cellar for a beat down...

I think some one on one time with each of the boys is in order. Let them talk freely for a spell with no repercussions... Just be prepared to hear some stuff you aren't going to like. Unfortunately, that is part of the journey. Kids matter and how they feel matters. Listen to their words and watch their faces and observe the body language. It is going to tell you a lot. Saturday morning breakfast with a boatload of food helps... Just thinking out loud.

They don't have to know everything that is happening. They just need to know that Mom and Dad got their backs and they are loved.

[whytry]

I have found a couple of options on the counseling (besides my pastor). You're right I wanna dig into it but even the least expensive option is out of reach for a couple of months. Don't think I'm giving up on the counseling just can't afford yet. I was rather disappointed my current insurance doesn't cover anything but drug/alcohol dependency counseling (I went to HR to find out). My old job did cover up to 6 session. Would be really handy right now.

W & I can handle respectably like you say. We are cordial and although not close as before, both still want what's best for kiddos during this time. My concern is this happening when I'm not around so we can address at time of incident. Not that she isn't sufficiently addressing don't get me wrong, but I guess I figure they need to see a unified co-parenting front rather than only her defending herself.

Sorry for all the babbling. I'm doing my best to keep the details available. Overall I've had awesome days with kids, work, myself, and life in general. Just yesterday, I managed to get 2 youngest to baseball practice, 2 oldest to band warmup, pick up youngest 2 when done, and make it back to 2 oldest band concert. This sounds lame I know, but for me it means a lot to have the chance to be involved unlike before. Obviously W has made this kinda stuff look easy in the past so I smile at my small victories! I was stunned she even sat in chair next to me at concert. She has purposely sat on opposite end of bleachers at baseball games.

OK, OK, Ok, no more W thinking (yes I have MrCas voice in my head)....back to me. Dr. appt has me anxious, very anxious. I don't think I'm worried about the appt, but maybe the unknowns? It will be refreshing to finally have a full go over (blood work and stuff included). Nurse that has worked there for years seemed a little shocked at what I was asking. From what I understand my file had about an inch of dust on it. LMBO.

[whytry]

I agree I could do the one on one time. W discouraged any of that after BD. Remember my history that she knows me as a manipulator and will undermine her. That would be a touchy subject to bring up cuz she'll wonder WTH I'm doing and what my angle is. It'll be seen negatively for sure since I've been so honest now and she'll again assume my changes are fake and now is a good chance manipulate our children. Yes, that is my history and shame.

Let me kick the thought around. Maybe mention to her and get her temperature? I think my honesty now scares her more than anything as she's waiting for the other shoe to drop.

[MrCAS]

When I was down South, I met my psychologist through my Pastor. He was a member of the church. I didn't have a lot of money as I was running my household down there and paying for half up here. I didn't want to try the insurance because I was ashamed at the state I was in and didn't want my W to know because I was afraid that she would beat the bejeepers out of me with that kind of info...

So... Dr Dan was going to do it gratis because Pastor asked him for help. I offered to mow his lawn and such because of pride but mostly I figured I would get more out of it if I had some skin in the game.

So, that is what i did. I mowed grass, trimmed weeds, and picked weeds. Then we would sit for a bit and talk.

I am grateful for his help. I would not have gotten to the place I am at without it.

Look into pay-as-you-can type services... If you really want this, you WILL find a way to get it done.

[Cadet]

Maybe mention to her and get her temperature?

I think you should
Speak with actions not words

W & I can handle respectably like you say.
We are cordial and although not close as before, both still want what's best for kiddos during this time.
My concern is this happening when I'm not around so we can address at time of incident. Not that she isn't sufficiently addressing don't get me wrong, but I guess I figure they need to see a unified co-parenting front rather than only her defending herself.

Overall I've had awesome days with kids, work, myself, and life in general. Just yesterday, I managed to get 2 youngest to baseball practice, 2 oldest to band warmup, pick up youngest 2 when done, and make it back to 2 oldest band concert. This sounds lame I know, but for me it means a lot to have the chance to be involved unlike before. Obviously W has made this kinda stuff look easy in the past so I smile at my small victories!

I am sure this is quite attractive.

I think I already told you to be the BEST DAD you can be.

That might mean lots more taxi driving and cheerleading.

And

Setting the example you want your kids to follow.
What is that?

I hope it is NOT this

Remember my history that she knows me as a manipulator and will undermine her. That would be a touchy subject to bring up cuz she'll wonder WTH I'm doing and what my angle is. It'll be seen negatively for sure since I've been so honest now and she'll again assume my changes are fake and now is a good chance manipulate our children. Yes, that is my history and shame.

Yes lots of digging to do.

[Mach1]

You betcha. Mostly why we fought. I felt I was the only one caring about bills and carrying the financial load.

You described close to our last 5-6 years of M. Working 7 days a week (mostly 12hr shifts) really wears on ya. I should've been smarter to know what was going on, all the warning signs were there, and in-laws kept reiterating it to W. I never invited my family into our struggles by being too proud to admit I couldn't handle it.

Going back a bit here....

If I were to ask you the difference between Love and Obligation....

What would your answer be ???


How would you define Love ???

How would you define Obligation ???

How have the differences interfered with your life ???


we now resume with normal CAS chatter on this station : )