Coach suggests me doing a 180 at MC tomorrow and NOT controlling the session or clubbing W over the head with old A or new A. Prove her T wrong that I won't hold A against her.
In other words, don't sabotage the session before finding out whether W is actually receptive to MC. So, a lot of validation, STFU and letting the MC lead. Lay out the olive branch that says hey, I'm here willing to do the work.
In other words, don't sabotage the session before finding out whether W is actually receptive to MC. So, a lot of validation, STFU and letting the MC lead. Lay out the olive branch that says hey, I'm here willing to do the work.
Maybe I'm mistaken, but I haven't seen the issue as a "are you willing to do MC, wife?" but rather one of "Will MCing with my wife be effective while she is having an affair?"
Many wayward spouses are WILLING to do MC. It's just that usually it's either to validate their waywardness, prove to hostile friends and family that "see? I tried" or -- in the worst cases -- to get "permission" from a counselor to help them move toward divorce.
Many wayward spouses are WILLING to do MC. It's just that usually it's either to validate their waywardness, prove to hostile friends and family that "see? I tried" or -- in the worst cases -- to get "permission" from a counselor to help them move toward divorce.
I don't disagree, we've discussed this.
Coach's point is that another confrontation will also drive her away, because it's Zew being controlling, telling me what to do, and she'll never come back to MC, and will be able to say, "see? I tried, but it's the same old Zew". So I'd be assuring a negative outcome of the session.
And she'll deny the A, so what purpose does that serve? If I want to take that stand, I can do that anytime, there's no advantage to sabotaging the MC session with that.
So, by being nice, validating, etc. I establish that MC isn't confrontational, and maybe she sees hope.
I'm highly skeptical that WAW sees anything that isn't OM related.
Please point out to me where in my little suggested "speech" above I say ANYTHING about what your WIFE needs to do. I must have missed that. I was only advocating you standing up for what YOU need going forward, and whether or not you're going to waste your time with the charade that would be MCingin her current state of mind.
But if you trust your DB coach, you should go with what they tell you if you think it has been effective.
So I don't think she ever had intentions of turning around. She sees she survived the heat, and continues going on however she chooses. You may have drawn a line in the sand, but she more than stepped over it and daring you to do something about it.
. . . and she will now view "niceness" as just yet-another step over one of Zew's so-called lines.
Please point out to me where in my little suggested "speech" above I say ANYTHING about what your WIFE needs to do.
You didn't. Sorry, my comment was carry over from other things coach and I discussed.
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I was only advocating you standing up for what YOU need going forward, and whether or not you're going to waste your time with the charade that would be MCingin her current state of mind.
Coach is simply suggesting that the first MC session isn't the place to accuse W of A2. This is just in case W sees any ray of hope in MC. She has been in IC for the last 8 months and she says that has helped her, so maybe. She never thought I would go to MC - I've called her bluff. She squirmed a little when I told her the appt was tomorrow.
Doesn't stop me from stating: "I don't really want a divorce, and I'm willing to work on the marriage, including my own issues that didn't meet your needs. However, I'm not willing to do that if there's any possibility of a 3rd person in the marriage. And because of A1, I need some assurances. We need to work on trust, and part of that would be transparency..."
This will not be comfortable for W. I've prepped MC on the sitch, so we'll see if she can prevent W from hijacking.
I agree that this is just giving her yet one more chance to fix this on her own (unlikely) and restating previously stated boundaries (bad). I have very, very little confidence in this, but it will be the first time we actually air grievances in a moderated setting.
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So I don't think she ever had intentions of turning around. She sees she survived the heat, and continues going on however she chooses. You may have drawn a line in the sand, but she more than stepped over it and daring you to do something about it.
I concur. Unfortunately, I have to buy a bit of time, so I have to give this a try.
Why not just simply say "I don't really want a divorce, and I'm willing to work on the marriage, including my own issues that didn't meet your needs. However, I'm not willing to do that as long as there's a 3rd person in the marriage. So you can deny the last affair all you want and you can deny this new guy all you want, but I'm done talking about it and I'm done wasting my time and money here. This insults my intelligence and not only is it incredibly disrespectful to our marriage and our family, frankly -- it's very unattractive."
And get up and leave.
And she sits there with MC and denies the A. "He's just a friend." And then she comes home. And we're back to the denial cycle. And she will never, never leave. And she doesn't care if we don't MC.
ok. slept on it. A2 must come up. We have to establish boundaries of even doing MC. I have to state what I need to go forward. no ultimatum, no telling her what to do. just what I need.
ok. slept on it. A2 must come up. We have to establish boundaries of even doing MC. I have to state what I need to go forward. no ultimatum, no telling her what to do. just what I need.
Boundaries are not about controlling the other person, because boundaries are about drawing "circles" around *you* and determining what you will and won't allow inside that circle.
Your wayward wife can do whatever she wants OUTSIDE that circle. You are not telling her what to do.
But you will only let into that circle people who treat you with respect.
She's free to go on treating you with disrespect, but you won't know about it because she'll be outside your circle. She's free to go on and draw her own boundaries of no expectations and no responsibilities, outside your circle.
She can do WHATEVER she wants. She's a free person, free to make WHATEVER choices she wants.
BUT SO ARE YOU, and you are free to choose who to allow within your circle.
That's all. Not about trying to control her at all. Tell her she's totally free. She has the WHOLE WORLD, outside your circle, to go and do whatever she wants.
If she's saying you have to let her into your circle no matter what, then THAT is about HER controlling YOU.
And she sits there with MC and denies the A. "He's just a friend."
You'll have no idea how she responds (nor does it matter) -- you will have left. The purpose of such a mini-speech is to state YOUR boundaries, NOT to get her to admit something in front of the MC (which, in my opinion, you are still WAY WAY WAY too hung up on!!!).
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And she doesn't care if we don't MC.
So what? You can't control her. What YOU would be doing is stating under what conditions YOU are willing to spend time and money on marriage counseling: no OM, and be honest in the sessions. Anything less is total disrespect and a charade.
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My one and only effective move is to file.
It may soon come to that, yes -- that's a possibility. It's really the last card you can play, however, so I think you have to try everything else first.
