To Pursue or Not

[Jefe]

OK, good. So I'm not loosing my mind on that one. That article seems so far out of left field.

[Starsky309]

It's one person's story, and anecdotally it has as much value as anyone else's success story. But my experience is that such an approach -- especially when tried by a betrayed husband -- serves only to KILL ATTRACTION and RESPECT (and therefore, LOVE, since most women very closely tie their feelings of "love" with their feelings for "respect") from the woman towards the man, but they also totally EMASCULATE the man, and kill his spirit and his self-esteem (and sometimes even to the detriment of his own mental and/or emotional health).

I think Michele's LRT and after-the-LRT are much more within the mainstream of the DB/DR approach when it comes to unrepentant affairs.


Starsky

[Arcola]

An update on sitch.

Not much has changed aside from any changes I'm making of me (GAL, detaching). The biggest factor slowing WAW down I think is the adoption of the kids. We cannot be divorced and adopt the kids. Also, she still talks to OM as far as I know. Moreover, I did some snooping and although I'm not completely happy with what I discovered, she is torn between OM and I.

I want to apologize in advance if the rest of my post is hard to follow.

I just finished a 5-day trip for me, 1 week for family, family trip to Disneyland we had planned way before our sitch. It included W, kids, some of W's family, and I. The trip was different than any other family trip with regards to W and I. There wasn't any holding hands, kissing, hugs, etc between W and I. We talked but mainly about the present stuff (Disneyland, kids, eating, buying stuff, planning throughout the week). There was one odd moment on the day we went into Knotsberry Farm. A photographer wanted to take a family photo but with me closely hugged up on W and giving her a kiss. I hesitated at the request and ended up licking her cheek. So, that was weird and I know her family (mother, brother, auntie) know we're having some kind of problems, but all laughed at the act.

That being said, I'm unsure how her mother really feels about it. MIL acted the same towards me as well as BIL. But note, that her mother is divorced/remarried because her dad was a serial cheater and her brother (age 32) has been divorced/remarried twice and is currently with his new steady GF which means woman #3. W's now father in law was divorced/remarried too. So, I say that only because I can only imagine what kind of advice or support may be given given their previous marriage histories.

So as I mentioned earlier I didn't stay the entire trip. Despite what had been planned at work upon me returning, in all past family trips I have stayed the entire course. However, this trip I didn't because the ball was kinda in her court if I went since it was going to include her side of the family. Prior to us going, I once asked W did she want me to go. And she said yes, but made talk of how long I would stay. A few days later we spoke of me going again, but she once again had to think about how long I stay. I mention this to say the following.

On the evening we headed to LAX for me to catch my flight, W starts crying in the car b/c D3 is crying she has to go potty and traffic was horrible. We finally get off on an exit to stop for potty break and as we do W starts talking about how she feels she has been a horrible mother and W. I recall my response was either "Yeah, things have been rough" or didn't say anything at all. Nonetheless, we take all the kids potty and stop at a nearby mall to eat prior to dropping me off at LAX.

When W dropped me off at LAX, she started crying again, but didn't speak on anything in particular. I began to feel sorry for her and offered to stay the entire trip irregardless of work, but she said no that's okay. So after I got my bags and set them to the sidewalk, we hugged for about 5 secs while she was still crying and I kissed her on the forehead. She got back in the car and I watched her and kids drive off.

I'd like to analyze the last two paragraphs, but I don't know exactly what she is feeling.

So that's it for the update as W and kids should be home tomorrow evening. I do apologize if my grammar was off, but wanted to post.

[Arcola]

So today WAW really let it be known to me how she felt about who gets what as far as property. Up until now, we really haven't had any discussion about what would happen with our current home or a future home for the kids. Here is how the conversation got started and things that were said. I also spoke of OM.

Note: We've just got back from a family vacation and in my opinion all was okay disregarding our sitch.

I was changing the door knob on a closet to be one that locked so I could use for a networking lab setup. Now, know that I seldom modify the house or rearrange anything in it. So I think this triggered something in her that probably said, "He's going to continue on with this house with or without me." So after I finished I came into the dining room where she was vacuuming and the talk began.

She began to tell me that she doesn't know what she's going to do when her lease (in 4 months) is up on the rental SHE CHOSE. She goes on to say we need to sell the rental home we own (prior to sitch she wanted to sell it but really didn't care if it was a rental to save/make us money). Then she says we need to decide what we are going to do with our current home. In which I respond, "I'll refinance it in my name."

She must have not liked that answer, because she said with a grin, "I'm not just giving you this house." She goes on to say of the sorts, "You'll have to buy it from me or give me what I'm due." Note that the house is in both of our names.

She then goes on to say, "Do you think this is what I wanted (speaking of our sitch). Do you think I wanted to get that rental home." In my head, I'm thinking, "You actually did, regardless of how my past actions may not have met your marital wants."

When I spoke on the subject of the rental home she got, she said, "Its because at the beginning of our sitch, nothing was happening so something had to happen to get things rolling.

I somewhat understand how she can feels this way, but I believe she completely lost sight of how the adoption of 3 of our kids would play out and the financial burden we/she would incur because of it. She's now working a second job at nights twice a week which coupled with her day job would not be enough to pay for the rental, care for kids, and other expenses (car, utilities, etc). We do get a monthly stipend for each foster kid and still do for our daughter we adopted 4 years ago. But know when they're adopted the stipend isn't guaranteed as it then depends on if there is an ongoing psychological issue with the child. So those can't be counted as steady income for years to come ( nothing in life can really, but anyway)

The adoption process is like a waiting game and we cant adopt them until Feb. Moreover, we can't be divorced and adopt them officially as mom and dad.


So the above is how things played out for the most part and my thoughts on it. I will say I lost my cool a couple of times, and didn't validate her feelings much. I totally felt that she was lashing out on me because aside from me not being an affectionate husband (the only thing she mentions during this conversation) I've pretty much carried on as usual, detached as best I could, and not gave her too much friction or openly concern of what she's doing/feeling.

I did at a couple of points mention we probably could work on our sitch if she didn't have feelings for another man. I also criticized her for thinking I'm wrong to feel how I do knowing she has feelings for another man.

Through snooping I've found that she has planned or has visioned her future with OM. I think this played a big roll in how I responded to things. I, however, did not let her know I knew this.

Lastly, I'd like to say that in the heat of things because I was so upset with her with how she seemed to make me the overall bad guy for this sitch, I told her I'd buy another house and she could keep this one so it wouldn't add to the change of things for the kids. I do now realize its a valid concern for her wanting some value of the home we now have. Nonetheless, I do plan on taking back that comment and at least seeing if I can afford the house on my income alone.

[Arcola]

Tonight I told my wife I wouldn't be moving out of the house. I just don't understand how she can be the WAW and want me to move out. My question is what is the purpose of staying firm on not moving out? I want my kids to live comfortably but at the same time I don't want this.

Well, I truly feel if I wasn't detached before, I am now. I now see a totally different woman than what I married and loved so much. Its not just the house, but I honestly can't understand how she's become as she has.

[Arcola]

So an update. After telling wife I wasn't going to move out she responded we would have to go to court then. However, a couple of days later after we talk some about sitch she isn't sure if she wants a divorce or not but she does plan on moving into her rental when its approved by the state for the foster kids.

The tall we had was about me comparing her to other people we know who have experience d similar sitchs. PA or EA and divorce. She doesn't like being compared or contrasted to others. She feels hers is somewhat innocent or different.

Also we spoke of how we feel. She feels because I'm not engaging with her much I don't care or think its all her fault. I validated I was wrong to only blame her from the convo we had about two days ago. I expressed I contributed to where we are now too.

On another note, she's still talking to OM. No surprise here, but after some snooping I truly feel like I'm number 2. I know I'm not in the forefront right now anyway, but this was like confirmation. So the snooping revealed when she was driving back from California by herself and our kids shed call OM first and talk a while and then call me. This pattern occurred about 4 times as she drove back home. I also noticed she seems to talk to OM each morning for 10 to 20 minutes.

Well I'll be staying the pace until adoption of kids and see what happens.

[Starsky309]

OK, so you've seen how the "be her best friend while you wait for her" works. (NOT).

Now what do you plan to do?


Starsky

[Arcola]

Starsky
At this point I feel all I can do is wait given the situation with the foster kids. I want to adopt these three kids, D2, S3, and S 7 mos. So I'm just waiting for paperwork to process. Feb. Isnt a firm month, so it may be earlier. I am going to consult legal counsel so I'm aware of some things to expect or do.

[Arcola]

Update on sitch.

Nothing notable has changed on this roller coaster except I've discovered WAW has kissed OM. I don't know if she decided to kiss OM or vice versa. Nonetheless, after finding this out, I also discovered she felt the kiss has made things worse between them. She also felt that she'd welcome it openly if she wasn't married. W feels he is putting on the pressure now after getting the kiss and feels rushed. From this snooping and past snooping, it seems OM wants them to be exclusive regardless of W being married, nothing to hide. OM isn't married. Anyways, she hasn't told me this and I don't know exactly when it happened. I made record of this happening. I'm in no hurry to unveil or confront on this intel just yet.

I was able to get WAW in the mood to ML this past week. Later in the week I asked if she had slept with OM and she said no. We then went on to talk about our feelings with the whole sitch. After the conversation I felt that we are both on the fence and she doesn't seem to want to be out of the relationship with OM or go no contact. Its only been day 2 since discovering the kiss, but I'm not sure if I'll be letting myself fall into the wanting to ML to her again while this sitch goes on.

Not trying to analyze it, but noticed W last had contact with OM mid day Fri. W and I did some things with the kids this Sat. Dinner with kids had like 10% convo between us. Nothing meaningful said between us. She was either on her phone or talking to the kids.

On the phone note, she has always been this way. I guess I overlooked it prior sitch as I thought all was well, but being glued to the phone on social media and all can have its negative affects. I've done some brief reading on how social media correlates to the divorce rate. I will say prior sitch, I failed to really connect with W on important topics, meaning problems usually got brushed under the rug.

I also wanted to write on some other things related to sitch. Close friends of hers that we've kept their children or spent nights at their house or went on vacations together have surprised me. That being said, they sided with her (expected), but some actually encourage as opposed to listener. I found that one friend that happens to be the closest at present day, said, "If you and OM can make it through this, you can make it through anything." She was speaking of how OM and W relationship hasn't become PA, YET, as we're still married. MIL takes a similar stance, she's just supportive of W.

So I'm pretty much in limbo. Still no date on adoption of the foster kids. Its been on my mind to at least meet with an attorney, particularly why Ive decided to make record of things I've found that scream INFIDELITY. W is set on moving out when she can and when I asked some time ago said she was unsure whether she wanted divorce. I do plan on getting back in touch with the IC I started seeing early in sitch to get some guidance. I also plan on losing some weight. I haven't been steady with working out. I looked at a picture from when W, kids, and I went to outing recently and I really saw how I've let myself go.

[Arcola]

I meant to add this in my last post. So, I was at the barbershop on post (military installation) and the barber who is cutting my hair starts talking to me out of nowhere about "What do you do if you don't know what to do?" He goes on to tell of the pilot instructor who'd ask this to students and how that pilot instructor taught and would come in and get his haircut. So after all this history, the barber finally tells me, "What do you do if you don't know what to do?" He said, "pray."

I've prayed since the beginning of my sitch. However, I really felt God had him tell me that as I was really down on this past Friday.