Buddhist monks believe that if you are depressed, you're living in the past, and if you're anxious, you're living in the future.
While it's human nature to worry about what W is ultimately going to decide (to see OM despite your clear boundary or to respect your wishes and your M), my suggestion is to just breathe deeply and work on the now.
Which, of course, you know. And I'm sure you're working on it.
No choices need to be made now, just keep on keeping on. You are strong and patient and this will be your best asset.
ME: 38 BF: 40 T: 10y, no kids, no M (by choice) BD: 7/14/14, BF admits to PA, wants out, lies about new R. 10/1/14: I move out, BF lies about move in with OW 12/4/14: OW confronted, reveals all the lies
I believe that you cannot afford to just stand there and take blame for W's A. That's just wrong. OMG, I cannot believe the nerve of her telling to YOUR face that you made her have an affair. At some point, the LBS will need to lose the fear of speaking up and push back against emotionally manipulative comments like your W said to you.
Yes Rzr. My W says I left her open to other men. You can't let that go. WAW's remember everything and will use your weak moments against you when convenient. I hate pushing her buttons too b/c I get hammered. I'm getting used to it though and you will too. Everyone here will help you when your decision times come. Take care and stay strong.
Me: 44 W: 45 S: 11 Married: 15 Together: 18 BD: 9/29/2014 OM discovered: 10/16/2014 I left her behind: 12/14/2014
BEFORE the OM comes to town.... Let her chew on that.........
RZR, Women tell us again and again that they are attracted to Confident, happy men who are emotionally strong and have a backbone...
Nip this in the bud... Below is how it is done correctly. Fine tune it to your situation....
RobX’s approach:
Sit her down and have a discussion with her. No need to be mad, angry, a$$hole, prick on anything, keep it calm, light but straight forward, direct to the point, etc. Don't make it last more than a few minutes.
You tell her trust is based on actions that are consistent.
You don't trust her because she hasn't been consistent.
You don't trust her because she's been lying to you, in fact you tell her that is what you trust her to continue doing, because she has been lying to your consistently - that's what you can trust.
For you to be able to trust her, she has to build trust. Sure you can trust her blindly and have faith and all that good stuff but honestly how well has that worked up to this point?
Don't ask for for full disclosure.
Do the opposite.
Tell her this:
"... I don't want your cell phone records, I don't want to look at your cell phone text msg's and call history, I don't want your email or fb password, I don't want your voicemail pw. If I have to monitor you 24/7 to force you to be consistent, that won't work for me because that's not what I want or need.
I wanted you to be trustworthy but I don't need you to be anything, truth be told, I'll be just fine without you, I see that now.
From now on I'm moving in this direction, if you want to come along, go ahead, I won't control you and tell you that can or can't come but I can't wait for you anymore and you already know that if you're with the OM, you aren't with me, I'm not settling for anything less than that.
If you really want to be with the OM, I really can't say or do anything to stop that and you should be with him if you're willing to lie so much to me, if you can't be true to me that means he's more important to you than I am and you know what... I'm ok with that because I'm more important to me and that's all that matters - I see that now.
If you wanted to be with me, you knew that you had alot of trust to rebuild and that's only through consistent action and I'm through with pressuring you to be my wife, I don't want to be with someone who doesn't want to be with me and that's pretty much what it looks like to me so let's stop playing games: you go and be with the OM, I'm ok with that, in fact I'm better than OK, I'm awesome because I'm finally being honest with myself about all of this and that includes being honest about who you are and where you are right now. I know what I'm worth and I've been settling for less for too long.
I can't wait for you anymore, I've spent enough time waiting for you to do the right thing and I know that doesn't work because I would probably have to wait forever and still not get what I wanted. So you can do what you want, be with the OM, I hope he makes you happy and I'm going to start wanting something better for me."
No being mean, spiteful, vindictive, you let her go. No more discussions, arguments, no more talks about lies, no more sneaking around behind your back, she can do what she wants but you are letting her go to do what she wants to do but at the same time, you are now allowing yourself to be free of this crappy limbo place you've been living in for so long.
Bro, if she wants to be with you, she'll be with you, no amount of a$$ kissing, sneaking, snooping, being mean, angry, standing tall, etc. is going to change that.
You be the best gosh darn example of a MAN for you and for you only. If she wants this great MAN that you are in her life, she'll pursue you and do what it takes to be a part of that.
You need to respect yourself first, that's the first step and letting go of your wife her untrustworthy ways to establish that your self-respect, dignity and integrity are the most important things in your life is what you NEED and WANT to do. You know what you're worth, go out and get what you're worth and let go of the things that are worthy of you - starting feeling your personal value, know it, resonate with it, live it. You are worth better than what she is giving you right now, if you don't set that boundary, you'll allow her to do this to you forever and who could respect that?
Otherwise continue playing this game and you'll be playing this chase & pursue game, pushing & pulling for the rest of your life.
Time to get off the merry go round, this ride isn't that fun anymore.
Just had a few moments, thought I'd check in with a little journaling.
Christmas went well, we all got along, the kids loved their presents, we had a good time. We're going out of town to her family tomorrow, which is fine with me. I love her family; only MIL and SIL know anything about our sitch.
W has been warm and affectionate, she's framing pictures of us and talking about things to do to the house in the future. No mention of OM in a couple of days. I don't know how much of this is genuine and how much is just keeping things peaceful. She wears her emotions on her sleeve so I tend to think that she's mostly genuine. But I still have that doubt...
Ironically, when she's like this, it's all I can do not to be a WAS myself. I keep things upbeat and friendly, but I seethe inside. How can she be so friendly and affectionate and yet still not apologize for her actions? How can she possibly think that meeting OM next month is a good idea for our marriage? I think about telling her it's over and pulling the trigger on our marriage myself. I'm sick of this roller coaster. I want off.
I went from home to college to marriage without breathing. I want to build my own life the way I want it. I want a woman who doesn't look at me like she'd be happy if only I wasn't in her way.
I met someone last week. She's beautiful, funny, smart, ambitious and a free spirit. She seems to light up when I see her and god knows I light up. We laugh and talk easily together. She works in my building but we don't work closely. She's single and lives less than two miles away. I feel good just typing these words.
And I know how dangerous that is. It's exactly the way my W feels about OM. It's twice as dangerous for me because she's so accessible. I now get how my W fell into that trap. She felt dead inside and met OM and it woke her up emotionally and sexually. I've felt dead inside for a long time too (not just since BD) and meeting this woman did the same thing for me.
I'm not going there, that's why I write here. She knows nothing about our sitch. I'm not opening that Pandora's box with her. I don't communicate with her outside of work. I'm sure a good portion of my feelings right now is my own loneliness and lostness talking.
I'm not starting an A with her. That would make me as bad as my W and OM, and would unnecessarily hurt this other woman, which I definitely don't want. I'm trying to look at it as a sign from the universe that I'll be fine even if my W never comes back.
But God, she makes me feel good.
Last edited by Rzrback; 12/26/1412:47 AM.
Ex Rzrback Me 43 Her 44 D11, D15 T21, M19 BD 9/9/2014 Piecing
Sometimes if you want to see a change for the better, you have to take things into your own hands - Clint Eastwood
Wow, Vanilla, that song fits perfectly. Thanks! I've never listened to a lot of Keith Urban, I need to check him out more.
Interesting day. I thought we were really going to separate. We weren't fighting, but she was just at a point where she felt like we weren't working any more. I didn't fight her. I just stayed calm (because that's what I felt) and we talked about me finding an apartment. I just told her that I wanted her to be happy. I think she was surprised (as was I) at how panicked I was not. I did tell her about the woman I met and told her honestly that it took some of the fight out of me with regards to our M. Not that I wanted to pursue anything with the woman per se, but that I finally saw that I would have a life post-D.
At one point during our R talk she said that she didn't think she'd ever be happy again; that she was just being swept along in life. I told her that was the same line of crap I used to spew when she would try to prop me up in the past, before I finally got a clue that happiness comes from within. That seemed to resonate with her. We got something to eat and went to the gym. After our workout her rhetoric had changed. She talked about doing what we could to create positive memories for ourselves; about taking care of the things we could control. She started to talk about ML again. She's still open about feeling lost, but her attitude has changed.
I'm still not getting too excited, but it was interesting to watch. I know she didn't have some epiphany about OM. It's amazing what happens to a WAS' attitude when they start to realize that you're no longer afraid of being without them, that you have other romantic prospects, and that you're going to have a good life whether they're around or not.
Ex Rzrback Me 43 Her 44 D11, D15 T21, M19 BD 9/9/2014 Piecing
Sometimes if you want to see a change for the better, you have to take things into your own hands - Clint Eastwood
W, we both know that's not true. Don't try to shift blame on other people for your choices. I am NOT responsible for your affair. You made that choice with your eye wide open. And you know it. This nonsense stops right now. Just so we're clear on this. I'm done talking about this issue. It's not cool with me standing right in front of you as your H.
Then walk away.
With all due respect to Wonka...
Please do not say this. You aren't the warden here. There are far more effective ways to be a strong, confident, emotionally stable man. Don't demand things. Demanding is pressure. The best way I have found to stop these things is to set them free. Firm, confident and decisive... "I have decided that this isn't working for me"....
See the difference? Also works far better because it takes off any and all pressure for them to "be" a certain way.. If she believes it is your fault she had an affair,,, so be it, tell her that you have decided this isn't working for you..
See? End of conversation. She THEN has to either tell you she does want out (which is what you are scared of)OR.. She has to convince YOU why it will work.. (see the beauty in letting them go?) They either go or they have to show you why it will work... A whole different dynamic takes place just by letting go.. Let go of the fear.. Maybe she will go. Her mind is not totally there now, so what are you out? Don't demand. Don't pressure. You aren't the warden. You have your own faults and issues. Work on those...
Why would you even think about this, let alone mention it?
If W is a struggling W returning to her H and her M then it is her wayward behaviour that needs boundaries. I believe you reduce your own ability to enforce with this. W and you have enough to deal with.
Just as if I made a boundary for H for drunkeness every night and bought and drank a bottle of scotch myself.
Vanilla
Last edited by Vanilla; 12/28/1405:10 AM.
Freedom is just another word for nothing left to loose. V 64, WAW
I know, I know. Diarrhea of the mouth during a late night discussion. There's no "there" there. OW and I have had a few discussions in her cubicle, mostly about holidays and running. Nothing more. No texting, no after-hours communication at all. We're not even Facebook friends. She smiles at me and laughs at my stupid jokes and acts like she wants me around. I needed that. I'm rational enough to know that this is my loneliness talking. Safe to say that if we did D that she would be one of the first to know. I wasn't trying to give my W the impression that I was pursuing anyone else...I just thought maybe she'd get that I had other options and that would trigger a little jealousy. Not my proudest moment.
Had my last session with Chuck today. He hammered me (like everyone else on here) to ease up on OM and let my W find her own way. He advised me to keep working on myself and our M; that way the OM would gradually lose appeal for my W, instead of putting my foot down and running the real risk of resentment from her. I was looking at OM as a roadblock that needed to be dynamited out of the way before she and I could continue making progress. What will be will be and chances are she'll make the right call. That's only what the vets on this board have been telling me to do from the beginning. You'd think I'd get it.
My W this weekend started talking about creating new memories and doing things that bonded us. She wants to ML again (gotta wait, time of the month, naturally). These things should be filling me with joy, or at least relief. Problem was, I was partially disappointed that she didn't want to go forward with separation. I don't know if it's because I've been guarding myself against her emotionally for so long, or if I started getting too comfortable with the idea of moving on without her. That was disturbing to say the least. It's funny how the push/pull dynamic works.
Last edited by Rzrback; 12/29/1407:24 PM.
Ex Rzrback Me 43 Her 44 D11, D15 T21, M19 BD 9/9/2014 Piecing
Sometimes if you want to see a change for the better, you have to take things into your own hands - Clint Eastwood
