Mozza 1 - 2009 near-separation, search for explanations. Mozza 2 - OM confirmed through kids on Halloween, refocus on me rather than blaming W. Mozza 3 - OM confirmed by W in email, strollergate, W has problems at work, unexpected blind date. Mozza 4 - Lunch with W went well, reflections on being dumped, kids and OM Mozza 5 - W warms up but OM set to move in in January, W's birthday email Mozza 6 - To be nice or not to be, two trips make me feel better, office party video
My story After 9.5 years together, my W announced in early September 2014 that she wanted a separation. A week of pleading and begging didn't change a thing. She said she wanted to be free, alone, find her true self, that I was criticizing her too much, that we're incompatible, that she was unhappy and no longer in love with me and she didn't want to live with half-emotions. She had told me before of some of those complaints and that she was unhappy. We had not yet addressed everything, we would fight more than average, and I wasn't changing fast enough, so she was growing hopeless that things would improve.
A week after BD, she moved out. A month and a half later, she confirmed my suspicions that she was with a coworker, met at the new job she started a month before BD (after a year of job-seeking). A good listener, 10 years younger than me, better-looking and athletic, he'd been courting her from week 1 and was omnipresent throughout her move. He's moving in with her in January. Our two daughters know and like him and generally take the S in strides.
DBing I accept responsibility for what I did in the M, by being too critical and dismissive of my W's feelings, and I understand that my W was looking for something she wasn't finding in the M. I sometimes understand why she left, since she was miserable, and sometimes think leaving was too strong a reaction for the situation. I tend to blame her flight reflex and unrealistic expectations for love and family life.
My stance at the moment is to let her live her life while I reflect and try to focus on me. I keep the interactions to a minimum but cordial and about the kids. I'm good at being silent and distant. The "no pursuing" rule is easy to apply for me because it means doing nothing. I detach better with this distance. What I'm not so good at is acting normal and upbeat around her. I've recently been told that I act as a "wet noodle" with her because I'm too kind to her gestures, like banter emails and hugs. I see a therapist since BD. _________________________________________________
Success stories Feel free to make suggestions, especially with links to threads. I wish we had room in our profile to tell our story so that the vets and other successes could give us a quick summary.
I got a lot of support and good feedback about my changes at the end of my previous thread. Here's my response. ---------------
Wow, those are some very kind words. I'm surprised that my changes are visible on this board. Many many thanks, Vanilla, Complex, TLEE86, Card29, Vapo, and jim0987. I've read your words several times.
Here are the things I learnt at and since BD.
1) Speak with my actions. When I catch myself about to say something about who I am, how I think, my values, etc, I shut up and demonstrate it. I enjoy it greatly because it feels genuine. It's the same with an apology: I make it short and I make sure to be careful next time rather than come up with an excuse. Also, I observe my actions to define who I am. It's more demanding.
2) Let go. Now that I've the opposite of control over my W, I've no choice but to let her do everything she wants her own way. It's been liberating. Oh, in the moment, I wish I could influence her, but over time it feels much better to have accepted things be done differently and that we get along.
3) STFU. On this board and looking at old emails between my W and me, I see that my desire to clarify and nuance everything got in the way. It restarted arguments that were settled, it dragged on discussions while we could have used the energy elsewhere.
If my W gives me as much as a thought, she probably thinks I'm like this either because I'm in a crisis (her explanation before she moved out) or because we're no longer in a couple. I realize it takes time and it's my fault for needing this crisis to understand these things quickly. I won't know how durable those changes are until I'm in a R, but in the meantime I realized that I can practice these changes with the people around me. Fake it until you become it -- I believe this.
I can't bring myself to be thankful for 2014 though. I don't have this wisdom yet. I've suffered too much and feel like there are other ways I could have made such progress, if slower. There's no way I will use such shock therapy on people around me to teach them anything important. So if I'm not grateful, at least I recognize the benefits of this trial.
M39 D6 D3 (at S) S 2014-09 D 2016-09
"You can't start a fire sitting around, crying over a broken heart" - Bruce Springsteen.
I think that is very healthy attitude to have towards 2014 right now. I don't blame you for not being thankful for it yet! Sometimes I still wish something else could have shaken me up enough to do this work. But alas
Me 38, WAW 30 D11 (former marriage) S2 T 8 years M 3 years BD 8/20/23 S 8/20/23
My W and I are coming back from our respective Holiday travels tomorrow and we'll resume our "normal" interactions.
1. I found her clothes and winter equipment at my parents' place. Do I return them? She hasn't asked for them. I'm concerned she'll feel rejected if I keep returning stuff she hasn't asked for. At the same time, I'd like her to feel that we're separating, that she's not the only one in control.
2. Do I avoid interacting with her? I'm most comfortable avoiding because she's with OM anyway, so it's not like I can attract her now and it takes my PMA down. She'll send me funny emails, give me work updates, etc. Do I engage? She might invite me for lunch. (I'll respond to the kids stuff as usual.)
Thanks!
M39 D6 D3 (at S) S 2014-09 D 2016-09
"You can't start a fire sitting around, crying over a broken heart" - Bruce Springsteen.
I decided to return her winter gear and I found my answer to the second question in a fantastic post by sandi2 on HPoirot's thread.
Originally Posted By: sandi2
I believe when a couple separates, there needs to be a period of time where they should avoid contact with each other. It is so easy to trigger something during a quick exchange, texting, etc. They need that space from each other to regroup and calm down where they feel a bit more balanced in their emotional equaliberim.
On top of that, my W is in a new R. I don't know if we have balance. On the surface, we do: we're very cordial and just about everything comes easy between us about the kids. Almost too easy, because it plays into her scenario that this separation is no big deal, apart perhaps from my pain. On my end, I'm not detached at all and have been crying every day for 4 months straight now. Our interactions make me very uncomfortable. Coming from her, I see that she tries to stay in touch with chit chat that borders on weird (video of her office party??). I suspect there's nothing there and she's really moved on, but that's mind reading.
Originally Posted By: sandi2
This is why I do not agree with the idea of getting all buddy-buddy. How could it be genuine? IMO, she needs to know he is not happy about what she has done to the family, and frankly, he is not interested in being her friend. He is done! That is the only message that will cause her to rethink her actions.
So I'll avoid feeding her communications then, keep it to a minimum about the kids. Perhaps in a few weeks or months, I'll reassess. Maybe I should have a deadline, like HPoirot's six months.
M39 D6 D3 (at S) S 2014-09 D 2016-09
"You can't start a fire sitting around, crying over a broken heart" - Bruce Springsteen.
I read that post from Sandi and thought it was really good also. I think you're onto something in keeping communications to a minimum. However, make sure you don't cross the line and be cold and callous. It's tough and I know there are times that i struggle with being short and to the point, but not being too tough on things.
I think our W's are in completely different places wrt to their interactions with us, but I still think this is all a cover to mask the hurt and pain and not allow them to be vulnerable. I think this is not just with others, but part of what they've built up inside in not dealing with their issues and decisions. Once they tackle that, then they can start to let others help them.
M:36 W:37 T: 15 M:11 S6 D5 BD: 8/10/14 IDLY: 8/12/14 S: 8/13/14 (she left, I stayed w/ kids) D Mentioned: 10/15/14 Confronted about OM: 10/15/14 EA: ~4/13 PA: ~10/13 She filed: 8/15 (not final)
Thanks MCS. I still follow every post on your thread. Yes, it looks like our WAWs are diverging somewhat. I think it's because my W has a simpler situation with her OM. He left his GF quickly for her and moved in with W (today! yay!), so she can find peace and calm there. She gives me the typical "good mood" of WAS who are in a good place with OM. Also, she had almost no anger at me when she left. I think she was just too focused on OM already. Actually, noting that almost all WAS seem to have anger issues with LBS when they leave, I don't really know why my W has none. She can get upset. Perhaps she feels too much guilt.
I agree my W doesn't appear to be dealing with her issues, but I'm also not sure if she does because I don't see her or really know what's going on with her. Maybe she's a new person? Probably not, otherwise she wouldn't be sending me the video of her office party and brag about drinking too much to remember what she ate.
We just had a fairly long text exchange about the kids and I kept it to a minimum, not taking any of the lines she threw me, like asking about the Holidays ("very good!") or the kids ("very good!") or her jet lag (no reaction). It pains me a lot: I miss her and I crave interacting with her. I really, really want to text "I didn't want this separation and I'm still heartbroken, but I'm moving on. What else can I do?" But I won't.
Her indifference to me during the S talks really hurt me. It was amazing to see her unmoved by my love and pain. It felt worse than her anger. I don't want to go back there. I don't want to admit to her that I'm still in love with her and hear crickets in return. It feels like being a trapeze artist, throwing yourself at your partner and he doesn't extend a hand, so you fall.
M39 D6 D3 (at S) S 2014-09 D 2016-09
"You can't start a fire sitting around, crying over a broken heart" - Bruce Springsteen.
theyre still in fantasyland, Mozza. It stinks that it has gotten to this point, that he's moving in, but now reality gets to set in. Now they have to be on all of the time, which they won't.
How is your detachment? Obviously its not perfect since you are craving her. I don't blame you, I was there for 6 months! At least you're not pursuing like I did lol. What is the most detached you've been during this process?
Me 38, WAW 30 D11 (former marriage) S2 T 8 years M 3 years BD 8/20/23 S 8/20/23
mozza, stay strong man, you know by now she doesn't want an R with you. We all hope this is short term but the last thing she wants to hear is that you love her. Stay the course . take care RD
So today is the day she starts to find out about his toenail clippings, and his offensive attitudes and that he just leaves half eaten tubs of olives to go mouldy in the fridge.
Today is the beginning of the end of the fantasy and when real world sets in for them
No question its going to be hard for you Mozza, I hope your doing ok and have some good plans to do some things for you lined up.
And as for interactions you need to do what is right for you to help you manage your emotions.
I wouldnt be so set on timelines though except how they might help you. If youve read any of the stuff on the stockdale paradox he said that the ones who struggled most were the ones who had an end date in mind.
Both mid 30s, 2 young kids BD 7sep14 XW moved on long ago, now living with OM1 D paperwork in progress
