Mozza (7) + Links to success stories

[labug]

Mozza, haven't posted to you in along while, you were getting a lot of great support.

About the email, how about, "OK W, let's talk."

I believe less is more. Nothing you say right now is going to change her mind.

I know this must be difficult.

[Starsky309]

Mozz,

I would strongly advise NOT to try to do this without your own attorney, no matter how amicable you two are. I have no problem with (and tend to like) using a mutually-agreed-upon mediator, and meeting amicably with them to try and hash everything out, but then I strongly advise people to either retain or just pay hourly their OWN attorney, to review the final document and advise you before signing anything.

Just wanted to throw that out there.

I'm sorry for this news, I know it stings. Anything can still happen, though, although you will need to hear and respect her wishes right now.

Starsky

[Mach1]

Here's the email I have in mind. It's a mix of DB and what my heart is screaming. I've no idea how it comes across, perhaps because I don't want to see it.

"You know I didn't want to separate and I don't want to divorce, but it's your choice and much like I couldn't keep you from leaving, I can't get in your way if you want to divorce.

I haven't done my research nor sought counsel, so I'm in no rush of starting the process. Also, there is a one-year delay in the law to give time to the couple to think and confirm its decision so I'd rather respect it.

May I ask why you want to start already?"

I go around telling everyone that you can't talk WAS into anything, yet I find myself in the same place, wishing W and I could talk.

Be careful when you use the "but"...

It says that you don't care what she wants, only to interject your personal agenda...

Be careful when you use the words "you" and "I"....

You will throw around a lot of guilt using them, especially if the WAS wants to hear it differently...


Think on that, and rewrite....

Find YOUR stance, and act from that place, instead of REacting from hers....

[Mozza]

I'm wondering if she wants me to resist, if she's checking whether I still love her. But that's me.

I just spoke to a local help line (coincidence: they were calling me to follow up) and the adviser noted that my W may indeed feel the need to be reassured that I'm still there, but that it doesn't mean she wants me.

I'll be thinking some more about my response, but I admit that I'm torn.

Starsky309: Yes, I will speak to an attorney before even meeting to talk about it. We have kids and she's an immigrant here.

Labug: Thanks for your feedback. If I say "Let's talk", then what are we going to talk about?

[sandi2]

I'm thinking that my WAW is also a conflict avoider, especially as she told me that she didn't want to work on the couple when she left. It was too much energy for her. This is typical conflict avoidance.

It doesn't necessarily mean she's a conflict avoider, b/c I'm not, and yet I felt the same way about not having the energy to work on my M. I think, based on what I've read, it is pretty much typically thinking of the WAW in an A.

I'm wondering if she wants me to resist, if she's checking whether I still love her. But that's me.

That is LBH thinking, not the thinking of a WAW in an A. She is not wanting you to resist and she doesn't care if you love her or not. At one time, she did, but she is past that point ATM.

Sorry for speaking so plainly, Mozza. You have to realize she is not thinking like you. Don't try to talk her out of it. Don't sound like a victim. Be strong and sound it. Trust me, if anything had influence on her decision right now, it would be for you to talk as though you have no problem with D. After all, that would be a big 180 from the message you usually try to pass along to her. You don't have to remind her you don't want it. She already knows. And she knows you still love her, just for the record.

[Card29]

Mozza, I swear we are twins separated at birth. I had the exact same thoughts a few months ago, and now I see how wrong I was (although I didn't know WAW was having A). My W is DEFINITELY a not a conflict avoided, yet she held in her feelings for the last two years until she met someone and couldn't take it with me anymore. And I second what Sandi says about her thoughts about you...especially when she knows you're still wanting to cling to her (and if it's obvious on here, she probably knows it, too), the last thing she's doing is testing you. It CAN change, but making it the focus of your life will only delay a potential change, or maybe even eliminate the possibility.

Keep walking the DB path, though. Someday it will click for you and you will be so glad you stuck with it. As we know, I was a habitual pursuer, yet I still love the path I walked now.

[Georgia Bulldogs]

We have kids and she's an immigrant here.

I see you've been married for a short while....has your wife obtained her permanent resident card, green card and citizenship yet??? There seems to be an awful lot of immigrant brides divorcing after 3, 4 or 5 years of marriage.

Tough to fight for a marriage if she's been playing you, to a certain extent, this whole time. Often there is family pressure to divorce and then sponsor another non-citizen family member over to the US. The desperation to come here legally is tremendous. It's not always that they don't care about their husband's but family promises have been already made.

Could be a factor to consider but an indication you certainly need to see an attorney and make sure you are protected from her leaving with your children back to her homeland.

[Mozza]

Thanks everyone. I'm sure it's obvious to all of you how much I still love her, but I really don't do anything to give her that impression. The furthest I've gone is to tell her I don't want to meet her because I need to move on. Other than that, it's been silence, business. We haven't seen each other in a month (1 minute) and we haven't sit down to talk in two months.

OK, I will DB this one too. You all seem very confident, including those that have been through this successfully. It won't be easy: I just had lunch with a friend who got divorced 4 years ago. She discovered later that when her xH sent her the D paper, he didn't really want to: it was to force her to react... Then again, he was not with an OW, so it's different. My WAW is in an A and I trust sandi2 that I don't know how WAW thinks.

I really don't understand the timing of this request. As she says herself (she's done her research), we can't be D until October 1st. Why get started mi-January?

[Mozza]

OK, I guess I should reply. Here is the most DB reply I can come up with, completely detached of how I feel.

(15 minutes later)

"OK. I'll have to check a few things first."

Really, I can't think of anything. It's amazing how I lose my means when it comes to my sitch. I'm really not detached. I tried writing it for someone else, but I can't. Id like the email to look less curt than this. I just don't want to come across as pissed or super-controlled.

Here's the full translation of her email, in case it can help.

"Hi,

There's something I'd like to talk to you about. Do you have an idea when you'd want to start looking at the paperwork for the divorce? I read somewhere that it won't be official until October 1, 2015 (one year after we lived separately, but we can submit the papers ahead of time). I'd rather talk about all of this in person, it's less cold and hard. This being said, I can respect your desire not to meet -- at first. And if you prefer to postpone the discussion, I'll understand.

I don't have a lawyer. I looked around and at $$$, I thought we could perhaps start by talking about it (there are ways to do it without talking to a lawyer, if the parents get along relatively well). This being said, I wouldn't want to do the whole process by email and text (re: [friends], although I don't care what others have done).

Well. There. I put the topic on the table. There's no good way to do it, especially not by email.

Thanks,
W"

Inspiration, anyone?

[Mozza]

How about a simple:

"Hi,

Yes, ok. Let me check a few things first and I'll get back to you.

Thanks,
Mozza"

Then I'd call and meet a lawyer to understand at least the basics. I'd get back to her within a week or two (depends how fast I get a hold of a good lawyer) and perhaps agree to met. This being said, I feel this is way too early since we can only D in October. I don't like making decisions or even progress during this foggy phase of our S.