For Newcomer LBH with a Wayward Wife

[Fogg]

Awesome information and perspective, thanks. This all makes so much sense, but conflicts with what I'm doing in so many ways also so makes me feel lost in what I'm doing. Either way gives me a lot to think about.

[Joe46]

That makes sense. I never thought of it like that. I have always had a problem figuring out the right thing to say. Thank You.

[Vanilla]

Sandi

You and I have exchanged posts on that which constitutes a WW. V is a Potential Walk Away Wife who is not wayward but standing for herself and the right to build a new and better M.

I would just say that the H in this situation needs to be clear his W is wayward as these actions would further push away a non wayward spouse.

It would also be useful if the post could be adapted for WH, can that be done?

Thank you Sandi

As always

V

[sandi2]

Thanks Vanilla, and I agree with what you said. That is why I tried hard to clarify it in the beginning of this thread. I am trying to be cautious not to advise something that would damage the MR worse than what it is. As I once explained to you, the WAS is not usually the one who is wanting to save the M. Although you did leave at one point, you are currently the one trying to save it. As you so eloquently said, you ate trying to stand up for yourself and build a better life. I applaud you from the bottom of my heart. You are too good, V. I can't even read threads about men such as your H b/c it angers me. (No offense meant to you, please know.)

It was actually after I was reading your first thread that I started using the wayward wife term instead of just WAW. (When I cirst came to board nearly eight yrs ago, I hated that that seeing that term.) Anyway, when I saw you referring to yourself as a WAW, and when I started reading more of your posts, I thought, "Wait, this lady doesn't sound quite like any WAW I have read about... and sure nothing compared to myself". . After I posted to you, I thought I detected a little confusion......or maybe it was just your sweet way of disagreeing with me. In past times, I would try to remember to distinguish between the two WAW's by adding "who is in an A". After posting to you, I made a greater effort to disquenish them. I do truly believe it makes a huge difference in the condition of her heart whether or not she has an OM. (And of course, there have been those who just went wild, with no particular OM in mind.) By saying I believe it makes a difference in her heart, I am not suggesting a woman couldn't lose her love for her H due to other reasons. Several serious and legitimate reasons, other than infidelity, can break down a M beyond repair. Many women have reason to have a cold heart, but it isn't wayward. I hope I am making sense. I realize i am not the most talented in writing skills.

I believe there are some women who walk away who feel done with the M, however, they are not interested in finding someone new right away. There is no outlandish change in their moral behavior. The same cannot be said when she is wayward and has that cold, rebellious, selfish, defiance that has grown over years of resentment and it takes priority over everything........often times her own babies. She has allowed another man to take over her mind and/or have his way with her body. That is what separates the two types of WAW'S, IMO.

I try to be cautious and indicate that my advice is for the H who has a very wayward wife. I never advise cruelty, or even coldness toward the WW, just applying tough love instead of soft soaking the stitch. Also, I want it understood that this tough love stance is hopefully not forever, but could be for an indefinite amount of time. The determining factor is the behavior of the WW.

Again, thanks, V, for bringing attention to that difference.

[pbetra]

Love this, thank you Sandi for such an informative post!

[Bing]

Great post. You could write your own book on relationships, Sandi2. And I would buy it. "Tough Love" by Sandi2. I find you brilliant.

I've been failing horribly since bomb day one month ago. What are your suggestions when LBH is late to the party like me? Ease into the appropriate course of action, or go all in 100% the moment you read this great post?

I've basically spent the last month begging or testing out hollow tactics to "snap her out of it." In short I've dug myself into a deep hole.

[Joe46]

I have been a little confused on which WW I am dealing with. I would say that what she is doing is out of her normal moral character. Although I have no proof of her having an affair. Lying about passwords, hiding cell phone and creating multiple emails sure looks like there is someone she is hiding. I have decided I need to treat my sitch with a "tough love" stance. Would you agree?

[Mozza]

Sandi2 - Thank you so much for sharing your wisdom. Something struck me and suddenly I wonder if my W is a WW.

I believe there are some women who walk away who feel done with the M, however, they are not interested in finding someone new right away. There is no outlandish change in their moral behavior. The same cannot be said when she is wayward and has that cold, rebellious, selfish, defiance that has grown over years of resentment and it takes priority over everything........often times her own babies. She has allowed another man to take over her mind and/or have his way with her body. That is what separates the two types of WAW'S, IMO.

My W has an OM and he was a factor in her decision to leave. She denied it when leaving but he was a constant presence around her before and after the S and 1.5 month after leaving she emailed me saying she had met someone: him. He moved in officially 3 months after she left me.

The reason I'm still wondering relates to your comment about the moral character of the W. My W cheated on me in 2009 with another sweet talking colleague. She kept it a secret and told me that she would leave me because we were incompatible or something to that effect. As she told me, she slept with him twice during a business trip. She said at the time that she saw the light and confessed her A to me, telling me that she would stay if I forgave her, which I did on the spot. We moved on but little changed in our couple past the first couple of months.

So fast forward to 2014 and, once again, we're incompatible, she needs to be alone, to find herself, etc. Our M is a disappointment because it only delivers half-emotions. The original romance is gone and we fight too much. Turns out there's another OM, a colleague again.

So, is she a WW who lost her morals or is she a serial cheater? Is it possible that those were two exceptions? If she's a serial cheater in your opinion, should I just cut my losses and hope that she'll never come back?

[Kramer]

Excellent post. Describes my wife to a tee. As I mentioned in my posts, she has left me and everybody else in her life and is continuing full steam ahead with her affair. She has moved into her own place and filed divorce. She has not had any contact with my children and grandchildren since I disconered her affair on New Years eve and confronted her. After doing the begging and pleading early on, I have now gone dark and limit my communication with her to texts or emails tegRding legal issues. We don't have children together, but I raised her children as if they were my own for 17 years. Only the youngest wants anything to do with her. The rest have distanced themselves from her because of her selfish actions.

I've actually spent the last 2 days cleaning our house after she and her youngest left. They left a huge mess and she left behind all of the pictures, clothes, and memories that we accumulated over the years. Very sad. I am actually getting dinner ready now for 3 of her children. They are all adults but we still do things together.

I will adhere to the advice that sandy2 espouses, but am doubtful that she will return. Her boyfriend has money, nice house, and drives a Maserati. I can't comptete with that. I think she sees a sugar daddy and doesn't have to deal with the drama in our lives this way.

[sandi2]

Wayward is wayward. I didn't mean to make this complicated, my goal was to help make it more understandable for some newcomers. I am talking about two types of wives who walk away from the M. One type is not wayward, the other is.

Joe, I have already told you that your W is wayward. Your W may not have narrowed it down to one specific man, however, she has a broad spectrum. She doesn't have to have just one man. She has a variety of men. She is selling sex every night. You even found evidence in emails and where she had signed up on dating sites or in a chat room.

I have seen this, where the H goes into some kind of denial and tries to convince himself that his W really is doing nothing wrong. He thinks maybe his imagination and jealousy is in overdrive. I suppose that may be a natural respone, IDK. You are not imagining any of this. And here's the thing, Joe, if she had not crossed the line into waywardness, then she would give up that lifestyle for the sake of her M and for her kids. But it has a hold on her. She is as addicted as any A could do, b/c she gets the same thrill from her sexual contacts. And as with other addictive drugs, it requires more to get the same high the next time. That is why her sexual activities are have overlapped into other areas on the Internet. She is hooked, and now she is rebellious and defiant. She will choose this "job" over her H and kids, not b/c of the money but the addiction.