More and more, and less and less...

[Zues126]

Oh my goodness. After I don't know how many months XW and I just included a mention of the divorce in the text about the kids. I'm going to try to paraphrase instead of quote so a google search doesn't lead right here.

Basically it started with her being a little more friendly than normal, thanking me two different times for doing a 'good job' with the kids, and for being 'peaceful' to work with (although the way she said good job set herself up as being the judge of my parenting, and the way she mentioned being peaceful almost implied it was out of the ordinary for me). Anyway:

XW: Made a comment about how she missed the kids after 4 days, and that she now understands why I wanted 50/50, and that she's sorry I was hurt for not being able to see them.

ME: I responded that it must be Freaky Friday, because I was just thinking about how much she had done over the years for the children mostly on her own.

XW: She said she was sorry I felt the divorce was entirely her doing (at our court appointment she told social services the D was mutual, I corrected and said it was not). She said that she thought divorce was the 'ultimate' sin and that it hurt her that I said that. She went on to say we weren't meant to be together and that even if her life is hard because of the divorce it's worth it so the kids have a dad, because that only started after the split.

Me: I said there was no disputing the contributions I made to the breakdown of the marriage and an unendurable situation. I told her I understood D wasn't something she felt she chose, but rather the only option. Then I said that in any case I was grateful to have the chance to be a dad before it was too late.


For those that haven't followed my sitch, this is the most I've emotionally communicated with XW in literally 15 months. All of this time she has never once expressed any interest in what I think, what I believe, or what I am feeling. She didn't really ask, but even starting a dialog was unusual for us. I tried to balance validating without agreeing (on either the need or positive nature of the D) and without anything that would indicate pursuit. I think I did ok, and if not the only loss would be my personal goal of doing my best.

Anyway, this was a good reminder for me what you newcomers are going through. I will say I got a bit sad at reading this. The 'we weren't meant to be' was a hard piece of bait to not take by responding with stuff about how I didn't believe in that, yadda yadda. Whatever. Not my battle. It's clear she's going to cling to the narrative that D was her only choice, and that she is going to spin it to make it a sacrifice for the children because it proved to be for the best.

I just had to vent this here. You guys get it.

Funny. She still feels like my wife sometimes. When she said kind words (my love language...or second behind physical affection ) it touched me, and it reminded me how special what we once had was...

...and it's gone. Deep breath in, deep breath out, quick post on DB for support...I'm ok. It's all good baby. It's all good.

Thanks y'all!

[Zues126]

What's the best response to 'it hurt that you think this was my choice'?

Just from a validating practice I'm curious if there was something better. It's tough to validate when you are so incredulous about what they're saying. I thought I did ok but am curious. Thanks!

[Ancaire]

I suppose, "Are you f'ing kidding me?" isn't a good validating response?

I understand, you felt you were doing what was in the best interests of us both?

I understand you feeling hurt by my opion?

I wish my thoughts didn't cause you to feel hurt?

I'm not sure, Zeus. I haven't got this validating in the bag yet. I still tend towards sarcasm, or straight-up truth. I'm in your camp...huh? How can she reach any other conclusion?

It is tough to validate when you're just stunned. Wow!

[PigPen]

Hey Z,

Not sure how to best answer that specific question, other than perhaps, "In my heart D was not what I wanted but I understand that you don't feel like it was your choice."

With something like that, you're validating but also - it really wasn't your choice from what I know of your sitch.

Just want to lend you some support, I'm sure this conversation stirred you up more than anything has recently. Your posts have made it seem like you've moved well past her, but also indicate that there's still some hurt there. Understandable hurt to say the least.

I was reading on someone else's thread all that you did for your W so that she would want to express to her friends that you are the greatest H out there. You also listed how she would talk about your negatives if she could. It hit home for me.

My list of ways I worked and worked and worked myself to sickness with the hopes that my W would recognize and acknowledge and be proud mirror yours. As does the opposing list of challenges that I faced, partly as a way to cope with the volume of output to reach that recognition.

It's extremely challenging to feel like you're giving 110% and none of it is being seen - or the work is overlooked because of our faults. Now your W sees it. It may be too late for your M, but the recognition is there. She may not have been able to see it before and that's got nothing to do with you. She may have also been too blind by what she saw as your shortcomings to see it as well.

Either way, no one can take away from the fact that you've become a rock star dad. I'm sorry you're D'ed and am not really interested in your W's narrative. But I will say that if you had to go through all of this to become the dad that you have, it's almost worth it. Your kids are your kids for life, and now they have a dad they will always be proud of.

Keep rocking Z,

PP

[Zues126]

After rereading my exchange I am very satisfied with how I handled it. I acknowledged my contributions, then validated that I understood she felt she didn't have a choice...meanwhile I didn't AGREE she didn't have a choice, I merely stated I understood that's what she felt...so there was a teeeny truth dart in there...also I didn't break my policy of not opening up with MY feelings or emotions considering that she never asked...so I don't think there was anything that would hint at neediness, pursuit, sadness, or any attachment. Then I ended by talking about being a good dad, again, validating her comment, but not agreeing it was because of the divorce.

I think I did good. Again, it doesn't really matter, I am just doing this out of habit and not wanting to give her the satisfaction of drawing me into a debate, opening up, or acting in a way to justify her decision. Oh, and because I'm trying to do my best in general!


PP- I think it's even better without talking about what we wanted or what's in our heart...just the first half, "I understand you didn't feel it was a choice" is perfect. She didn't ask how I felt, I don't need to state it. But thank you. I am doing good. In a weird way it's cool that it stirred up a little sadness, because I am more excited by how quickly that pain faded and how little it hurt than I was stung. If that makes sense. Keep going guys!

[JulieH]

I think it was great that you owned up to her and acknowledged how much she did with kids alone over the years. Based on some of her remarks in the past, it seems like she felt unappreciated regarding this and feels that you did not recognize how difficult it is to take care of small children. (Not saying you did, just saying she might have felt like this)

I'm not good at validating and putting thoughts into words, but...
Do you think that she feels that you perhaps had "emotionally divorced" her first? Which is why she felt it was mutual. I know I feel like that with my husband and the way he will not communicate with me. (although our case is different because my husband physically moved out. Also you mention that you wrote and expressed your desires to make marriage work).

[Zues126]

I think it was great that you owned up to her and acknowledged how much she did with kids alone over the years. Based on some of her remarks in the past, it seems like she felt unappreciated regarding this and feels that you did not recognize how difficult it is to take care of small children. (Not saying you did, just saying she might have felt like this)

I'm not good at validating and putting thoughts into words, but...
Do you think that she feels that you perhaps had "emotionally divorced" her first? Which is why she felt it was mutual. I know I feel like that with my husband and the way he will not communicate with me. (although our case is different because my husband physically moved out. Also you mention that you wrote and expressed your desires to make marriage work).

Thanks Julie. I am pretty happy with that little exchange

As for feeling 'emotionally divorced'...you should know my response by now.

Emotionally divorced is practically an oxymoron. Can I quit showing up at work and file unemployment because I was emotionally fired? Can I buy the 70K truck from Anc's WAH because I emotionally won the lottery?

I'm sure she felt she was emotionally neglected. Without a doubt.

I just don't like anything blurring the black and white around divorce and affairs.

[Painter]

I think you did a fantastic job. I laughed when I read Ancaire's reply because it's much closer to what I would have said.

I can't believe you weren't an attentive dad. Many dads become more active after a divorce because the mothers tend to manage the children and set themselves up as the primary parent while they're married (and as we know, even after).

She did good in using her experience with missing the kids to empathize with you, though!

[Zues126]

I'm in one of those moments where everything seems to have stopped.

I was hustling all week at work, jamming to get off to a good start for January in my sales job. There was some family stuff in there earlier in the week, the last few days have been a lot of driving and a hotel as I put deals together around the outskirts of my territory.

Now today I am about to head to a pool tournament. It's the calm before the storm. I can see the fear welling up already. Lack of preparation. Lack of purpose.

I used to be younger. Didn't have the growing bald spot. Didn't have the love handles. I was young, in shape, focused, intense, hungry. And I was motivated to be the best I could be. All of it, all of it was driven to be an awesome man, one that XW would feel lucky to have.

Now I look in the mirror and I feel so unprepared. I don't have the reason to win. It just looks like a silly game. But that's the trap. Playing to have fun playing isn't actually playing the game. What makes pool, or any competition special, is committing to an outcome, then watching your entire being contort and transform to become the creature it needs to be to achieve that outcome. That's where magic happens, where you experience flow, superhuman achievements, amazing shots, moments where you feel part of something beyond yourself. Just showing up to hit balls and see what happens, that's not even pool.

But it all starts with a goal and a sense of purpose. I struggle to find my sense of purpose. It used to be for my wife. It fueled everything. I've been doing well overall, but times like this I feel the full impact of all of the losses I've had in my life. I am going into battle alone. If I suffer, if I fail, if I get broken down and destroyed, no one cares. The other losses are taking their toll. I woke up thinking of my chocolate lab. The best dog I've ever had. He was so big, and clumsy, and a bit dominant and aggressive with other dogs, but he was so loving to me, so protective, so loyal, I just wish I could explain to him now how much I love him too. Of course my marriage is gone. I can't see a road that leads to anything that will ever make that ok. I can handle that, but sometimes I think back to when we met, when I was 23, in good shape, breaking through into professional tournaments, rising up in the corporate world, working hard to give her a house, family, and the ability to raise the children, every day about trying to take care of her...those were the best years of my life. It's impossible to imagine anything that would compare, even though I understand the road ahead leads to places I can't see.

Then I think about the present. I keep screwing up. I don't know what to say sometimes. Jelly stopped posting. I couldn't find the right words. I still can't. Or maybe she's battling her own battles.

Now I'm afraid of how unprepared I am. I don't want to lose. And if I lose, I want to play my best and be outplayed. I don't want to be disengaged, distracted, washed up and weak. I haven't been competing, and everyone wants to beat me, and the competition is so tough. And I have people that believe in me, people rooting me on, people betting on me. I feel like telling them in advance how sorry I am if I can't get it done.

I remember being 17 at the poolhall, seeing all of these middle aged guys that were divorced, sick, broken families, drama, and I always wondered, why would anyone allow that to happen? I always thought I'd be different. I saw them talk about how they used to want to be great at pool too, and I thought I'd be different and would actually be the best in the world. Now I look and I've been beat down in every way, and it's just a matter of time before I get swallowed back up by the ground with the music I wanted to write unwritten. I feel like I'm playing an instrument that's out of tune, in my mind it is a beautiful melody, but when it comes out of me it sounds off key, people listening bustle by quickly because it is just off.

I feel like telling everyone. Kids. XW. Boss. Fans. All of you. I am trying me best. It isn't turning out the way I wanted.

But I won't give up. I'm going to try to find a purpose for the day. Maybe this is my purpose. Battling the specter of defeat, of mediocrity, finding a small moment in all of this disarray where I can let perfection and success and accomplishment flow through me. One moment that is ok. That's what I will look for today. And while no one cares, I will tell you so I know there is a witness to my suffering and struggles.

Taking a deep breath now. Time to get showered up, pack the bags, and hit the road south. Another deep breath. And another. Slowing down. One more.

Let's see if I can find some pool in me today.

I will be offline for a few days. Wishing you all the best. Take care.

[Ancaire]

But I won't give up. I'm going to try to find a purpose for the day. Maybe this is my purpose. Battling the specter of defeat, of mediocrity, finding a small moment in all of this disarray where I can let perfection and success and accomplishment flow through me. One moment that is ok. That's what I will look for today.

This. Right here. This is what you're going to report when you get back to the forum.

I care. (((Zues)))