Saying ILY...

[mtb1981]

Sandi, I totally understand what you are saying. I think I was trying to set a boundary, but the way I worded it sounded like whining. Alos, I am familiar with DTR, and I'm trying to detach as much as possible. One of the problems in our relationship though was me not paying attention to her or her needs. It's messed up, because paying more attention to her and what she is saying would be a 180 for me, but at the same time I don't want it to appear as pursuing. As far as babysitters go, my parents will watch the kids every once in a while, but I don't have many others that could, And yes, I do have a full time job as a teacher...

AS, thanks for the advice on saying ILY. I do think she is being genuine. She says it before leaving the house, after talking on the phone, and after saying good night. Not once has she tried to use it against me to pick a fight. The pill thing is tricky. She has been to rehab, and really wanted to stay clean. Afterwards, at doctors visits she would tell them that she had addiction issues and that she didn't want to be put on opiates. So they put her on a list, and won't precsribe them to her anymore. She went to a pain management clinic recently and will be starting physical therapy and getting injections in her back. But now, it's like she's in limbo. They won't prescribe her any pills, and the physical therapy and pain injections haven't started yet...

[sandi2]

It's a bad situation when the wayward spouse is suffering from a physical problem. If her doctors won't prescribe pain medication, then I suspect she is getting something without prescriptions. The addiction and how she is obtaining the pills may play a part in her GGW lifestyle.

One of the problems in our relationship though was me not paying attention to her or her needs. It's messed up, because paying more attention to her and what she is saying would be a 180 for me, but at the same time I don't want it to appear as pursuing

What specific needs? Did she tell you?

Another complaint of hers was that I never apologize for anything. And she's kind of right. I didn't see a need to apologize for something that I didn't see as wrong, even if it bothered her, which I now see as wrong. I needed to validate her feelings of being upset and apologize for making her feel the way I did....

But a 180 does not mean you take the blame and start apologizing for every little thing she complains about..........especially when she is being sarcastic (like the snuggling). If you know you need to apologize for something, then do it. When a W is wayward, the H has to present himself in a position of strength. I'm not telling you to never apologize when you do something to cause her legitmate hurt. I am saying not to do like some guys that get into a habit of apologizing for something all the time, b/c he thinks it will bring peace with her. Just b/c she complains......does not mean he should take blame and jump in to apologize. Do you see what I mean?

You mentioned she thought you never listened to her. You can listen, without telling her what she should do to fix it. Some H's think that's their job. However, unless she asks for advice, she doesn't want it. Women want to be heard. If she starts bashing you, then you walk away.

[mtb1981]

I have some questions about setting boundaries. In my previous posts, I mentioned that W comes home at early hours in the morning, sometimes sleeping in her van. This morning she got home at 7:00 AM (15 minutes before I had to leave for work). The kids have really been struggling with her not being around either. They see her for a few minutes here or there when she comes home to get ready for work. She is asleep when they leave for school, so they don't see her in the morning. She is also not helping to pay any of the bills or do anything around the house. At this point, I feel as though she is treating our home like a hotel, or a changing room.

I am not happy with this behavior, and I think it is disrespectful to me, the kids, and our marital home. guess my question is, how do I set a boundary without seeming like I am being controlling? Do I tell her that if she continues to be gone all the time that she needs to find her own place? And if so, what is the timeline for this to happen? I feel like she will throw it back in my face, saying that I'm being controlling and telling her what she can or can't do.

[mtb1981]

Also, she had mentioned in a previous conversation that she wanted to split custody 50/50 with the kids, yet she is rarely home to see them. Should I set a boundary in this area as well. Stating that if she is serious about wanting to split custody that she needs to be responsible for the kids 3 or 4 nights a week, instead of leaving them at home with me every night while she runs around until she comes home at 4 in the morning?

[mtb1981]

Well... I talked to W while I was at work today to see what her work schedule was for the week. She asked why, and I told her that we needed to talk about what was going on with the kids and what her timeline on moving out was. My plan was to set some boundaries as mentioned in my previous 2 posts. She kind of got a little pissy when I mentioned it. I told her I had to go and we would discuss it when I got home...

I've been do really well with detaching the past few days, no calls/texts throughout the day, no ily's, no cuddling at night. Just been getting things taken care of around the house and acting "as if". This weekend, I kind of had an awakening and really let go. I finally believed that I don't need her and her poor behavior in my life and maybe it would be best if she did leave. I'm not saying that I've given up, but I realized I'll be fine with or without her. I'm in a better place mentally than I have been in a while and I feel great...

So, tonight when I got home, I put a record on while I was cooking dinner and cleaning the kitchen. Just singing, messing with the kids, and enjoying myself. She kind of ignored me while she was getting ready for work, and I honestly didn't care. I also got a new phone this weekend, and she picked it up and asked what the passcode was with kind of a smirk on her face. I just told her and went about my business. She read through some of my texts, and it didn't bother me one bit bc I have nothing to hide. I think she expected me to tell her to bug off. As she was walking out the door, she asked me what I wanted to talk about. I told her I would talk to her tomorrow because she was leaving for work. She kind of got pissy again, said whatever, and walked out the door. About 5 seconds later she popped back in, and said, "So are you kicking me out of the house?". I said, "No. We'll talk about it tomorrow when you have more time." I got another "whatever" and she left...

Our youngest son was sick today, and he threw up all over me about an hour after she left. I sent her a text to let her know what was going on with him, to which she responded, "poor baby". I didn't reply. An hour later texted "How is our baby doing?" I gave her another update, and she then responded with, "Btw, not being home the past few days has made me realize I don't want this. I want to work on our family" I have not yet responded...

Last night, she had her work Christmas party. She told me she saw our mutual friend there, and he had heard we were splitting up, and she said that we were. He asked if it had anything to do with her new job at the bar, and if it did, she shouldn't leave. She told him it had nothing to do with her new job, and then asked if he and a few of my other friends would still be friends with her. And from what I got, he basically said no, we won't be friends, that she was being selfish and I didn't deserve to be dealing with this. I think that this in conjuction with my general attitude this past weekend and wanting to talk about custody of the kids and when she would be moving out has lifted her fog a bit...

I have no expectations, but I do see this as a positive sign...

[sandi2]

It is great you have been detaching and are feeling better.

I am going to tell you something I don't ordinarily tell a newcomer......well, maybe not this soon anyway. It is time for you to make a stand, and she will have a decision to make. (1). She can quit her trashy job, and quit her trashy, young, partying friends. She can quit engaging in party buses and other such activity. She can quit the pills and get help for the addiction and any other issues. She can stop trashing her H on social media. She can stop sleeping in the van, and behave like a responsible and respectable wife and mother. Or (2) she can face the consequences of divorce and protective child services. It is her choice, but either way you will no longer stay in a relationship like the current one. She needs to know this is no idle threat, and that you are fed up and done with her behavior. She needs to believe she is losing her H and that he is ready to move on with or without her. Of course, that means you must be prepared to follow through if she doesn't choose the first option. And, she doesn't get to straddle the fence. She can't have it both ways.

She does not need to see a weak, emotional man who is pleading or bargaining with his WW. There will be no pleas, no trying to reason, and no persuasion. She will see a man who speaks with firm determination and strength. He does not waiver. He does not compromise. He tells her he has decided he will not live in this situation any longer. He will no longer be her dog to beat down. He will no longer take her punishment. If she can't forgive and move forward, then that is her problem.......but it is no longer HIS problem! Do you get that? He is through eating her sh't sandwiches. He is not attracted to the person she has become and he is done with it.

She has a choice to leave or stay. But you will not wait around for her to make up her mind. It's right now......or she leaves. But if she stays, it will be under the terms you've stated, and you don't care if she calls you controlling........b/c that is just a tool she uses to control YOU! Btw, the first time she comes home and sleeps in the van, you will put all her clothes and personal items out on the carport. Since she just drives by to get a change of clothes, you'll save her the effort of even entering the doorway. Don't be afraid to tell her you don't need a W like that.

Don't put up with her dragging up the past and rehashing all that you did wrong. WW's thrive on resentment of the past. The past cannot be undone, but this is the present. Hold up your hand in the "stop" signal, and tell her to stop. If she won't, then tell her she's made her decision and she needs to get her things and leave. Don't put up with her b.s.

Let me tell you something. She thinks you are jealous of her and other men. Maybe you are. However, she is enjoying the heck out of what it's doing to you. She is getting her revenge by throwing herself at other guys and making you squirm. She loves it! And, she takes her digs at you on a public social media like FB. Stop responding to her on FB! Men talk face to face, not get on FB and post to their WW. That is Beta behavior.

Now I want you to understand something. You must stop accepting blame for the actions your W is choosing to do! If not, then nothing you do will produce positive results between you and your W. That's what a lot of guys don't get. They sc@w up. Then they repent and get their act together. But the W won't let it go. She doesn't want to forgive him. Get it? She does not want to forgive. She has a heart issue. It's not that she can't forgive him.....but she doesn't want him getting off that easily. That's how some people see forgiving another person......as letting them off too easily. Her heart has hardened and she only wants to punish and keep on punishing him till the day she dies. Too harsh to hear? Sorry, but you need to know that if a man molds himself to his W's whipping strap......will not care how hateful she is being to him, and how good he is being to her...... and then love will just flood her heart. Sadly, it doesn't work that way. B/c she sees a man who acts like the victim she's made out of him, and she can't be attracted to a man she can verbally and emotionally (maybe even physically) beat down. Women have to look up to their man, not down. Women were made in such a way they have to respect their H, before they can have those soft, loving feelings for him. Make sense?

Do you believe you did so bad that you deserve how she treats you? Wrong! Now, she is just as guilty as you and it has to stop here. Don't take this the wrong way, but I want you to get angry about her sh'tty treatment of you. Perhaps you have been angry at some level, but you use passive-aggressive ways to show it. That's not the right way. You need to have the mindset of, "That's it! I've had enough and refuse to live this way". Mean it and stick to it. She can get therapy, or whatever it takes to find forgiveness and get her heart right toward you.......or she can go on her way. You should not have to live with an unforgiving person for the rest of your life. Life is too short!

Some people do not agree with this approach. And, you certainly don't have to do anything I suggest. After all, it's your life, not mine.

[mtb1981]

Well... I took Sandi's advice. Talked to her a couple of weeks ago and told her it was time to make up her mind. All the bs needs to stop. Of course she said she wanted to work on things, but in the last 2 weeks nothing has changed. I got up for work this morning, and she was sitting out in the van wide awake at 6:30. I've been wanting to talk to her about how she wasn't respecting the boundaries that I set, but she always found an excuse to push it off (too tired, late for work, etc.) So this morning I told her it was time for her to leave. That if she wanted to work on things, the door was open, but if she didn't the door was open, but she was going to have to walk out of it. She chose to walk out...

[mtb1981]

I honestly thought I would be upset about it, but I'm not. I actually feel really good. A weight has been lifted off me. I guess I'm just sick and tired of being sick and tired....

[Mowgli]

Good luck with things, mtb.

Keep us in the loop here on the board!

I'm guessing that she will be back at some point. How will you deal with that?

[mtb1981]

I'm not sure if she will want to come back, or how I would deal with it if she did. A lot of things came to light this past week...

Now I'm pretty sure there is OM involved. This past Saturday night, she told me her grandma was in the hospital and not doing well. Sunday she said they moved her to a different hospital a few hours away and that she was going to go up there Sunday night after work and be there all day Monday visiting her. I told her that I hoped her grandma was OK and wished her luck. On Monday, I tried contacting her to see how things were with gma. She told me things were going OK, but the whole time, she was very short and cold in our interactions. I chalked it up to her being upset about her grandma, but I still had a weird feeling. I ended up calling her dad yesterday to see if she was with him at the hospital seeing her grandma like she said. He informed me that grandma was never in the hospital , and was very mad that W would lie about it so she could go do something else. Her dad called her and chewed her out for lying about it. A few minutes later she called me all mad telling me I wasn't allowed to talk to her family. I just told her that there was no reason to make that story up, that she was free to do whatever she wanted, and it made no sense. She said she spent all Sunday night partying and all Monday recovering. I'm just upset, because she obviously had this planned since Saturday. I asked her why she lied and her response was that she didn't want me to try to stop her. I haven't tried to stop her from doing anything since she left, So it didn't make sense to me...

I also heard from several people that she has been spending a lot of time with a male coworker. I had noticed the same thing. When I asked her about it, she said they were just friends. This morning, I checked her facebook messages (I know I shouldn't be snooping, but sometimes you just have to know) and she was messaging her female friend who is also a coworker of hers about going to Mardi Gras in Stl this weekend. Her female coworker asked if she was still going to go if OM wasn't going. W's response was that she told OM she was going to pay for everything if he went and really wants him to go...