Saying ILY...

[SteveLW]

I just caught up on your sitch. Sorry man, it has to have been rough through all of this. I keep thinking of sandi2's first thread for the LBS.

My sitch can be found here: http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2778449#Post2778449

I see some similarities in our sitch's except that my wife is home all of the time. All of her illicit behavior is online. But the push pull of "I want out" and "I want to stay" is there too.

I need to step up my GAL efforts, and I need to do more to detach from her. But every time I do she responds the opposite (draws closer). I have to stop falling for it and just keep the detachment going. Another author that I had a paid consultation with said that the only way I would know her behavior was lasting was after she behaved that way consistently for months. She isn't there.

I said to her this morning in a short discussion something about her "not wanting to stay". She immediately said "I do want to stay". Believe nothing they say and only half of what they do!

Anyway, I will keep you in my prayers. And your family, and even your W.

[AnotherStander]

Wow mtb, your W is a real piece of work. A lying cheater that abuses pain pills, cocaine and who knows what else. Falls asleep in the drive while smoking. Instead of encouraging her to see the kids more I think you need to talk to a lawyer and go about the business of protecting your kids and your assets. She is a danger to your kids, you and herself. Worse yet, she has no desire to change. She's got to hit rock bottom before she might see the light, but that could be quite a ways off yet. Until then, you have really got to get her out of your life. That may sound harsh, but I have had secondary exposure to a similar situation and a family counselor flat-out said "you've got to kick her out of the house before she destroys the entire family." I wish you the best, and I am very serious about consulting a lawyer ASAP. And discuss a restraining order.

[mtb1981]

AS,
As each day goes by, I'm starting to understand this more and more. She pulled the same old crap again today. She had the whole day off and said she would be around to hang out with the kids, so I could get out of the house to get some things done. Finally got off the couch where she slept last night at 10:30 this morning and said she had to go do a few thibgs for work and would be right back. Finally showed up at 2:00 to come in to start a load of laundry, and said she wanted to go tanning and would be right back. At 5:45 she was still not back, so I called to see if she was going to be home soon so I could go run some errands and she told me she was at the bar she works at and decided to pick up the night shift that starts at 7:00. Then asks me if that was OK. Like it really mattered what my response was. I told her that she could do whatever she wanted to do, but that it was not "OK". That she said she was going to do something and then backs out at the last minute and that's pretty crappy.She said she could come home for an hour, but I told her not to worry about it and ended the conversation. I realize that I'm being used as a free babysitter, laundromat, and storage unit. She's completely selfish and tells me whatever she has to to be able to get what she wants (i.e. telling me she'll be right back when she knows she won't because she doesn't want to be stuck with the kids at the house). I agree that she's gonna have to hit rock bottom before she even has a chance of figuring things out. I was really hoping I could avoid getting a lawyer this early in the process, but I'm thinking you may be right. As far as a restraining order goes, why do you think that would be necessary? She's pretty harmless, just extremely selfish and never around anyway. I was having trouble detaching, but she's been making it easier with her recent actions...

[mtb1981]

So last night, W came home at 7:00 to get some of the clothes she washed. The shift she picked up starts at 7:00. While she's there, she tells me she is wanting to quit the bar job and find a job waiting tables during the day, so she has more time to be with the kids. She also said she wants to start MC, but not until she finds a place to move into. WTF??? Tells me she has her bff out in the van and that she is coming to work with her bc she was upset that her grandmother passed away earlier that day and wanted to get out of the house and hang out. She continues to grab a few other things (makeup, hair stuff, more clothes) and then says she has to leave because she is running late. Not sure what to think about any of this, except I don't believe any of it at this point. In a previous post, I had mentioned about her lying about her grandma being in the hospital so she could go out and party all night. Now she claims her friend's grandma passed away while she was grabbing a bunch of stuff like she was going to get ready to go out. Her friend was outside, and I told her I was sorry to hear about her grandma passing and she told me thank you. I've told her before that there is no reason for her to lie to me, that she can do whatever she wants. But it seems like she is saying she has to work when she doesn't just so she can do something else. I can't understand why, because she has told me plenty of other stupid things she's doing and I never say anything or try to stop her bc it's not my business. This behavior is just weird...

[SteveLW]

It is her own guilt. I've said to my WW multiple times "what does it matter if I know what you are chatting about with other guys online if we are done anyway?" That never got an answer.

But remember sandi2's list of rules, especially "believe nothing she says and only 1/2 of what she does". WW are living a secret life. And they are so caught up in it that the truth and fantasy begin to blend. They feel they have to lie to keep the illusion going. Further, WW get a high from the feeling that what they are doing is taboo! Being truthful about things doesn't give them that "I have a dirty little secret" feeling that lying does.

Further, more than likely the OM was going to be where ever your WW and bff were going. And that is what made her feel a need to lie too. Again, because telling you the truth, the feeling of freedom to do whatever she wants, takes away from the romantic passion of the A. With her relationship to the OM completely out in the open it becomes as mundane, in her mind, as her marriage had become.

And the one thing WW spouses cannot handle is mundane. Thus, she is not even being the mother she should be.

For me the thin, red line is a PA. If I were you I would tell her you want her stuff cleaned out today, and you don't want her on your couch anymore. If she is serious about MC, about trying to save the M, then she will realize that getting the boot is the final act of you moving on with your life.

I would boot her and have her served with papers (IE file for D). If that doesn't wake her up then likely nothing will. Please read this post by sandi2:

http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2545554#Post2545554

Notice: *She is in complete rebellion, and will defy you when you make demands, threats or give ultimatums.

The time for boundaries with no real consequences are over. You need to take action. Kick her out. File for D. It could just save your marriage.

[joejoe1]

Mtb,

Steve is right you W is in full rebellion. She has lost all respect for you.

You are not babysitting, parents don't babysit their children, they shield them and raise them. You are being a awesome dad, while your W is living her fantasy. Please don't call yourself a babysitter.

I will like to add to what Steve has said. It took TxHubby 3 years to get to the point of being completely fed up. I can see you are getting their, but you are not there yet.

Your W needs a wake up call, she has to have reality hit her square in the face. If you are not ready now, you will be tired of allowing her to do whatever she wants around you.

Some things you could do is pack up all her stuff and have it waiting in the garage or by front door. Tell her you are not going to MC until you feel as thou she is ready to work on the M. Until then you will continue to work on yourself.

Tell her to pack her sh$t and get out. She might not leave, but the tone in your voice and the stance of your body will make a huge statement. After you make that statement don't say anything else, turn and leave, the last thing she will remember in that moment is the back of your head and body walking away (out of her life).

She is playing games, and you don't like being part of her game, so pull yourself out of her craziness and work on becoming healthy and detaching.

You can also, just start ghosting her. When she starts to tell you about what she is about to do and where she is about to go, " you tell her politely that you don't care and tell her to enjoy her night". Don't give her time to give you an explanation. Let her start to wonder what is going on, why doesn't he care anymore. Pull yourself out one foot at a time if you have to do it that way.

Oneward and forward

[mtb1981]

I know what everyone has been saying here is right. Why does it have to be so hard? I guess my fear is that by kicking her out and filing for D, is that it's all just over. But at this point, I guess there isn't much of another choice. I'm thinking she doesn't want to start MC until she has a place bc then she can continue to keep the fantasy going. If she stays here, it would all come to a halt. She knows how committed I am to our M, and she is taking advantage of that fact. Thinking I'll just sit by waiting for her to get whatever this is out of her system, and then she can just come back home whenever she feels like it. I hate having to do this bc she has always been very stubborn, and I'm nearly positive that she will just move forward with the D. That way she can continue to play the victim and have this all be my fault. But at this point, she doesn't want it anyway...

[SteveLW]

She may very well move forward with the D. And only you know when you are ready for that potential. But the alternative is to continue in limbo. Personally I made the decision to only remain in limbo for 1 year. If after 1 year she is not 100% committed to the marriage, I ask her to leave and I go file.

Again, only you know when enough is enough, but I personally couldn't tolerate the behavior you are tolerating.

[joejoe1]

Mtb,

You don't have to get a D until you are ready. You can make your W feel the reality without getting a D. Read up on detachment and GAL. I read detachment all the time. I used it as a guideline. Read Sandi's 37 rules. You also have to practice them. Do 180s. Use them and see which one's work for your sitch and which one's doesn't.

Onward and forward

[mtb1981]

Maybe telling her that we need to start MC ASAP, not just wait until she has a place. That if she was serious about wanting to work on things she would be willing to start now. If she doesn't agree to this, she just needs to get the rest of her stuff and hand over her house key. That the way things have been going is ridiculous, I don't deserve it, and I respect myself too much to deal with it any longer...

I know her well enough, that I'm pretty sure she'll just take her stuff and tell everyone how her mean husband forced her out of the house. She wants to be the victim in all of this and likes the attention she'll get from it...

I know she needs reality to hit her, but like I said, she is rarely home anyway. So this won't be much of a change for her at all. Just another reason for her to be able to blame it all on me. Then it won't be her fault anymore in her mind. It will have gone from "I'm not happy and want to leave" to "He kicked me out and I have nowhere to go". Then she won't be the bad guy. And she'll be able to get everyone's pity and attention...