Former WH, now LBS Please Help, close to Give Up

[sandi2]

Off course i want to go back to my comfort zone : aka be polite to each other, she hide when contact OM2 (aka not show obvious disrespect, give to me some grumps of affection and attention to me, and allow me to do for

I doubt you will be able to go back to your comfort zone for a long time. The condition of your MR did not happen over night, and it won't be fixed over night. Instead of you needing to know what to do and say every evening before going home, you have to begin thinking like the man you read about on the red pill.

I want you to understand clearly that as long as she is making fun of you on FB or to others........or showing you disrespect in any form, there will be no more playing nice and licking up table crumbs from her affection. Do you get why? Alpha men don't play that game. They don't beg for crumbs.

Stop sending her messages on FB. Don't text her throughout the day. She is completely addicted to her phone, and you do not need to act as if you don't know of any other way to communicate. When you have something to discuss, tell her to her face. Don't hide behind a text, if you have something important to say to her.

You should have personal boundaries set in place, and if she dishonors those boundaries, then you should be prepared to enforce it by leaving her with the consequences. If she disrespects you, she should have consequences. If you don't know what to do about it........then you are already sunk before you start. Begin by having the right attitude. Reading on line about how the Alpha H deals with a disrespectful W, will help to mentally prepare you with the attitude of strength and male dominance.

I understand financial stress, but if you are going to have an effective plan of action to live with her under the same roof.........you first must lose your fear of losing her. And, if anyone leaves, it should be the cheater. However, some WW's are so bad and so stubborn, they won't leave. They prefer to put the family through hell, rather than being respectful.

She is texting OM in front of you? What do you think a dominant male would do? How would he get the message to her that she will not disrespect him by texting OM? Let me give you a hint about what you don't do. You don't say things like, "Please don't contact OM in front of me, b/c it really offends me". Heck no! That is something a woman says.......but not a Alpha man.

She can have a friendship with OM, or a M with you, but she cannot have both. Anytime a woman chooses a friendship over her own H.......I promise you it is an affair of some type. What woman in her right mind would choose just a casual friend over keeping her H? It is absurd. However, she may have to be convinced she is really losing her H, and everything she benefits from the MR..........before she comes to her right senses about OM. Are you prepared to go the distance?

1. Should I do sport with her and the kids or do it alone

I was confused about the whole sport's thing. Is your son playing in this sport, or are you and W and son going to watch someone else play a sport? Is the OM your son's coach?

2. Should i go hole late...

Late from what? Work? GAL? I don't understand what you mean.

3. What to do if she ask if i will leave the house/when and/or what i think to do from now on

Are you referring to you going out to Get a Life? If so, you give vague answers without giving her details.

4. What to do if she FB OM2 in front of me

Tell her one time that you will not live in an open M. Tell her one time she is being disrespectful to you and the M when she has private friendships with other men. It is not appropriate. You will not be disrespected by her texting/reading messaging and giving any type of attention to OM.

Then, the very next time she ignores you and texts or reads his messages........you will need to do some type of action that shows her (but, with no acts of violence) the consequences for disrespecting you. Can you do that? If not, then there is no reason to ever open your mouth, b/c she already has you whipped like a dog.

Am I saying you need to be ready to physically separate? Yes, I am. Otherwise, you will live in an open M and be disrespected. It's your decision. Sure, you can try smashing her phone, and things of that nature.......but I doubt it will have much affect on her behavior. Telling her to get her things and find some other place to stay......may be more effective. You won't financially support her, either. If she doesn't want to act like a M woman, then she should not benefit from the M. Make sense?

5. What to do if she ask/inform me that she are going to dinner/lunch with OM2

Tell her you don't want the woman she has become, and tell her to get her things and leave.

6. What to do if i know she is going to lunch/dinner

Same thing.

7. What to say if she start talking about future thing events (aka we will together in future)

Say nothing. Believe nothing she says about the future.

8. What if she start talking about how she fills (tired/nervous ans so on ) up to now i try to validate or listen, not going to fix nothing. From the past i know if i ask what i can do for you to be better, her respond was i want peace (aka not bother her about her behavior) she is very glad when she doing this (punch me).

Do you understand those same signs indicate her conniving, lying, and deceitful ways? She says she wants peace, but she really only wants you out of the way. So......don't validate this, or ask her if she wants to talk about it........and for God's sake don't ask what you can do to make her feel better. It is not your job to make a cheater feel better.

What do you mean she is very glad to punch you? Why are you asking so many questions about what to say or how to respond to a woman who enjoys hurting you? This tells me you have been much too weak in showing that you will not allow her to treat you so badly. People will not respect you if you let them bully you. This is especially true in marriage. Start showing her you are a strong man who will no longer put up with her. Once you really decide you have had enough of her disrespectful treatment........you won't have to ask anyone what you should do.

Do you know why you are asking now? You are really wanting someone to tell you how you can remain a Beta male, keep your nice guy syndrome.......and still get your WW to love and respect you.

[betheoa]

Thanks Sandy. You were harsh and I appreciate that.
About the comfort zone.....I try to be sarcastic with me. No I will not go there any more...I expect from me more as man.

I do not text, call or anything else to her. I do not explained my self other than face to face. This is from more than 6 months. When she is harsh by phone I leave the call.

About attitude in hose. ..message revived.

Will continuous later

[betheoa]

Sandy, i will continuation to answer and comment your post. (i will try to write as clear as possible, my English obviously is not enough, to explain my self understandable)

She can have a friendship with OM, or a M with you, but she cannot have both. Anytime a woman chooses a friendship over her own H.......I promise you it is an affair of some type. What woman in her right mind would choose just a casual friend over keeping her H? It is absurd. However, she may have to be convinced she is really losing her H, and everything she benefits from the MR..........before she comes to her right senses about OM. Are you prepared to go the distance?

Yes Sandy i am prepared, i want to change the life i have. The status quo smack me (mentally)

I was confused about the whole sport's thing. Is your son playing in this sport, or are you and W and son going to watch someone else play a sport? Is the OM your son's coach?

2 months ago, my wife start martial art (in my opinion to impress OM2), with the kids, i join my self as well. My question is should i go with them when it is possible or, try to avoid be together (and miss to be with the kids). OM2 is not involved in this sport activities.

Late from what? Work? GAL? I don't understand what you mean.

Normally i my schedule is pretty constant (predictable), after work i use this time to read/write on the forum, so i go home late then normal. My W notice, and ask occasionally. So my question was: Should i use every opportunity, to be not at home? About GAL my except my sport activates martial art (3 to 5 times a week), i do not have more GAL. Leave home 6.30Am - come Home in bast case 5.30 PM. My W, take kids to/from school, weekends i look after kids, if/when my wife is on work.

Are you referring to you going out to Get a Life? If so, you give vague answers without giving her details.

this i have understand. My point was, If/when My W start R/M talks, and ask when i will leave and stay at other place (aka separate), or what i am thinking about how we will leave from now on. In the past, after thought conversation (days/week later), and she is calm down, she start asking this, that because i do not discus what i am thinking and what i will do.

Tell her one time that you will not live in an open M. Tell her one time she is being disrespectful to you and the M when she has private friendships with other men. It is not appropriate. You will not be disrespected by her texting/reading messaging and giving any type of attention to OM.

I already told this, when wrote here for first time. So i think there is not reason to do it again (in the past i have said this many times). So this have to stop, saying something and doing nothing.

Then, the very next time she ignores you and texts or reads his messages........you will need to do some type of action that shows her (but, with no acts of violence) the consequences for disrespecting you. Can you do that? If not, then there is no reason to ever open your mouth, b/c she already has you whipped like a dog.

Unfortunately, i do not have any other option to make consequences, than leave the house for logger time. Other option is to silent treatment her?...Now i respond to her very short and civil, do not pay any affection and/or attention, no cals, no text, not nothing. Just bills, grocery and kids related things.

Am I saying you need to be ready to physically separate? Yes, I am. Otherwise, you will live in an open M and be disrespected. It's your decision. Sure, you can try smashing her phone, and things of that nature.......but I doubt it will have much affect on her behavior. Telling her to get her things and find some other place to stay......may be more effective. You won't financially support her, either. If she doesn't want to act like a M woman, then she should not benefit from the M. Make sense?

She stated that she will not leave without the kids, so true her out is not the option. Other way is I am leaving. So any suggestion if/when i do this, what to say to the kids?? They will ask. I can lay them that i will have work for week or months. This is really bothering me.

Tell her you don't want the woman she has become, and tell her to get her things and leave.

In my case, i am leaving.

Do you understand those same signs indicate her conniving, lying, and deceitful ways? She says she wants peace, but she really only wants you out of the way. So......don't validate this, or ask her if she wants to talk about it........and for God's sake don't ask what you can do to make her feel better. It is not your job to make a cheater feel better.

Sandy - This was in the past. How i am just listen (not like poppy), or leave.

What do you mean she is very glad to punch you? Why are you asking so many questions about what to say or how to respond to a woman who enjoys hurting you? This tells me you have been much too weak in showing that you will not allow her to treat you so badly. People will not respect you if you let them bully you. This is especially true in marriage. Start showing her you are a strong man who will no longer put up with her. Once you really decide you have had enough of her disrespectful treatment........you won't have to ask anyone what you should do.

I am asking Sandy, because i want to know exact your opinion. Your approach is far stronger than other advice here and there. And because your are first one who told me that i deserve to have good life with my wife, after what i have done. I am starting to go out of my gilt fog (former cheater) - thanks to that.

Do you know why you are asking now? You are really wanting someone to tell you how you can remain a Beta male, keep your nice guy syndrome.......and still get your WW to love and respect you.

Not relay Sandy, i have been told this many times...and i ended up here waiting you respond to my question, because i have tried in last 5 years almost every thing, except to man up and say No More, i want from now on faithful wife and all other thing that are related in good marriage and i am wiling to give the same.

Sandy, you thought in my stitch are not waste of time, i am promise this.


So here i want to vent:

My WW told her GF that she do not want talk to me becouse she is offend by my behavior. She told to GF and GF sported, that is i ask her polite to not contact OM2 the result would be different, but i confront her all behavior, and how i want to control her and so on...
My WW and GF suspected me that i have OW, and because of this i want to stay late after work or sport activities. My WW told GF that there is non sense in my behavior (wont to not be disrespected and have good R as men women), that my wife did not do anything wrong (aka cheating).
Then my wife told the GF that when i leave will stay out 2-3 months with OW, then i will see how much my WW was giving me, and will go back. My WW was asking GF, what i will gain from OW, what she will give me more than my W.
Then my WW start explaining that she do not want any mans in her life. After/if/when we separate ( me leaving the home) she do not want no one to mess in her life (she will have her kids, work and peace) so why some one to mess her life.
She stated that she will not allow me to threatened her with my leaving or any consequence, if i do not like her behavior and especially after i hurt her so much in the past, and hearing her now as much by offending her as cheater and so on.

My WW look like a very stubborn person with huge Ego.
Here i must add (i my WW teenage years she was sexually abused ones) so her perception of the sex is for something that she will not give to no one any more (because she has suffer so much from sex her incident in the past, than so many years sex starving marriage (to make sex with my as duties) and in the end i hurt her by cheating because of sex)
Thanks

[sandi2]

Hi, just wondering if you are still here.

[betheoa]

Yes Sandy, I am still here. You write in the very right moment.
I am scared. ...
Since last time I wrote. ..the things are more of the same. She softened to me, still FB to OM but tray to avoid to be when I am there.
She sow OM two tree times as a client or just for a coffee on her work place.
She say to her GF that we do not have almost any communication when at home, but in reality she is very pleasant with me, I am also normal like. Only thing that can be seen as out of your roles, is that she polity ask to massage her legs and back occasionally. So I do it briefly, it could be seen as temp. Check.

I do not ask her about anything , do other call, only if really must to call. From other hand she Chek me out occasionally, where I am or when will be at home . It happens last week's to have a lot of emergency situation at work, so I was not at home very often.
I did not bring any R or Monday or OM talks, a week a go she was trying to start some talks very calm and polite and ask to talk . From experience I know that she what to see if I am committed, if I show understanding get to her she start nagging and blame game. So this time, I said that I already said what I have to say .-will not live like this any more. Then she start to talk - if I go to live with other woman, this woman will have expectations from me, I will not like it , and tings like this. I said that there is not perfect people. Then she sta really nagging - like how I cheated on her an so on. And she is free now but do not want any man to be with her . And she is not doing nothing wrong.....I had bite my tongue for a while and then leave the bedroom - whent to smoke outside, rhea go back to bed conversation was over.
Except this situation there was not negative interactions, I just keep my self as calm as possible.

So today situation is like this;
OM invite her for coffee at his place on Saturday befoure she go to work ,she said to him she is not at work the he said it could be at Sunday...she do not refuse or agree then they change the topic. She mentioned to her GF that on Sunday she will go coffee with a friend before work. So I expect her to see im....she have to leave home 2 hours earlier and I expect
1. She will inform me she will go or coffee
Or
2. She will tell Me not truth about some client need haircut earlier
Or
3. Something went wrong and coffee will not happened

If she tell she is going for coffee - I will not have any other option but leave, but what to do in other two scenarios?

If I leave how to do it. What to tell to the kids (something like I have a lot of work and will not be at home for month , but we will call each other and see when they wnat, and it is possible?!). If I leave at this point should I cut any financial support, should I tea her car(I steel pay for it) and give her the old one (we never separate our income ).

If I leve, what to tell her, should I explain something, or pack my clothes and leave. If I leave when to do it. She will be at work until 9pm. I can not leave the kids like this, if I wait to her be at home - what to say ...what to discuss.

I am scared about the kids how this will affect them, how to cut support to her without affecting the kids.
Peace Sandy guide me, any others opinion will be much appreciated.
Tomorrow we will have marital art together, I will play calm and collected with positive vibe, but what/how to do on Sunday.

The relationship with OM do not have future. My WW is in limerance, OM fill his free time with my WW occasionally. For now I do not have any evidence that he want something more frome her (may be just sex wit 12 years older woman ), but do not have any proofs.

I will check often for your respond.
Thanks being whit me

[sandi2]

Quote:
Are you referring to you going out to Get a Life? If so, you give vague answers without giving her details.

this i have understand. My point was, If/when My W start R/M talks, and ask when i will leave and stay at other place (aka separate), or what i am thinking about how we will leave from now on. In the past, after thought conversation (days/week later), and she is calm down, she start asking this, that because i do not discus what i am thinking and what i will do.

It is up to you what you wish to tell her. I don't know where you live and the laws there. My advice is to get legal advice about separation and divorce. Know all your options and where you will stand

legally.

[

quote]Quote:
Tell her one time that you will not live in an open M. Tell her one time she is being disrespectful to you and the M when she has private friendships with other men. It is not appropriate. You will not be disrespected by her texting/reading messaging and giving any type of attention to OM.

I already told this, when wrote here for first time. So i think there is not reason to do it again (in the past i have said this many times). So this have to stop, saying something and doing nothing

.[/quote]

I agree, no more just saying words. Do you feel you are in an open marriage b/c of her other men? If you feel she is dishonering your boundary.........what is your next step?

Quote:
Then, the very next time she ignores you and texts or reads his messages........you will need to do some type of action that shows her (but, with no acts of violence) the consequences for disrespecting you. Can you do that? If not, then there is no reason to ever open your mouth, b/c she already has you whipped like a dog.

Unfortunately, i do not have any other option to make consequences, than leave the house for logger time. Other option is to silent treatment her?...Now i respond to her very short and civil, do not pay any affection and/or attention, no cals, no text, not nothing. Just bills, grocery and kids related things.

So, if there are no consequences for her disrespecting you, nothing happens? Nothing changes? What about intimate and private time with her? Are you sleeping in the same bed? (Sorry if you've already told me).

Has your W ever been faced with any type of consequences from inappropriate behavior? What have you don't in previous times to take charge of the family........like a strong leader? Do they see you as their leader? How does she see you in the bedroom? Does she see you as strong, sexual, dominant male? I suppose I am asking very personal question to get a picture on you as a man. In the past, how would you handle this type of situation?

You mentioned the only option you see is leaving the house for a longer period of time. IMHO, that would not be a suffience alternative. What if you knew she would not stop this behavior? What then?

[betheoa]

Ni Sandy,
it is been a while.

So my wife miss the opportunity to lunch/dinner the OM2. I do not know why, one reason is because of me, other reason is OM2 do not initiate hard.

They occasionally FB, she provoke him about meet for lunch.

They sow each other 2 times when he come for haircut (talk drink coffee)

Last 2 weeks WW is very nice to me, attentive want a lot of massages (legs, back feet), like old times. There is not any other intimacy (sex, kiss, hugs). I do not initiate any of the physical contacts and/or other type of pursuing.
WW start to talk about baying new flat as investment for our kids in future, she introduce this to all relatives (looks very exited). I do not show any excitement, just say will see when the time comes ( flat go on market - it will be 3-4 year paying, and we will leave with small amount of money ).
My feeling is that she try to catch me in position of not have opportunity to leave (keep me in the house, and keep contact with the OM2). I want to say to her that i will not buy anything if she do not cut contact with OM2- but not sure is it writhe move or not. I do not show any sings that track her FB. If i confront her about her chat/coffee, i will proof to her that i do it.

last 2 weeks we have pleasant time. 2 - 3 times, she try to disrespect in front of the kids, i cut her right there, after 1 hour of her silent treatment, she is pleasant again.
My grant father died, she change her work schedule to come with me and support me.

So she is like in limbo, some times it is look like she decrease contact with OM2, then initiate, and so on.

So today OM2 come to haircut, some hours later they FB. She told him, when he come after his trip to home town, they should go to celebrate (he buy apartment, her name day), like dinner/lunch. What to do about it? last time i think i wast ready to take actions (leave - if she go to his place for coffee). She did not go.

It is up to you what you wish to tell her. I don't know where you live and the laws there. My advice is to get legal advice about separation and divorce. Know all your options and where you will stand

In past when we discuses separation divorce (initiate by me - not staying with her and OM2), she said will agree everything what i want (aka. she do not want divorce/separation - but do not want me to control her - say her how to live her life)

I agree, no more just saying words. Do you feel you are in an open marriage b/c of her other men? If you feel she is dishonering your boundary.........what is your next step?

I am convinced they will see for lunch/dinner (it is matter of time).
I do not know what to do!!! Should i do something before it is happened again, or act after?

I do not know is it time to enforce NC boundaries?! consequence are my financing the new flat?

So, if there are no consequences for her disrespecting you, nothing happens? Nothing changes? What about intimate and private time with her? Are you sleeping in the same bed? (Sorry if you've already told me).

We sleep in the same bed, we have pleasant time, she want (ask polite to massage her - in no sexual way. We do sport all together with the kids, and looks like she enjoined, she initiate to make me possible to be with them.

Has your W ever been faced with any type of consequences from inappropriate behavior? What have you don't in previous times to take charge of the family........like a strong leader? Do they see you as their leader? How does she see you in the bedroom? Does she see you as strong, sexual, dominant male?

She ask me, about what to do what to buy. i think she accept me as leader in some capacity. (depend in what WW mood is she or/and ovulation/or not). Sexually we did not have sex from 5 years. We do not discuses sex, in the past she bring my infidelity and say she is negative about sex, plus she was ra*ed in her teen age.

I suppose I am asking very personal question to get a picture on you as a man. In the past, how would you handle this type of situation?

Sandy i am scared to not screwed up, this days/weeks, we have better interaction since last 5 years, as her attitude to me (i do not consider her bad talking to her GF or the contact to the OM2). If i do not know is she contact OM2 or/and what she talk to her GF, then very thing is like very pleasant pacing stage.

Thanks

[betheoa]

Please someone to write me. I am angry WW talk to her GF about how will go out with OM. WW insist they are just friends but talk obout him like school girl.
I want to insist NC, but this is something will happened eventually.
I am not spouse to know.
Should I behave if nothing to know and wait or ask her to open her FB and confront. ASK her NC or I am living. ....
Do not know should I wait or act.

There is not disrespect in front of me.

Thanks

[betheoa]

OK I calmed down a bit, befoure come home.
So I will play as if nothing known.
I will wait until something happened and I found out without snooping or/and something that cannot be slipped out (like she date OM2).
For now I will play her game to pleasant interaction without any pursuing from my part.

Please advice what to do, when she start talk about our future ....like how/when to buy new flat or other things, that keep me committee to the marriage. Should I set her ww behavior as something she must stop, or I already told this to her, so there is not need to repeat (like not start R or Monday talks).

Writing here is helping me to not act emotionally.

Thanks to all supporting me.

[AnotherStander]

Please someone to write me. I am angry WW talk to her GF about how will go out with OM. WW insist they are just friends but talk obout him like school girl.

How do you know this, did you overhear a conversation, or were you snooping and reading her texts/ emails with GF? I'm trying to figure out if this is something she is doing in front of you which would clearly be unacceptable and would demand some kind of response from you (in my opinion anyway) or if you are reading her texts in which case you may be reading things into it ("talking about him like a school girl").

I want to insist NC, but this is something will happened eventually.

With whom, OM or GF? If you are going to lay out a boundary it needs to have consequences. What are your consequences?