A familiar story with questions. IV

[RR17]

Steve, I have read both. I believe it can be pursuing.

As for being attractive, there is a lot of things like boundaries that aren't attractive.

[SteveLW]

Not sure what you mean. But from what I was told trying for sex during limbo is about the most unattractive thing you can do.

[AnotherStander]

Well, I have to say that I was feeling a bit proud of myself for not trying to initiating sex the last several days. A couple times I felt it might have been expected.

Here's the dynamic that's at work- you've been DB'ing and removing pressure from her and as a result she feels more comfortable around you. But inside she still wants out of the M, she just doesn't feel the pressure to remind you all the time because you've backed off and seem OK with things. But you (like most LBS's do) have misinterpreted her increased comfort level to mean she wants recon (or maybe some sex), but no, that is not where she is at. So your sudden request kind of blind-sided her and she was probably surprised and yes, maybe even a little disgusted. Not so much at the thought of having sex, but just because she was feeling like things were going well because you've removed the pressure and now suddenly here you are applying pressure again.

I went downstairs and asked why she answered in such a disgusted tone. W said she didn't know.

She probably didn't know why, but I suspect like I said above it's because you applied pressure to her after having done a great job of pulling back for so long.

I explained that I didn't deserve it and that it had nothing to do with her not agreeing, but that I felt I deserved some consideration when being turned down. Like my feelings matter.

She's a WAS. As hard as it is, you've got to suck it up and accept that your feelings DON'T matter to her right now. All that matters are HER feelings. So you listen and validate, and you bite your tongue when you want to speak up about your needs not being met. Don't vent to her, vent to us. That's what we're here for.

[SteveLW]

. As hard as it is, you've got to suck it up and accept that your feelings DON'T matter to her right now. All that matters are HER feelings. So you listen and validate, and you bite your tongue when you want to speak up about your needs not being met. Don't vent to her, vent to us. That's what we're here for.

This is such good advice. Advice I didn't heed this morning. And now I am at work and have no idea what firestorm I will walk into tonight.

[Vanilla]

Each couple, each sitch is different.

Sex is different to ML. If it works and if the spouse is wayward you use protection then it's fine. Trouble is expectation comes into it and it confuses.

If you can detatch, if its a 180, or just great exercise I think it's fine. Just don't give it much meaning.

V

[RR17]

Each couple, each sitch is different.

Sex is different to ML. If it works and if the spouse is wayward you use protection then it's fine. Trouble is expectation comes into it and it confuses.

If you can detach, if its a 180, or just great exercise I think it's fine. Just don't give it much meaning.

V

This ^^^ is the approach that I have taken. W and I have discussed what meaning if any that sex plays these days.

When I told this story it was fresh and I was venting, although I get the part about bringing it here.
My C in IC says that she is allowed to hear things like this. I know IC didn't read the book and I am aware of both valid schools of thought.

Back to that conversation where I told her I didn't deserve this type of response: What I didn't tell is how she listened. She honestly seemed saddened and concerned, although she didn't apologize. (she seems to struggle with apologies)
But she listened and didn't get defensive. I believe that she doesn't know. Looking back this very sitch has lead to many arguments over the years. Not the no sex now but how she communicates this message. I even stated that I didn't mean to chastise, but I wanted to let her know how I felt. She seemed to validate me.

Vanilla, I doubt she was surprised. She does know me. She has always struggled with giving bad news and it has come up before. The sound of disgust, I take as a defensive improper coping mechanism to delivering a "No".

Even with the kids, she tends to say "we'll see" or "maybe later" when she means No.


Thanks, everyone for your responses. Even if it sounds like I don't always agree with the observation or theories, I do take them into consideration and another opinion is always welcome. Most of the time I feel like I just didn't describe the event or dynamic sufficiently.

[RR17]

So W is heading to work. Says she is ready for this day to be over. In my mission to validate I ask why. Well, she goes on to explain that she has some mess to clean up and the company owner has his head in the sand. blah blah blah
I listen and add a few things remembering to listen and not problem solve.

She then makes the comment that caught my attention. W said she realized that she was attracted to Alpha males. That even though you don't always like what they have to say, you always know where they stand.

Now, this caught my attention for a couple of reasons. First, it seemed awfully introspective for my W. I knew she was always drawn to the "John Wayne" type but to hear her say this was unusual. When did she come up with this little tidbit?

I believe this is what attracted her to me in the 1st place 20+ years ago. When I see posts about Nice Guy Syndrom I never really worry that I am that guy.
I also am reminded how this sitch going back to her A nearly 4 years ago and a recession that stripped my business for years before that had knocked me down several notches. In the last several months I believe that I have regained much of that swagger but these things take time. I am human and suffering from uncertainty in my family and M.

C and MC tell you to become more vulnerable and tender and unpack your feelings etc. and again this isn't the stuff of alpha males. I see the value but perspective is tantamount.

Okay, so what does this all mean to me?

• Predictably, I wonder if there is a new Alpha in this scenario. I'm not focused too much as it is a distraction and will eventually reveal it's self if so.
  
• It is something to take and use to my advantage moving forward. Thanks, W. Not sure exactly how at this point but food for thought none the less.
  

[SteveLW]

One thing my wife said that still sticks with me, and that I think is true for all WWs, is that what she was feeling at any particular moment maybe not be the way she was feeling the next. I know we are supposed to "believe none of what they say" but this emotional roller-coaster that WWs are on is very very real.

So please take her introspection with a grain of salt. What she might feel the moment she said it, may not be the way she feels the next time you interact with her. Frustrating? Absolutely. But then dealing with a WW is the most frustrating thing a H can go through, IMHO.

[artista]

One thing my wife said that still sticks with me, and that I think is true for all WWs, is that what she was feeling at any particular moment maybe not be the way she was feeling the next. I know we are supposed to "believe none of what they say" but this emotional roller-coaster that WWs are on is very very real.

i find this to be true... there were several times during my "derailing," where i said one thing one day, and a few days later said the opposite... the thing is, i didn't realize i was doing it until H and/or our sons pointed it out to me... but i was really expressing how i felt at that particular moment... it's odd...

[RR17]

I realize that what a WW or WAS says can't be trusted. I also have read in DB as well as rules to pay close attention to what your S is really saying, monitor and adjust, no?

I get it. Don't trust what you hear and see. Watch and listen but know that there are deceptive factors at play, right?

It is a roller coaster to say the least.

The hardest part of DBing is denying your own feelings, especially when you see positive results. Not to over-dramatize, but to tolerate abuse for the greater good of the union.