1.5 Months In, and Don't Know Where Things Stand

[MoveFrwd]

She's still constantly hiding her phones (one personal, one work), and is very distant. She's showing so many signs of being a WW/EA/PA or going through MLC that I don't know what strategy is best. It's entirely possible that maybe she cheated where she normally wouldn't have, and now is so racked with guilt after seeing my response to everything, that it's causing her to waver back and forth about staying. I don't think she wants to hurt me, and admitting to that would definitely do so, which means she either rips the band-aid off and hurts me, loves with the secret and guilt for the rest of our lives, or just leaves.

Id recommend you stop mind reading, and start reading DR as soon as you can. THAT is the strategy.

As for things she listed wrong with me and our marriage, I've done a complete 180 on all of it. Validating, contributing to household responsibilities (she's done virtually nothing around the house in the last month and a half, save for one load of laundry and cooked three times, two of which I did half of).

Have you done any SELF-reflection? You cant and shouldnt just change into what she wants of you. It wont work and it wont last. How do YOU want to be? How many of her complaints are valid? How many other things would you change about yourself?

I've also sold my woodworking told and gun collection, which has put us within $500 of paying off all of our credit card debt (another thing she was extremely upset about). I've taken more of an active role in our finances, though she's still handling the majority there because she knows the budget software, whereas I haven't really used it other than to record transactions. She also has all the login info for everything, where I do not.

I feel like something doesnt add up. Shes a high powered executive and yet you still had to sell all of your things and theres a lot of worry over $500? How can you be on such a tight budget where you cant even buy a book?

Ultimately, I think it comes down to respect. Right now, you are kissing up to her at every turn. You are doing everything you can to try to make her happy. But how is that a strong partner? How is that someone she respects as an equal and trusts as a father and husband? Turning into SUPER H is not a way to earn her respect. She will be pleased to not have to do any household work but it doesnt increase her attraction for you.

How about instead, you focus on planning for you. Get your business/finances in order. Get the freaking login information and man up to being an equal team member. Figure out a budget for your family to get back on track. Make meal plans and execute them together. Women dont want a SERVANT - they want a PARTNER.

[SteveLW]

I feel like something doesnt add up. Shes a high powered executive and yet you still had to sell all of your things and theres a lot of worry over $500? How can you be on such a tight budget where you cant even buy a book?

I had this same thought when I read couton's comment on this. Likely she is using her 2/3rds of the income position to nitpick him about finances. A typical WAS move. Find as much fault with the LBS as possible. And as you said, he is overreacting trying to "fix" every one of her complaints.

crouton, right now you could turn into the perfect husband, but the time for that has come and gone. Time to GAL, 180, detach......concentrate on YOU not on her. You can't nice her back.

[crouton]

Okay, update time:

A friend who knows my sitch loaned me the money to by DR, and I just got back from the bookstore, so I'll be reading today.

Sorry about the lack of background... I'm 35, she's 36, we've been married 13 years, together as adults for almost 14 years, and dated all through middle and high school (on again, off again), and even some after high school. We dated lots of other people after school, and she was even married for a year (she divorced him, for many of the same reasons she is now saying to me). We have always compared everyone we've ever been with to each other as a standard of measure, and found them lacking, which is why we were both so happy to have reconnected and fallen back in love when we got back together as adults (or so we've always said). There's no question in my mind that she is my soulmate, and until recently, she said there was no doubt in hers (this changing, however, could be what John Gottman calls "Negative Sentiment Override").

As for the cheating/not cheating, I totally see why it could be interpreted as such, and it would also explain a lot. That said, I'm fairly confident the reason she's so protective over her phones is that she knows I saw a text to her friend (yes, that friend I mentioned in the OP) early on in all of this. The alarm on her phone was going off, and I went to silence it (she was in our basement, I was in our bedroom). When I unlocked the phone to silence the alarm, I saw a text that read "He's doing everything right, but it just feels so wrong!" with a few crying face emojis after it. Then the next line said "I just feel smothered!!". I believe she only knew I saw it because I probably didn't put her phone back in the right spot in her purse. A different friend did confirm that she expressed to him and his girlfriend that she felt I was snooping, which is why she locked her phones down. This was all within the first week of everything happening.

Further, if she did cheat, I believe it would have been because I drove her to that point, and that it was a one time thing. It's entirely possible that, if it happened, she realizes she made a mistake, and is feeling guilty for doing so, which is why shes wavering on staying or going. She could be looking at it like she has 3 choices: tell me and hurt me (which I truly believe she doesn't want to do... she has one of the biggest hearts on the planet), not tell me and us stay together with her wrestling the guilt forever, or just leave in order to not face hurting me or the guilt. I've also had several friends tell me that after talking to her, they don't believe she did. That could all be hot air, or her lying to them, but I don't yet have any concrete reason to believe otherwise, just several possible red flags.

I'm still trying to figure out a way to GAL. My options are unfortunately rather limited, but I'm working on it.

This morning, we had a blow up. Essentially, the last 2 nights have been good, or so I thought (we even slept together night before last, which is kinda big considering she has wanted very little physical contact through all of this besides a good hug here or there when we've had a good day, or snuggling at night). She's been okay snuggling in bed most nights, with me spooning her. On some occasions, she will snuggle up to me, laying on my chest. We had about 10 minutes before we were supposed to get up, and I asked if she would lay on my chest. I was coming out of nightmares all night, and needed to feel a sense of normalcy, I guess. She pushed me away, saying she just wants to sleep. I got up and said that I'd just leave her alone so she could sleep, then left the room. I immediately realized I'd made a mistake, went back in to apologize and let her know that I was putting my needs first and not hers, and that it was wrong and unfair. She exploded almost as soon as I came back in, slamming our bathroom door so hard pictures fell off of the wall. She went on to say that it just feels like every time we start making progress, I tear it all down by doing things like not putting her needs/wants first. She said that she doesn't want to feel smothered, and she needs space when asking for it, and that she doesn't want us to have to sleep in different bedrooms for her to not feel that way, but if that's what it takes, then she'll demand it (she wasn't saying that's what she's demanding yet, just that she will if things get worse).

We talked through it, both apologizing. I communicated that her verbatim telling me last night she wasn't trying to be distant, and then us snuggling up is a completely opposite thing from what she wanted this morning, hence my confusion and frustration. She said she understood, but didn't really acknowledge that she sent mixed signals (I didn't ask for an apology or acknowledgement). Before she left, she did apologize for us being where we are, and her part in it. We talked the whole time she was on her way to work. She laid out that she could have talked to me about all of this differently, or taken some less drastic action prior to things getting so bad to get me to understand where she was coming from. She also admitted that her not doing so probably led me into a false sense of security (which it did). I agreed, and said I thought things had actually been improving over the last 6 months or so, which she said they were, but still weren't what she needed them to be. She further said she doesn't know if the changes she's seeing in me are real and permanent, and that her biggest fear is that I'm doing these things to manipulate her into getting what I want. She also said that she's felt so stifled the last several years, always submitting to what I want and need rather than what she did, and doesn't want to do that any more. I did my best to validate and apologize, and to let her know that isn't what I want either. I didn't fall in love with a robot, I fell in love with an amazing, independent, creative person, who I want to fully express and be who they are.

I asked her to see if she could think of some things I can do to help prove to her that the changes are real and lasting, and to help her trust that I'm not manipulating. She was able to give one example. Of the times I've talked about losing weight so far, she said that half the time I'm talking about it as though it's such a positive thing and that I've worked hard to do it, and then other times it seems like I'm throwing it in her face because she and I have both admitted it's partly due to the stress. I told her thank you for sharing that with me, and told her I will change the way I speak about it.

In all of this, I have laid down one boundary. Our son is on Colorado at my MIL's house until the end of the month. The only responsibility is taking care of our dog. She was considering being gone all last week, staying at her AUnt or Grandma's house, then staying with our friend this past weekend for a girl's weekend (this one she ended up doing). I told her that I would not sit alone in an empty house. I did it for the five days she was in Colorado taking our son there/visiting her mom, and that it almost drove me over the edge. If she needs space/separation, fine, but I will leave and she can stay. I can't stand to see her everywhere in this house with things the way they are. I also told her I don't know if a hotel/friend's house/etc. would be any better, because then all I'd see is the absence of her everywhere. Not to mention the financial expense, and that our friends all have their own lives, and can't be there reliably for me (understandably so). So I don't know where I'll go, but I won't stay here alone in an empty house with just my thoughts. She got a little angry over that, particularly because of the girl's weekend thing (which they did indeed do, I've seen the evidence), saying that it would totally screw her plans up because she had to take care of the dog. In the back of my mind I was thinking "And you think single motherhood would be any easier/different/better?", though I didn't say it. I finally agreed to stay here this past weekend to give her space and let her do the girl's weekend, and she's been home since Sunday night without packing a bag again (she had one packed last Tuesday night, but stayed when I laid down that boundary).

Anyway, I guess now that I've written another book on my sitch, does anything change/make more sense? Any more possible insight? I'm going to start reading now, but am here at the keyboard all day today, so I'll be checking in throughout the day.

[MoveFrwd]

This morning, we had a blow up. Essentially, the last 2 nights have been good, or so I thought (we even slept together night before last, which is kinda big considering she has wanted very little physical contact through all of this besides a good hug here or there when we've had a good day, or snuggling at night). She's been okay snuggling in bed most nights, with me spooning her. On some occasions, she will snuggle up to me, laying on my chest. We had about 10 minutes before we were supposed to get up, and I asked if she would lay on my chest. I was coming out of nightmares all night, and needed to feel a sense of normalcy, I guess. She pushed me away, saying she just wants to sleep. I got up and said that I'd just leave her alone so she could sleep, then left the room. I immediately realized I'd made a mistake, went back in to apologize and let her know that I was putting my needs first and not hers, and that it was wrong and unfair. She exploded almost as soon as I came back in, slamming our bathroom door so hard pictures fell off of the wall. She went on to say that it just feels like every time we start making progress, I tear it all down by doing things like not putting her needs/wants first. She said that she doesn't want to feel smothered, and she needs space when asking for it, and that she doesn't want us to have to sleep in different bedrooms for her to not feel that way, but if that's what it takes, then she'll demand it (she wasn't saying that's what she's demanding yet, just that she will if things get worse).

So you asked to cuddle, she said she wanted to sleep and you left. Then, instead of letting her sleep, you woke her up to tell her that you wanted to put her needs first?! Sounds like more of putting your needs first!!!

Did she overreact? Sure. But what can you focus on? Your own actions.

In all of this, I have laid down one boundary. Our son is on Colorado at my MIL's house until the end of the month. The only responsibility is taking care of our dog. She was considering being gone all last week, staying at her AUnt or Grandma's house, then staying with our friend this past weekend for a girl's weekend (this one she ended up doing). I told her that I would not sit alone in an empty house. I did it for the five days she was in Colorado taking our son there/visiting her mom, and that it almost drove me over the edge. If she needs space/separation, fine, but I will leave and she can stay. I can't stand to see her everywhere in this house with things the way they are. I also told her I don't know if a hotel/friend's house/etc. would be any better, because then all I'd see is the absence of her everywhere. Not to mention the financial expense, and that our friends all have their own lives, and can't be there reliably for me (understandably so). So I don't know where I'll go, but I won't stay here alone in an empty house with just my thoughts. She got a little angry over that, particularly because of the girl's weekend thing (which they did indeed do, I've seen the evidence), saying that it would totally screw her plans up because she had to take care of the dog. In the back of my mind I was thinking "And you think single motherhood would be any easier/different/better?", though I didn't say it. I finally agreed to stay here this past weekend to give her space and let her do the girl's weekend, and she's been home since Sunday night without packing a bag again (she had one packed last Tuesday night, but stayed when I laid down that boundary).

This does NOT sound like a boundary. This sounds like a controlling way of getting her to stay.
So if she leaves, you are just abandoning the dog and it's her responsibility -so she needs to come back and stay?

How about instead of "sitting in an empty house", you find something to GAL? There are plenty of free options out there. You just ave to look for them. Start on meetup and see what exists. SHE CANNOT BE YOUR WHOLE WORLD. Its smothering even if you arent intending it to be. You sold all of your tools and guns and such....what else is left in your life but her??

[ovrrnbw]

You're super hung up on covering for her. She is responsible for her actions, so quit doing this.

You're flopping all over and you need to calm down and detach. Stop pursuing her. You read that she feels smothered and you continue to smother.

You're trying to show her your 180s which means they aren't real and you're trying to control your sitch.

Let go of what you can't control and focus on what you can.

[crouton]

So you asked to cuddle, she said she wanted to sleep and you left. Then, instead of letting her sleep, you woke her up to tell her that you wanted to put her needs first?! Sounds like more of putting your needs first!!!

Did she overreact? Sure. But what can you focus on? Your own actions.

No, she was awake. She was groaning as I left the room. Literally 10 seconds passed before I walked back in. The apology wasn't putting my needs first, but rather trying to show her I realized I'd made a mistake and that it was unfair to put my desires ahead of hers.

This does NOT sound like a boundary. This sounds like a controlling way of getting her to stay.
So if she leaves, you are just abandoning the dog and it's her responsibility -so she needs to come back and stay?

No, it's not trying to get her to stay with me... it's me letting her see that she doesn't get to use me as a doormat. If, and I say if, she's cheating, then she doesn't get to cake eat. If she's not, then she doesn't get to abandon all responsibility, either. She's the one who is trying to decide if life without me is worth it... why does that mean that she gets to be completely care free? After all, shouldn't she see what a taste of that is like, responsibilities and all?

How about instead of "sitting in an empty house", you find something to GAL? There are plenty of free options out there. You just ave to look for them. Start on meetup and see what exists. SHE CANNOT BE YOUR WHOLE WORLD. Its smothering even if you arent intending it to be. You sold all of your tools and guns and such....what else is left in your life but her??

That's what I'm working on. We live in a relatively rural community, so there aren't a lot of happenings out this way. I could go into the city, but then it's a financial thing (I had to borrow money just to buy DR this morning). For now, I'm going for walks/runs, trying to hang out with friends (though they're usually unavailable due to their own lives), etc., but there's not a lot beyond that. I'm not religious, so church is out. I'm looking for woodworking clubs, but there aren't many around me.

As for selling everything, one of the big complaints was financial. We have been dragging around credit card debt for years, and have made bad financial decisions in that time that prolonged paying it off. I don't want to live that way any more. Married or not. She knows how much I love those two hobbies, and I think it may have shown her how serious I am about change when I sold them. Not change for her, change for me, first, because it wouldn't be lasting change otherwise. In fact, I've been more frugal with our money than she has the last month and a half, which is a big first.

[crouton]

Id recommend you stop mind reading, and start reading DR as soon as you can. THAT is the strategy.

That's what I'm doing now... up to page 56.

Have you done any SELF-reflection? You cant and shouldnt just change into what she wants of you. It wont work and it wont last. How do YOU want to be? How many of her complaints are valid? How many other things would you change about yourself?

Yes, I have. I don't want to change just for her. Many of the things she brought up are things I've been struggling with internally for years. The last two years in particular, though, I've been more focused on my business... working two jobs has a tendency to drain you. That's no excuse, but simply the reason. I want to be decisive, strong, cheerful to be around, responsible, accountable, in shape physically and mentally, a leader, etc., and I'm working on accomplishing that. In fact, I started working on it before the BD, but I guess there was too much momentum behind the BD already. As for her complaints, I'd say they're all or nearly all valid. Again, these are things I've wanted to change within myself for years.

I feel like something doesnt add up. Shes a high powered executive and yet you still had to sell all of your things and theres a lot of worry over $500? How can you be on such a tight budget where you cant even buy a book?

No, there's no worry over $500... I've paid down $5,500 in a week and a half by selling those things, which puts us within $500 of being out of credit card debt.Her issue has been that we keep dragging the debt around, by making stupid decisions and spending money on things we don't need/shouldn't, instead of being financially responsible. She's absolutely correct, and that's not how I want to live. I decided to sell those things because I want to be a leader, and someone who puts the good of his family over his own selfish wants. I can always replace those things later, and she even agreed with me on this point when I told her what I'd done. She knows, too, how much I enjoy those things, and is supportive of me having hobbies. But I can't continue being selfish... that's not who I am or have ever been at my core, and how I ever allowed myself to get that way bothers me. I know WHY I got that way, it was me trying to fulfill my unhappiness in our M, rather than trying to communicate and fix the underlying problem. But why I fed myself the excuses I did, or didn't see who and what I was becoming/doing is troubling.

Ultimately, I think it comes down to respect. Right now, you are kissing up to her at every turn. You are doing everything you can to try to make her happy. But how is that a strong partner? How is that someone she respects as an equal and trusts as a father and husband? Turning into SUPER H is not a way to earn her respect. She will be pleased to not have to do any household work but it doesnt increase her attraction for you.

But isn't this doing a 180? I'm doing EXACTLY the opposite of the things she's had a problem with for years. How do I show her I've changed unless I actually start changing? Again, not just for her, but for me, first, her, secondary? This is who I was at the beginning of our marriage, so why is getting back to that such a bad thing? I was happier about who I was as a person, and she was happier about who I was as a spouse. It wasn't me doing everything, but she also wasn't working so much and gone away from the house like she is now. I'm trying to be supportive of the fact that she's in the job she's in, and the demands of that job require so much out of her. In the past, picking up the slack is what I did. And, it's what she's done the last two years while I was focusing on my business. Isn't that showing her that I'm strong enough as an individual to also be a great partner?

How about instead, you focus on planning for you. Get your business/finances in order. Get the freaking login information and man up to being an equal team member. Figure out a budget for your family to get back on track. Make meal plans and execute them together. Women dont want a SERVANT - they want a PARTNER.

We already have the budget in place (her doing, and it's a good one). She also doesn't want to relinquish control of the finances (and never has). What she wants is someone to help with it all, which is what I've been doing the last several weeks. I admittedly don't know the software as well as she does, but am learning it and using that knowledge to contribute to staying on track/exceeding our goal as much as I can. As for meal planning, I've always been the one to do that, and 90%+ of all the cooking. I have already been incorporating healthier and new items for us to eat, daily (something she has wanted for a while). I'm not trying to be a servant, I'm trying to be a supportive spouse.

[MoveFrwd]

No, she was awake. She was groaning as I left the room. Literally 10 seconds passed before I walked back in. The apology wasn't putting my needs first, but rather trying to show her I realized I'd made a mistake and that it was unfair to put my desires ahead of hers.

So she asked for space....you gave it to her....and then apologized for it?
Maybe Im not understanding, but it sounds like NOTHING you do will make her happy right now. Thats a pretty good lesson to learn now.

No, it's not trying to get her to stay with me... it's me letting her see that she doesn't get to use me as a doormat. If, and I say if, she's cheating, then she doesn't get to cake eat. If she's not, then she doesn't get to abandon all responsibility, either. She's the one who is trying to decide if life without me is worth it... why does that mean that she gets to be completely care free? After all, shouldn't she see what a taste of that is like, responsibilities and all?

No. I dont buy this.
If she goes out, then you will, what, exactly? Spite her by going out also? So if she shuns her responsibility, then you will too? I mean, that doesnt really make sense. Im not saying she should be carefree. But your boundary needs to be something you can manage - it should be about YOU and what YOU can control. So if she goes out all night, then what? You go out the next night? Im positive it is coming off to her as controlling - that you are requiring her to come home.

And also, I dont really understand this boundary. Why can't you be home alone? Because youll be....too sad? I mean, why are you putting that responsibility onto her? What can you do to make your life such that your happiness doesnt require her presence? Because what youre describing does not sound healthy.

That's what I'm working on. We live in a relatively rural community, so there aren't a lot of happenings out this way. I could go into the city, but then it's a financial thing (I had to borrow money just to buy DR this morning). For now, I'm going for walks/runs, trying to hang out with friends (though they're usually unavailable due to their own lives), etc., but there's not a lot beyond that. I'm not religious, so church is out. I'm looking for woodworking clubs, but there aren't many around me.

So you dont have money to buy a book or drive to the city, but you can find a hotel or second place to live?

GAL is SO SO SO important. For me, it was finding and making new friends that really got me out the funk that I see you in. Ive lived like that! Regaining our sense of self and self worth and self confidence is so crucial.

As for selling everything, one of the big complaints was financial. We have been dragging around credit card debt for years, and have made bad financial decisions in that time that prolonged paying it off. I don't want to live that way any more. Married or not. She knows how much I love those two hobbies, and I think it may have shown her how serious I am about change when I sold them. Not change for her, change for me, first, because it wouldn't be lasting change otherwise. In fact, I've been more frugal with our money than she has the last month and a half, which is a big first.

Thats why I said you should make a budget. Stop looking for grand gestures and put yourself on a path to sustainable improvement. A one time infusion of cash is much less meaningful than setting up a household system for managing your money. Scrimping such that you cant buy a book seems so extreme compared to what is a healthy lifestyle. You gave up all of your hobbies - so now I imagine she feels like SHE is all you have left. And thats a lot of pressure. Even if you arent physically smothering her, your actions are showing her how vital she is to your existence. Thats got to be an uncomfortable place for her.

You showed that you are serious about change. But what kind of changes are you making? Are they helping you to reach your goal(s)........?

[AnotherStander]

Hey Crouton, welcome to the boards! Glad you're reading DR, I think it'll help answer a lot of your questions. Also read the links Cadet gave you, lots of vital info in there. First let me say you're trying to hang onto your marriage by a thread and it's just making you look desperate and needy and that is not at all attractive to your W. You (like most of us did) are REALLY underestimating just how DONE she is, and most of what you are doing is just driving her farther away. Read Sandi's rules every day and model your behavior after those rules. Stop the pursuit. Stop the R talks. Pull back and give her space.

I understand that I have a lot of trust to rebuild at the very least, and a lot of resentment to overcome and soothe.

I don't understand the trust comment, have you had an affair or something? Typically these situations have nothing to do with the WAS not trusting the LBS. They've just fallen out of love. As far as resentment goes, you can only work on that by working on yourself. Get out, GAL, become "the spouse only a fool would leave". Please understand this isn't about fixing all the beta stuff you didn't do before, you can't do housework and laundry and errands now and expect that to attract her back. A lot of people misunderstand that. You might alpha her back but you will never beta her back.

She's questioning all the changes in me, as well as asking how it is I could finally get it in such a short period of time.

She thinks your changes are "tricks" to try and get her back. You've got to show her consistent, change behavior over a long period of time before she believes you really have changed.

action more than words. The action that occurred in the first conversation, and then the real eye opener of the ignored calls, etc. that night three weeks ago, finally gave me the perspective I needed to hear her fully and truly. I've been experiencing a level of empathy I haven't had in a long, long time, and all I want to do now is be the best man I can be for her, and throw my arms around her and heal the wounds I've caused her.

Your words don't mean anything to her right now, so don't try to convince her how great you are through words. ACTIONS are what matters.

I've read so many pieces of advice saying to focus on me, and to get a life and start being independent in my activities so that she has space and so that she sees me living life to its fullest. I'm trying, but when she's working 70+ hours a week, and we have a 10-year-old son to take care of, I haven't figured out how to do that yet.

Do activities with your son. Take him to the park to fly kites, take him to the zoo, take him to a museum, build a model together, go visit friends and family. Encourage him to go hang out with friends or spend the night and when he does then you go do something on your own.

I've asked about counseling, which she says she's not sure she's in a position to do right now, and I'm not sure it would help if she doesn't know what she wants.

It won't help. Right now she doesn't know what she wants, but she KNOWS SHE DOESN'T WANT YOU. I know that hurts to hear, but the sooner you grasp the gravity of your situation then the sooner you'll start doing what you REALLY need to be doing and give her the space she needs to recover.

She's mentioned a trial separation as an idea, but not asked for it explicitly, more in passing during one of our conversations. I've read conflicting points of view on them and can see the merit to each, but deep down I feel she can't see any changes I make if we're apart, and feel like all it would do is push her further away.

If you're making changes solely for the purpose of eliciting a response from her then you're doing it for the wrong reasons and the changes won't stick. This is all about changing who you are as a person.

I feel like she's romanticizing the notion of being alone, even though she truly does know that it would be hard and would hurt us both to do so.

Again I know this is tough stuff to hear, but it would only be hard for YOU. For her it would be a dream come true. She wants nothing more than to be away from you because she's assigned all the hurt and frustration in her life to you. Your being around is just a constant reminder of everything she hates. When you detach and give her space then over time she will begin to realize she's wrestling with internal demons, that her problems are inside her. Then she may eventually come to love you again.

I also believe her best friend is pushing my wife towards divorce.

It doesn't matter, if not her then your W would find someone else. WAS's need enablers, and friends who don't enable them get dumped in favor of new enabler friends.

I'm trying my hardest to GAL, but with no money, there's not a lot I can do.

I thought you said she has a huge income and you own your own business?

So you asked to cuddle, she said she wanted to sleep and you left. Then, instead of letting her sleep, you woke her up to tell her that you wanted to put her needs first?! Sounds like more of putting your needs first!!!

Did she overreact? Sure. But what can you focus on? Your own actions.

^^^THIS^^^

This does NOT sound like a boundary. This sounds like a controlling way of getting her to stay.
So if she leaves, you are just abandoning the dog and it's her responsibility -so she needs to come back and stay?

How about instead of "sitting in an empty house", you find something to GAL? There are plenty of free options out there. You just ave to look for them. Start on meetup and see what exists. SHE CANNOT BE YOUR WHOLE WORLD. Its smothering even if you arent intending it to be. You sold all of your tools and guns and such....what else is left in your life but her??

^^^This too^^^ Crouton I think you misunderstand what boundaries are, why you need them and how to enforce them. They are not to force your W to stay, that is just a technique to control and manipulate as Amoafwl said and will set you farther back. After DR read No More Mister Nice Guy, you can get it via download from Amazon. It's not what the title sounds like, it's all about "nice guys" and their passive/ aggressive behavior and how to stop it. A lot of us ended up here specifically because of Nice Guy Syndrome. We think we're nice and doing the right things, but a lot of what we do is controlling, manipulating and passive/aggressive. We don't realize it until someone shines a light on it. The good news is once you see it it's not hard to modify your behavior, it's just a case of "I didn't know I was doing that and how harmful it was to my M and my friends and family."

[AnotherStander]

No, it's not trying to get her to stay with me... it's me letting her see that she doesn't get to use me as a doormat.

How is her going and doing something using you as a doormat? You're basically telling her she doesn't have your permission to do anything. That's not a boundary, that's control.

If she's not, then she doesn't get to abandon all responsibility, either.

As far as she is concerned the M is already over. She is free to do what she wants. If you don't give her space, she will leave you and make space herself. I think you're trying to convince us and perhaps yourself that your manipulative behavior has valid reasons, but it's not the case.

She's the one who is trying to decide if life without me is worth it... why does that mean that she gets to be completely care free?

Please try to understand her side of this. She wants out so that she can be free of you. That's the whole point. You can give her some freedom now by removing pressure and letting her go, and if you do then maybe she won't leave. Or you can keep up this controlling behavior and she WILL leave. You simply cannot keep her caged up, that just keeps making things worse.

That's what I'm working on. We live in a relatively rural community, so there aren't a lot of happenings out this way.

25 had one of the most impressive GAL lists of anyone here, and she lived in a remote area of Alaska while doing it. Read her thread here:

http://www.divorcebusting.com/forum...t&Number=2752796&nt=7&page=7