Former WH, now LBS Please Help, close to Give Up

[betheoa]

Thank you Sandi, being next to me now...

3. My further plans, i will ask questions, about how to proceed.

As i already wore, staid in friend hows (the house is empty), next week i will move in another place. Day before yesterday, i went to home to take some clothes, i pick the time where there was no one. I do not know if WW found out if i take clothes, she do not know if i come home any time soon or not. I did not talk to her, yet.

First time when i left for a week (day before i back to home), she ask how the financing were going, how will support her with the kids. we agreed to pay some home bills, the sport exercise and her flue (she drive the kids to school) on her work why. I will keep this agreement for now, to see how the tings will go on.

Tomorrow i want to talk to the kids, to see how are they. If my WW, want to talk to me in front of the, what to do. It will be hurting to den if i refuse to talk to her ...they are not suspect nothing. If we speak with WW, and she ask me where i am, when will go home ...what to answer ....i am thinking of answering
"i will stay out of home until the flat is ready to move there"...
If she wont to see each other to talk to what we are going to do and how....should i met her or it is better to communicate by text.. Should i initiate text her, telling her that i will not go back to home, ask her to think how to deal with the kids....telling them, how/when to see them and so on...regarding her convo to her GF, she wait when i will go home, she do not expect me to stay at another place long therm. She is very convinced there is infidelity from my par now. She was telling to the GF, she not going to tell about our situation to her parents, in her words this will kill them....
can i wait, before telling the kids about "US", that we are going to be separate, to move in the new flat, where they can start recognizance like their new home.
Al this is very scary, i feel so much gild, when listening how she talking to her GF, it is look like so much like WAW, lived in abusive and neglected marriage, GF asked why WW was ton found OM and divorce me in those last 5 years, after my infidelity ...WW explains that she was not filing like woman any more or/and no one did not put her to feel like that way. WW was telling to GF, that she reared that not kick me out/divorce when i convince my infidelity. She was telling that she gave me chance to prove my self, and now she is glad that she do not fall to me again, because i showing her that i am not changed.... So i am a bad guy.

If WW ask me to go back at home, and ask me about my conditions ...what to say? How to stand my self UP, after so many years being, easy going husband (most of the time (nice guy) and last 5 years doormat, except may be last 6 months (when i become more and more standing about my self).
If i look back 2 years ago, when i found out for the first time she have interest in OM, the change is huge. In her and in me.

What to say, if me and WW talk, about our situation, and she asks why i am living?
last time when we talk, i told her that that i do not want to live withe her, because of her behavior (mostly being flirty with OM2), she fight me write there that i finding justification to leave, because she do not doing any wrong. She will clime this, in any further convo ...i suppose.

Sandi i have question.
If just assume, OM1 and OM2 was/are really only friend for her, and she is just flirty with OM2 (not being in limerance), and her behavior is to make me mad. Live like roommates for so long....should i do the same stand up for me, leave, and not go back until there is 100% commitment to me as Man, Father and Husband.

Now i expect her Disrespect/resentment and rebellion to hit the fans. I expect WW to do "Watch me", like you said Sandi, in one of your posts (in your mind "Watch me" to your H), But in my case it will not be underground, it will be put in my eyes, in order to hit my buttons.

Last year, i am seeing her to feel pleasure when i suffer.
So i am going to sleep for a wail. From now on, it will be real "handling" day by day, hour by hour.

Will write soon.
(Hugs)

[sandi2]

Tomorrow i want to talk to the kids, to see how are they. If my WW, want to talk to me in front of the, what to do. It will be hurting to den if i refuse to talk to her ...they are not suspect nothing.

Don't discuss anything with WW in front of the kids. Tell the kids to go to their rooms, or go outside, but don't discuss the situation with your W in their presence. Then, talk to the kids and tell them you will see them soon. Tell them you love them and will not stop being their father.

"i will stay out of home until the flat is ready to move there"...

Be sure you see your kids. Just don't stay with them at the home, to be a convenience to your WW. Understand?

If we speak with WW, and she ask me where i am, when will go home ...what to answer ....i am thinking of answering

Unless you fear harrssament, I think you should tell her you are leaving her. Has your legal advisor told you something differently? I don't know the law there, but you have done nothing wrong. Just tell her you are done with the M.

If she wont to see each other to talk to what we are going to do and how....should i met her or it is better to communicate by text..

Suggest to her you communicate through email. If you must meet face to face, it has to be a public place, like a coffee shop.

Should i initiate text her, telling her that i will not go back to home, ask her to think how to deal with the kids....telling them,

I think you should tell her you have left her and won't be back, except to get your things. I don't know how she will react, or what she may tell the kids. If she threatens to make you out to be the bad guy........you can remind her you know the truth about her 2 other men. Tell her you can tell the kids that you've separated, together. Tell her she can propose a visitation schedule for the kids.

regarding her convo to her GF,

Maybe at another time, but not now. Just break the news you are gone. You are leaving due to:

1. Her disrespectful behavior toward her H and the M.
2. Her having two boyfriends.
3. Her withholding sex for the past five years.
4. Her refusal to work on the MR.

Try to stick to these main issues, without going into what you know about her conversations with GF's. Just state your reasons if she asks, but don't argue. You don't have to prove what you know. In fact, you don't have to give her reasons, if you don't want to talk about it.

she wait when i will go home, she do not expect me to stay at another place long therm. She is very convinced there is infidelity from my par now. She was telling to the GF, she not going to tell about our situation to her parents, in her words this will kill them....

Who cares! She was not thinking about her parents when she was on OM#1 & 2! She says things like this to control you and make you feel duty bound to stay with her. If she gets ugly with you or threatens, then you can tell her parents the truth.

can i wait, before telling the kids about "US", that we are going to be separate, to move in the new flat, where they can start recognizance like their new home.

Unless she is a much better mother than she is a wife, the kids will know before you have a chance to tell them. I suspect she will react in anger and tell them......but IDK her. You can still see your kids! Don't wait until you have the flat completed before spending time with your kids.

Al this is very scary, i feel so much gild, when listening how she talking to her GF, it is look like so much like WAW, lived in abusive and neglected marriage,

Why do you feel guilty, when you know the truth? I tell you why. B/c you have been the victim of abuse. She has beat you down. She is an abuser, and she isolated you from your family b/c she wanted to enjoy watching you suffer from her abuse. You have believed the lies of your abuser.

No guilt, when you know the truth, okay?

She was telling that she gave me chance to prove my self, and now she is glad that she do not fall to me again, because i showing her that i am not changed.... So i am a bad guy.

Your WW is a liar. I want you to stop listening to her conversations, b/c you believe what she says! She lies, to make herself sound good. She tries to fool everyone. She tries to make a fool out of you. No more!

If WW ask me to go back at home, and ask me about my conditions ...what to say

You tell her, "No!" Tell her it is not her concern.

If WW ask me to go back at home, and ask me about my conditions ...what to say? How to stand my self UP, after so many years being, easy going husband (most of the time (nice guy) and last 5 years doormat, except may be last 6 months (when i become more and more standing about my self).

Would your friend give you emotional support? How much have you told him about her abuse? You need somebody to go with you, or stand by your side when you have to deal with her, until you get past this initial part of leaving. But if he can't, then you can do it alone. What is the worst she can do?

Don't tell her where you are staying or your conditions. It is none of her business.

What to say, if me and WW talk, about our situation, and she asks why i am living?
last time when we talk, i told her that that i do not want to live withe her, because of her behavior (mostly being flirty with OM2), she fight me write there that i finding justification to leave, because she do not doing any wrong. She will clime this, in any further convo ...i suppose.

Was she physically fighting you? Don't discuss OM and her flirty behavior, if she gets violent.

Tell her not to be concerned how you are living. Tell her you do not want to be with her. You do not have to prove anything to her. You do not have to present your case to her.
You do not have to win justification from her. Just say you don't love her b/c she wants to punish you. Most men would leave b/c she refused sex for 5 years! She has been a bad wife. You do not have to defend yourself. She should be the one to be defensive!

You can do this! You are stronger than you think. You have truth on your side. If she threatens violence, take the police to get your personal belongings from the home, and/or to see your kids.

((hugs))

[betheoa]

Hi Sandi,

Don't discuss anything with WW in front of the kids.

I have never do, last years when she become, quilting me/argue in front of them, i shut her down/or end make it to them, not being witness.

Be sure you see your kids. Just don't stay with them at the home, to be a convenience to your WW. Understand?

I understand, this will be very strange to them, i will do it any way.

Unless you fear harassment, I think you should tell her you are leaving her.

OMG Sandi, yes i fear. 5 years ago, by this approach she put me to convince my affair, then the hell come down....the years prior that looks like heaven. I will face the fear ...

Suggest to her you communicate through email. If you must meet face to face, it has to be a public place, like a coffee shop.

I have to use FB, she did not use mail. Meeting will try to be outside, not in home.

I think you should tell her you have left her and won't be back, except to get your things. I don't know how she will react, or what she may tell the kids.

At the moment she is in rage, after some days, me not be at home, and not telling her where i am. If i told her i living her, she will go ballistic.
All this 5 years, she kept my infidelity out of the kids, BUT Many times, she maid biter comments, or talking about my infidelity in front of them, they were lithe, but....so she switch to real b*itch, when got emotional....very short temper. She can be calm, ONLY when she have to take something from the situation. The example: when i was confessed mi infidelity, she ask me in very calm and understanding way, to tel her everything, and that will be our new beginning of R and M, so i believed her.....i fell like a full, because i was so much honest ...

If she threatens to make you out to be the bad guy........you can remind her you know the truth about her 2 other men.

She already did, two of our neighbors her GF, already know, that she suppose me to cheating, that i cheat in the past, that i guild her about her chat with OM2 (and they are just casual friends), that she keep this relationship with OM2, only to punish me - b/c she know i reed her chat, she told them if i wont back home to be with her she will punish me very hard IDK (may will have PA?), how horrible i am, how she staid with me after my infidelity - but me humiliate her about OM2, how she did not give any other man than me to touch her ....alot more in the line
Do you know what, one of this neighbor woman was GF of OM1. She definitely was in limerance with OM1, him was friendly to her, may be flirty when i was not there.

Tell her you can tell the kids that you've separated, together. Tell her she can propose a visitation schedule for the kids.

We already discuses this, i our last M talk, month ago. on this talk i told her i do not want to live with her/like that, because i feel disrespected and not satisfied. I told her i am going to move in our new flat, when is ready. In the meanwhile, i will stay at home (i told her there was 2 years living like this, so i will handle 3 months more). She test me, keep NC for 20 days, then blow up. So my boundary kick me out of home.I told her, will tel the kids, we are separating because, we are not able to make each other satisfied by being together.
About the kids, i think she will think before doing something stupid. She is very caring mother (when she is in right metal state).

1. Her disrespectful behavior toward her H and the M.

Talk to others, about our problems. Make fun of me behind my back. Gild trip me about my past mistakes.

2. Her having two boyfriends.

Only emotional connected.
With OM1, she was sms/talk, see with him for coffee, spend a lot of time with hime (he was neighbor), she tried to make him my friend, she looks like schoolgirl around him, she was in limerance, she was known i do not approve, she maid me suffer with pleasure. It lasted
6 months, OM1 dump WW, b/c his GF found some sms. I know about this, bay observation, Intel and convos b/w WW and GF, that she had a crush about OM1
very soon after that come
OM2, he is WW haircut client.
Up to now i more that one year, daily chat, Go out for coffee, meal, WW last summer was 2 -3 times per week at his place for coffee. WW shown limerance, yesterday i found out, that she began so much into him because of me, and she do flirt intentionally by FB, because she know i will read.

3. Her withholding sex for the past five years.

She cut any sex, love touch, kiss, hugs - everything - just room mates.

4. Her refusal to work on the MR.

She said there is not MR, we are separated, she cannot work on something that is not there any more, she is done ....BUT in the past at the beginning of OM2, she pushes me when i will leave her, because she do not recon to MR, i was telling her i am sating for the kids, all my attempts to stand up my self to not like her Friendship with OM2, was busted (do what you want, but think about the kids, we are just friend, we are separated, i staid when you had real affair).
From 5 years she is full of resentment.

Try to stick to these main issues, ...but don't argue

I will not argue, at all. I want woman who will try to make me feel good and allow me to do the same for her.

Who cares! She was not thinking about her parents

To be homes i really do not care, i know that how i living now is harmful to me mentally.

Unless she is a much better mother than she is a wife, the kids will know before you have a chance to tell them.

I think she will behave like real mother ...

Why do you feel guilty, when you know the truth? I tell you why. B/c you have been the victim of abuse. She has beat you down. She is an abuser, and she isolated you from your family b/c she wanted to enjoy watching you suffer from her abuse. You have believed the lies of your abuser.

This Sandi is true about mot of our relation sheep.
because of lack of sex in our M, i was addict to porn, when she found out (did not tell-util 5 years ago), she become more abusive.
Now i do not have porn problems.

Would your friend give you emotional support?...is the worst she can do?

No i do not have such a friend, you Sandi give mi emotional support, if i am convinced that i am doing right thing, i will not have problem to handle whatever it is come.
That is my biggest issue.
The worst ting, may be she do sex with someone and let me know. She is the person that want to pay back.

Was she physically fighting you? Don't discuss OM and her flirty behavior, if she gets violent.

No physically not ever, me either
No, I do not want to discus her behavior or OM1/OM2, last R talk month ago, i told her that i will not be with woman that accept behavior like this as normal and nothing wrong. Period

You can do this! You are stronger than you think. You have truth on your side. If she threatens violence, take the police to get your personal belongings from the home, and/or to see your kids.

Thank you Sandi, being next to me..
I do not see problem for now to go home take, what i need. The tings are not escalated for now. WW comment to GF if i not go home (aka leave) she will push the thing to divorce very fast ....in the end i am "let her go", i am not detached, i suffer about her comments, but now i can see my situation more clear......

Today i spoke to the kids, they were very happy, they were on picnic with neighbors. I told them i have work to do and not going home. Talk with them to see them tomorrow for a wail.

I am going tomorrow morning to text my WW:
Wife, as i told last time, i am not going to live like this any more.
Until the flat will be ready to move, i will stay out.
We will keep the financial aspect we agreed last time, as support the kids. When the flat is ready we will discuss finance's again.
What is your opinion about, what to tell the kids. Could we keep my staying out like work time, until the flat is ready, the to telling them we are going to leave separate.
I have spoke to the kids to see them today (tomorrow), what time will be OK.

That is the text i wont to send, what is your opinion. I do not explain why ...b/c i already told her that i do not wont live like this form more than one year, and during this year she gradually increase the bit.......if i told her that something relay upset me emotionally she will do double of it, only when she will loose something, she can back off for a wail, ones she reach what she need she is back on the track.
Now she will loose my support and everything come with me, she is not looks like to change her mind, so i expect to be very nasty when pay back.

wire soon

[sandi2]

The worst ting, may be she do sex with someone and let me know. She is the person that want to pay back.

Is that the very worst thing she can do to hurt you? Tell me why this would hurt? It is your pride or ego? Surely you do not want this cruel woman, do you? You are making a free choice to leave on your own power. She can not harm you by having sex with another person. She only harms herself.

Please, please stop snooping on her conversations. It is destroying you! You believe her lies. You believe she is the monster under your bed. She is nothing but a terrible abuser. Is there a shelter or counseling center for people in abusive relationships? I beg you to see a counselor, immediately. Get their help and advice in how to move forward. They live locally, and know better what resources are available for you. You must have emotional support and they could be there to support you through this ordeal.

WW comment to GF if i not go home (aka leave) she will push the thing to divorce very fast ....in the end i am "let her go", i am not detached, i suffer about her comments, but now i can see my situation more clear......

You suffer b/c you have been the silent listener in your W's conversations. Please stop listening. Her talk to others can not harm you. But you must stop listening. You are addicted to the snooping.

What is your opinion about, what to tell the kids. Could we keep my staying out like work time, until the flat is ready, the to telling them we are going to leave separate

I am not sure I understand why you want to wait until the flat is ready to tell them you are separated. If your W agrees, then that is your decision. I just worry about you not spending enough time with them during the next three months. I worry about you staying with them in the home. But it is your decision to make.....not mine, okay? This is your life and your children. I only give you emotional support where I can.

((hugs)). Please take care of yourself.

[betheoa]

Hi Sandi,
thank you, being caring of me.
I call on phone about abuse (emergent calling for people in abuse situation), but there was not understanding.
They call me, to separate or go to counseling.
They did nothing about talk to me. does not matter. I will be ok.

So i have text my wife;

me-yesterday spoke with the kids, to see them today.
I do not want to no tell them truth, where i am (been at work). What you think about it?

WW-The decision to lie them is your, do not put me in this..
give me the divorce papers.

me-if you hurry about D file by your self.
Last time when we spoke, we talk to tell them, that we are not able to feel each other happy.

WW-Do not heart my kids
Live as you wish
Cheap trick

Me-They are my kids as well, i do not want heart them.
do not attack me, this approach have to gone.

WW-Stay where you are, and be happy with HER
do not touch my kids

Me-When i come will call, to see them and walk around for a wail.
Think about what you want. I have told you, what i want to tel you.

WW-your word, do not have value, you lie
i think nothing
do not clean your conscience, with the kids

Me-I will not live like this anymore
i will call to the kids, to talk when to see them

WW-i do not tell you how to live
i was very young when you decide to live as you wish
do not put us (WW and kids) in your decisions.

Me-OK, thous type of convos, we already done a lot of them, and there is nothing positive in long term from the convos

WW-you start this convo
i told you do not abuses my kids

Me-when i see them will tell, me have to stay at work long term. When the flat is ready , we will talk again

WW-Why do not tell them the troth, not a lye as always

Me-do not attack me
I am telling you the trout from year, you did not listen

WW-haha i know the trout from longer than you,i listened to you,and you even showed me the trout.

Me- stop whit the BS, i am done to listen BS
When to see the kids

(here she wanted to bring the kids, to the place where i staid. She asked where i live now, how much i paid and much other things. I answered very short, of he questions.

Ме - I will come at 5PM

WW-i will walk out, to not disturb you,i have made special bred for you, it will be for goodbay

Me-i will not come home, will met kids out side

WW-your D8 sow our chat, now i will going to tell them everything, i will never forgive you what you have done on us.

She call me, and told me that she tell the kids that we are separated. She was tell them everything about my infidelity about

When i sow the kids, i ask them what they know, they sad every thing, i ask them do they know why i leaving home, they say yes about mom chat with OM2 (she tell them OM2 is not even a friend, just client).
So i just said, that i see the thing different. I did not ask anything more, i did not was teling them about OM1, or other things.
I will live like this.

When i come back, i send kids to home did not enter.

later WW text me:
ww- I hope, you now respect your self more (as i leave her)
The kids are not OK
You have destroyed this family, be more wise in future.

Me-Do no be offensive
WW - i am not offensive
WW - whay you do not meet me when come with the kids
Me- i have nothing to say to you, everything have been said, from me and from you.

So Sandi, you were right, she went to tell them before me, she tell them tricky trout, maybe even lies (i am not going to ask the kids what WW tell them). She was preparing meal for me (in the past, when she want to show affection and caring, made such a hand made bred). This time i do not take this temp check.


Now i have kind of relief of my self, part of my fear was gone. After so much listening of WW convos, i relay do not want come to her never. I could not believe her, ever to want to be my real woman.

My S10 ask me why i cheat on my Wife, i do not haw to answer. I know why (i do not justify, i know what kick me to be WH,), i just do not know should i talk to him about this at this age.

I am OK. This was relay hard, and of course, there is no why back.
I respect my self doing this, instead of staying at home and to be punish with coldness for the rest of my life, because my past mistakes (i really regret and apologize)
Write soon

[betheoa]

Is that the very worst thing she can do to hurt you? Tell me why this would hurt?

I know it is not healthy to take it so deep, but all our M, i have supper to not have her sexual as i would be normal. But in the end of the day, i will handle.

My wife, told the kids, all about my infidelity and a lot more lies or trickle truth, and almost nothing of what she was doing. My ego want to tell them my point of view, but i will not. I am not like her.

I am ok, i is hard as hell, i do not know why she tell them all this things, i could be said we can not make us happy together, and that its.

WW now to all people around and my kids telling, i left them because my reasons.....

However, i am relay glad i have done this, my kids deserve healthy parents, for me is sure i am not healthy, if i am around my WW. I think for her is as well, because she admit to the kids that she was not forgave me about my infidelity.

So, from some days now, i am not the old beta/omega f**ng nice guy, who was company (she try to make us friends) his WW to diners/beer/coffee with OM1, or who when WW call me to si if i come home and look after kids, telling me, she is going on diner with OM2, and i have respond "i understand" - that was advise from other forum 2 years ago ....

Not any more, if someone what to be next to me, have to respect me, and be the woman i will respect as well.

Thank you Sandi, for whole your support.
I do not know why other people do no write to my story, may be there is reason, some one to tel me please

All what i hear about me, and my situation by (inlet), open my eyes, what WW was thinking about me, also for her current real self.

I will post as regular as i can.
I have panic attacks and anxiety, but handle very well.

My questions:
1. Next week there is mountain walk in our sport activity center, should i spend time with the kids and WW.
2. Next moth WW have Bird day, should i do something.
3. The kids want spend some time together as family (my WW telling them it is better to be separated than to be together and fight). WW told them if we separated we are going to be more nice each other.

write soon

[neffer]

Try to detach. You are still wrapped around her finger. Those future family activities do not help. Take care of your kids and avoid seeing your W.

It all takes time. So be patient. GAL

[sandi2]

I am not surprised by your WW's actions. When your son asks why you cheated on his mom, tell him you will explain when he is older. It is hard to explain to children. Tell him you are not cheating on his mom now.

She will use the children to hurt you. I am sorry. She will make this sound as if everything is your fault. You will be okay. Don't believe her lies.

Quote:
Is that the very worst thing she can do to hurt you? Tell me why this would hurt?

I know it is not healthy to take it so deep, but all our M, i have supper to not have her sexual as i would be normal. But in the end of the day, i will handle.

The translation is confusing, but I think you are referring to not having her sexually. You have not had her for five years! All the five years you could have been with another woman, but you remained faithful. You will find a good woman that will love you properly.

So, from some days now, i am not the old beta/omega f**ng nice guy, who was company (she try to make us friends) his WW to diners/beer/coffee with OM1, or who when WW call me to si if i come home and look after kids, telling me, she is going on diner with OM2, and i have respond "i understand" - that was advise from other forum 2 years ago ....

Great job! Great attitude!

I have panic attacks and anxiety, but handle very well.

A medical doctor can give you a prescription to help with the panic attacks, and not sleeping well.

I am disappointed the abuse center was not more helpful. Please make an appointment to see a counselor. You need someone to talk with you.

1. Next week there is mountain walk in our sport activity center, should i spend time with the kids and WW.

No more activities as a family with your WW. Find things to do with you and the kids......but W cannot be included. Even if the kids ask you to join them and WW, do not participate. If they ask if mom can join you.......say, "Sorry, no". You can do this!

2. Next moth WW have Bird day, should i do something.

No! No card, no gift, no text, no nothing for any occasion for your WW. She is no longer your W. You have no duty to her. No more celebrations with her.

3. The kids want spend some time together as family (my WW telling them it is better to be separated than to be together and fight). WW told them if we separated we are going to be more nice each other.

No. This is children's way of trying to keep their parents together. You are separated and the kids will have two families. It is sad, but it has to be this way. It will be difficult at first, but they will adjust.

You must tell the children you will have a place soon and they will be able to stay with you. They will have two houses, instead of one. They need to know they are not losing you as a father. They need something to look forward to the future with you.

((hugs))

[sandi2]

I hope you are okay. Please let us hear from you.

[sandi2]

I hate it when someone just vanishes at the most critical point of their sitch.