Burned is still here. This is thread 6.

[equalzr]

I remember how in the beginning of my sitch i was a complete a*hole to my WW. There was a long time that went by before i started to calm down and did the ngs thing. I didnt get anywhere either way, but i can say being a jerk definitely pushed her further out the door. My WW told me she wanted to fix the MR for almost a year and a half. She didnt change her tune until i discovered the smoking gun about her A, and saw details that she probably felt she couldnt come back from. I knew it was going on, but never had the proof for a long time. Thats why some of the db'ing was too little too late for my MR (never too late to better ourselves for us though).

My WW was nice as long as she could cake eat. If you took the cake away, she turned into a vindictive monster.

[burned]

Yeah I just can’t figure out why this bugs me. I was re-reading some of the texts from last night. And even before she got angry, it’s just the cold determined attitude that gets me. Not even a hint that she has any doubts about this. AS made several comments about this a few pages back but it just rattles me. The reality of it.

The sitches that seemed to result in reconciliation that I’ve been reading usually didn’t involve S and usually involved lots of temp checking and back-and-forth.

My sitch just seems to keep getting worse. Even no contact isn’t helping. OK, it’s helping ME a little, but she’s still barreling down that D road. My only guess is that things are heating up with OM. Or we’re just past the point of hope.

[burned]

Whoa! Reading equalzr’s posts from mid-August, and Steve and Lane’s comments. Something clicked just now.

I’m approaching this from the wrong level. On the surface it’s a discussion about finances related to D. One step back, two steps back...it’s more WW garbage.

She hadn’t heard from me and asked to talk about money. Why? She hasn’t filed, I haven’t filed, neither of us has retained a L. But she knows that the money talk is good fishing. She knows I worry because she thinks I think she worries. And she knows it will get a reaction from me! She knows it makes me nervous. Crafty!

So I said yeah let’s talk about it later. And then later never came. But NGS showed up saying, hey, you said you’d talk about it, you need to initiate the conversation, she is expecting it!

Well, by the end of the conversation I had divulged most of what I know about the process, thereby teaching her things I should have let her figure out for herself. Because I want her to see me as kind and benevolent.

And by the end of the convo, she gets me to say that I don’t want this.

Plan B...urned again!

Wish I could realize this stuff in real time.

[equalzr]

It happens to all of us B. Unfortunately there is no manual for this. The best that we know is to detach and better yourself. I dont think there is a fool proof method to dealing with a WW. I agree with Sandi that they definitely need tough love, but there are other smaller interactions that dont always seem so cut and dry as to what is the best response. Sometimes the vets here even give different advice, so i guess sometjmes it really is do what works best.

[burned]

there are other smaller interactions that dont always seem so cut and dry as to what is the best response.

Exactly. Or maybe not? Because in the moment I thought to myself, OK, let’s approach this honestly, it’s an important discussion. But then maybe people who are looking from the outside in can spot it for what it is, way before I can. You know? Like, “start with a beginner’s mind.” Just need to keep learning and practicing..

[MoveFrwd]

Do you mean her fighting, or mine?

Well, a few days back, you said this:

I can't get away no matter how hard I try. If I give her what she wants, I'm a pushover. If I don't, she fights. Either way I lose.

So Im trying to understand what you mean by "fighting".
Her resistance to you and your growth is not a bad thing in and of itself.

The problem Im seeing now is that you are taking in so much information and trying to act on it all at once. I did the same thing. I learned so much from this board and told my exwife I didnt want to pay for her private gym sessions and I was tired of paying for a house I wasnt living in full time and so on and so forth. But all it did was poke the bear - I didnt have good boundaries, I didnt understand the legalities of the situation, I just wanted to take all of the things people told me and claim "king of the castle" or some garbage.

Thats what looks like happened on Saturday night. As Ive asked before, what kind of financial agreement is there? Is it legal? Is it meaningful? Youre both throwing around numbers and such, but does any of it matter? If you arent separated, then I assume your money is still all pooled together in the end anyway...

I get it. "Dropping the rope". It sounds so easy. I kind of wish there was another term because of how easy it sounds. But man, it's incredibly difficult. All of your postings are centered around her reactions to you and how you need to be out-thinking her or trying to get her to react in a certain way or whatever. It's all about her. And there's no way to just stop that without diligently training your mind to re-frame the world you are living in. If you havent watched the Shawn Achor TED talk on The Happiness Advantage, do it. If you havent watched Amy Cuddy's on body language, do it. The point of these is that you need to learn your own happiness and focus on positive changes. And that positivity BREEDS positivity.

Youre stuck in a downward cycle because your R with WW is going poorly. I can see you looking for signs that it will improve - like checking A timelines....or checking other sitch's timelines...its data, but it doesnt really matter. Like I said, the average US male lives to 78. How does that help you know when YOU are going to die? The dynamics and your attitude arent just going to magically change someday. YOU need to be the one to change. Through your goals. Stop focusing on what W is doing and how she is reacting and what youre going to do or say to HER. FOCUS on your goals. For several months, I posted a list of goals here on the site on the first of the month and then at the end of the month, judged myself to hold myself accountable to the tasks I set out to accomplish. Some were focused on me, some on my R with kids, some on my R with XW, just a list of things I wanted to accomplish for the month. What will YOU do to stay on your track?

Somehow, you need to convince yourself to just leave your W alone to do as she wants. NC for a week or two is just that....NC for a week or two. It wont resolve any or everything. Just take things a day or an hour at a time, and then judge where you are after that block of time. Let her live her life. You focus on living yours to the best of your abilities. You can do it, but you have to commit. And practice. A lot.

[MoveFrwd]

I was re-reading some of the texts from last night. And even before she got angry, it’s just the cold determined attitude that gets me. Not even a hint that she has any doubts about this.

Frankly, who cares what she is thinking? You seem so wrapped up in her being "DONE" or "MOVED ON" or whatever. It's garbage. You have 0 idea what shes thinking now, and frankly, she doesnt either. You have even LESS of an idea of what she will be thinking tomorrow or the next day or the next month or the next year. Dwelling on this only hurting YOU. And basing your action plan on your interpretation of her thoughts right now is foolish.

Imagine you just eat a huge meal. Let's say 2000 calories. What are you going to say an hour later? "Im so full. I never want to eat again." How about an hour after that? "Still so full. No food." and then again in an hour? "Just let me take a nap." How about later that night? Or the next morning? Or the next night? I bet that at some point, youll get hungry again. My point is that feelings CHANGE. So dwelling on whatever she is feeling at any point is a waste of energy. And making your action plan based on any one of her feelings is even more of a waste.

The sitches that seemed to result in reconciliation that I’ve been reading usually didn’t involve S and usually involved lots of temp checking and back-and-forth.

Bullhockey. There are plenty of situations with reconciliation out of the blue.
And who's to say yours wouldnt be the first, even if what you say is true.
Does knowing you have less of a chance of reconciling change anything anyway??

My sitch just seems to keep getting worse.

Have you ever read the advice for what to do when youre in quicksand?
Or as Ive read countless times....if you find yourself in a hole, stop digging.

[burned]

Her resistance to you and your growth is not a bad thing in and of itself.

Here I think you're hitting on something. I definitely poked the bear. I didn't think of it as "resistance to my growth" but the rest of your post here makes me think: there's not much to resist, since I'm not doing much growing. I'm still fighting against things I can't control and trying to change the past.

As Ive asked before, what kind of financial agreement is there? Is it legal? Is it meaningful? Youre both throwing around numbers and such, but does any of it matter? If you arent separated, then I assume your money is still all pooled together in the end anyway...

The conversation was an attempt to reach an agreement. Summary, so that I don't spend too much time talking about her: she isn't really aware of the nuts and bolts and does not appear to have done anything to inform herself. I can't seem to find a balance between being firm and being "difficult." That's what I need to work on.

And there's no way to just stop that without diligently training your mind to re-frame the world you are living in.

I can't figure out why I'm having so much trouble with this. I have a couple of GAL activities this week. I'm pretty depressed, despite medication.

If you havent watched the Shawn Achor TED talk on The Happiness Advantage, do it. If you havent watched Amy Cuddy's on body language, do it. The point of these is that you need to learn your own happiness and focus on positive changes. And that positivity BREEDS positivity.

Will try DO that tonight.

[MoveFrwd]

As Ive asked before, what kind of financial agreement is there? Is it legal? Is it meaningful? Youre both throwing around numbers and such, but does any of it matter? If you arent separated, then I assume your money is still all pooled together in the end anyway...

The conversation was an attempt to reach an agreement. Summary, so that I don't spend too much time talking about her: she isn't really aware of the nuts and bolts and does not appear to have done anything to inform herself.

I didnt ask about what she knows. What do YOU know? She has it all right now....your house and whatever money youre giving her to stay afloat. Why should she investigate into something that will hurt her. What information have YOU found? Right now, your "money fighjt" is basically just you trying to take things from her....kind of like a punishment. What legal rights do you have? What is the best way to financially protect yourself? Its a very different mindset from "cutting her off". What does your L say?

And there's no way to just stop that without diligently training your mind to re-frame the world you are living in.

I can't figure out why I'm having so much trouble with this. I have a couple of GAL activities this week. I'm pretty depressed, despite medication.

Because it's HARD. And it takes a lot of EFFORT. And it takes CONSISTENCY.
YOU are in charge of this and you have to set your mind to saving yourself.

I imagine your sadness stems from your perception of failure with your interactions with WW. What successes did you have this weekend? Can you name 3 for each day?

[lost8]

Have to stop digging like amoafwl just said. I find myself here often and have to work hard to just stop the thoughts. Especially about what she is thinking. It is impossible to know what is going through her head, she is F'ed up right now. I know because it is exactly like my WW, she at times can play me like a fiddle, but I am getting better.

I have used the analogy of Lucy and Charlie Brown and the football? I am showing my age but Charlie Brown was so determined to kick that football every time Lucy held it for him only to have her pull it away and he ended up on his ars every time. He never learned!!!! Trust me I have fallen for it a lot in the last 5 months but I am learning....and I don't like the feeling afterward....and I am not trying so hard to kick that ball so hard because I know the outcome. My goal is to not even want to play with Lucy anymore until she proves she can change.