Feeling lost, scared and wanting to fix this. Pt 2

[Rose888]

Pursuing is not the same as not ignoring.

Ignoring means someone is trying to get your attention and you don't notice or you act like you don't notice.

Pursuing is chasing after. Trying to get someone's attention.

Pursuing when someone doesn't want you won't make up for ignoring them when they did want you.

If you want to 180 pursuing, then learn how to validate what she says when she initiates contact.

As for GAL, yes, in the beginning it won't be very much fun. You'll be there and all you will think about is your marital situation. This is why activities that are new and different and require you to learn and focus are great choices. It gives your mind something it has to focus on, so that leaves less mental space for thinking about your situation. Keep GALing anyway. It will get better.

[Turbine]

So ignoring can be unintended but still hurts, still happened. In that case I am guilty. I wanted into my cave so to speak and neither of us understood that whole cave/tide relation. I wish I had read that book when I got married. That we had. Purely speculative but would the MR been different? Odds are yes. How though is anybodies guess. Definitely no fixing that.

So the question becomes how do we fix the MR. I have to fix me first. Then determine if the MR is even worth fixing/ saving/remodeling. All three terms work since not making changes means the MR remains broken or strained. Take your pick.

I know I messed up. It gets so old that everything that gets brought up is my fault. Does it ever end? If it doesn't then it becomes abuse. None of us deserve that. I suppose that would be a bridge I wouldn't rebuild then. I love her so very much. I don't know if it is that much.

More exercise. The muscle pain is far less than the pain from the gall bladder surgery. So easily tolerated. The pain emotionally from all this, as you all know, far worse. That which does not kill me makes me stronger.

W (I haven't seen spouses mentioned by name so... ), I am so sorry that you feel this is the only way. I can say why and when and how till I am blue in the face. That changes nothing about what happened and how you feel about it. I can only say that I am truly and deeply sorry for getting us here. Maybe if I had said no to a few things and yes for others. Who knows. I do know that when I said forever, and we were very young, I didn't really understand that commitment. Because we were young, in love and all the romantic part filled our day. Our married life started out in the worst possible way. Newly wed and leaving you with our daughter on the way, living in a new country with absolute strangers that were now family to care for and assist you. Things that I should have been doing. Things I wasn't able to do because I was in the Navy and they didn't care about that stuff. (They, as an organization do and don't) You did and grew so much while I was gone. Coming home to you and our daughter. Instant family. I know when you told me you were pregnant my reaction was disappointing to you. That wasn't the news I was expecting. I understand the process but we had made different plans. But we have three wonderful children. Our relationship with them is not whatever ideal you had in mind. I can't fix that. Each of us has to deal with that on our own. I wish I could though. That hurts you, our kids, hurts me. You are my better half. You are why I have tried so hard to do and give you everything. I want to keep doing that if you will let me.


I know... all of that is the right stuff to say and all the wrong stuff and pursuing, and pressuring her. Do I want to tell her all that and more. Who wouldn't on this forum. Will I tell her. Part of me screams yes do it tell her. Another part is putting hands on my shoulders, saying slow down you idiot. She isn't ready for that message. She may never be ready... at which point I fall off the path and into the darkness...

Does writing here help me? Sometimes yes. Does getting advice even if it isn't what I want to hear help? Maybe not right away but the rational side runs through it while riding out the emotional storm caused by that part. So please, please keep reading. If you have thoughts share them. Martians ask for help. I am asking. I am getting and find I still need more. Help me understand my Venusian.

[Turbine]

FWIW I didn't make it though the above without tears. Man I so want her...

God, learning to do this is so hard. Got to trust Your plan.

[ovrrnbw]

It's not about right or wrong Turbine, It's about not chasing after someone who doesn't want you. You chasing after them isn't going to do anything. Ok, maybe there's a tiny chance, but most likely you just come off looking needy and weak.

And not pursuing doesn't mean you ignore her, you just stop the pursuit and stop the pressure. Your mind can reason through this, but you are in a tough emotional spot. I've been there. Go read my old threads. If you click on my user name it will show you my posts. Then go back to the very first one. I was probably "worse" than you.

[Turbine]

Trying not to chase or pressure her. Trying not to ignore her either. Don't want to be perceived as needy or weak. I want to be the best choice and the one she wants to keep because she chooses to look at me again. I want to do the work required. We will see.

I will continue reading Steve and add your thread.

Not as unique as I think but not as common either. We didn't just have the two different people but cultures as well. She is still priceless in my heart.

[DejaVu6]

Those were beautiful words Turbine. I think your W would want to hear them and appreciate them...when the time is right. Sounds like this is not the time so put them away somewhere and save them for the right time. I think you will know when that is... when she is ready to hear them. I have regrets too...it takes two to make a marriage work and I know that I was always putting off “fixing” things to take care of things that seemed more urgent at the time. If only I had known how urgent things were. But please don’t blame yourself. No good comes from that. Take responsibility for the things you did and didn’t do, absolutely. But this is not all on you. She had, and has, choices. Keep posting, keep GAL. Have faith. (((HUGS)))

[Turbine]

Thank you DejaVu6. I want to say that and so much more.

However, this morning I am at 180 from that. When she left Friday night she didn't say when she would be back. She didn't return last night.

Is she safe? IDK. On my way to work my mood was: Pack your stuff and get out. All of your stuff. BTW this would be a moving van alone.

Do I really want that? Probably not and just feeling hurt and unloved by the most important person in my life.

[SteveLW]

Thank you DejaVu6. I want to say that and so much more.

However, this morning I am at 180 from that. When she left Friday night she didn't say when she would be back. She didn't return last night.

Is she safe? IDK. On my way to work my mood was: Pack your stuff and get out. All of your stuff. BTW this would be a moving van alone.

Do I really want that? Probably not and just feeling hurt and unloved by the most important person in my life.

Turbine, you are reacting on emotions based on your expectations. This will NOT get you where you want to be.

Take a deep breath, and ask yourself:

1) Is kicking her out getting me closer or further away from where I want to be?
2) If I am this hurt and feeling unloved, then am I detached the way I should be?
3) What GAL activities did I engage in this weekend as to not sit and dwell on where she was, what she was doing, etc?
4) Do I really know what a 180 is since your use of the term in the quote above suggests that I do not.

Turbine, one thing to remember with DBing: Giving up and letting things progress (kicking her out, filing for divorce, moving on with someone new) is always an option, but it is taking the easy way out. DBing is always the harder of the two options. But that is because it is the most desirable of the two options.

So, after you ask questions 1-4, ask yourself. In a year, 2, 5, 10, 20 from now, do you want to look back and say you took the easy way out?

[AnotherStander]

What I am trying to say, and am doing poorly, is that one of her complaints was I ignored her. So pursuing her is a no no and ignoring her seems to be more of the same. So what do I do? Pursue her anyway or ignore her because at this point both get the same reaction. Which is sort of why are you even trying? Of course if I am trying nothing this is confusing to me.

This is a very common question from people new to this situation. Here's the key thing you need to understand about this- YOU HAVE NEVER BEEN THROUGH ANYTHING LIKE THIS BEFORE. You HAVE been through fights, disputes, arguments, disagreements and you are programmed to respond to those situations in a certain way to bring your wife back. But there is an enormous difference between a spouse that is mad at you and a walkaway wife. HUGE difference. You do not have the tools to deal with a WAW, but that is why Michele wrote her books and it is why we have this forum- to give you the tools you need. What you need to do is get out of your own head. Quit thinking you need to fix things the way you always have, because as you've already discovered, that doesn't work. Center yourself, begin with a beginner's mind. Read DR again. Understand DR. Get a DB coach if you can.

OK so back to what you said above- she is in a mode right now where she is telling you what you did wrong, but being a WAW, she has zero interest in you fixing those things. Any attempt you make to right those wrongs will just be seen by her as "too little too late". It is also pressure, and what she wants right now is ZERO pressure from you.

As hard as this will be to hear, your wife no longer is in love with you. In fact she may despise you, it's not at all uncommon. So EVERYTHING you do is making her hate you more. So what do you do? Well nothing directly. You pull back. You give her time and space. You work on yourself. Eventually her negative feelings will diminish, but it's going to be months yet.

I've used this analogy before, not everyone can identify with it but most can depending on how much dating they did before getting married. Most of us dated and broke up a few times before M. Most of us have "that" girlfriend or boyfriend that was super clingy after breakup and wanted desperately to get back with us. If you have that experience then you will probably recall how absolutely turned off you were by it. They seem so pathetic and needy and you can't help think "oh man, why would I EVER want this in my life again" and that is EXACTLY how your wife sees you right now. By contrast, many of us broke up with someone who simply said "OK, well I wish you the best" and never looked back. Well THAT person suddenly seemed "higher value". You think "Why didn't they try to reconcile? Did I make the wrong decision? I wonder what they are doing? How did they move on so fast? Who are they with right now?" So this is the whole idea of leaving your W alone. Not in a cold, rude or indifferent way, but lovingly detaching and leaving her to sort out her issues and learn to miss you. Some day she will, and she WILL look back. And will she see a sad, desperate you or will she see a strong, independent you enjoying life without her?

I got replacement screws for the license plate on the rear because the installed ones are rusty. Looks bad on her nice car. Screw pitch is wrong. She is upset that I wanted to do this unasked for.

Of course she is. She absolutely would be, that's 100% consistent with a WAW mindset. She HATES you for trying to help, and any attempt you make to do so is just digging a deeper hole for yourself. SO STOP. She wants to be independent of you, she wants to do things herself, she wants to prove to herself that she can. So let her.

I didn't want anything from her for doing this. I didn't like the rusted screws there.

In other words, you put your needs before hers. How's that going you think?

[Turbine]

Thank you DejaVu6. I want to say that and so much more.

However, this morning I am at 180 from that. When she left Friday night she didn't say when she would be back. She didn't return last night.

Is she safe? IDK. On my way to work my mood was: Pack your stuff and get out. All of your stuff. BTW this would be a moving van alone.

Do I really want that? Probably not and just feeling hurt and unloved by the most important person in my life.

Turbine, you are reacting on emotions based on your expectations. This will NOT get you where you want to be.

Take a deep breath, and ask yourself:

1) Is kicking her out getting me closer or further away from where I want to be?
2) If I am this hurt and feeling unloved, then am I detached the way I should be?
3) What GAL activities did I engage in this weekend as to not sit and dwell on where she was, what she was doing, etc?
4) Do I really know what a 180 is since your use of the term in the quote above suggests that I do not.

Turbine, one thing to remember with DBing: Giving up and letting things progress (kicking her out, filing for divorce, moving on with someone new) is always an option, but it is taking the easy way out. DBing is always the harder of the two options. But that is because it is the most desirable of the two options.

So, after you ask questions 1-4, ask yourself. In a year, 2, 5, 10, 20 from now, do you want to look back and say you took the easy way out?

I know this was reacting from emotions.I wrote this out of frustration.
Kicking her out would not bring me closer to desired goal. Emotional side getting out in front..
Detached... not even close. I look at what I saw with my parents. Yes they had issues. They also were married 52 years.
GAL was hanging with friends Sat and Sunday. Church Sunday AM. Need more . Still time in my head at home.
Talking about 180, I was unclear in writing that it was my feelings this morning about this sitch. . Not the 180 in DB.

In no way do I want to not say I exhausted every avenue. Even the ones that I didn't know about before reading DB/DR.

So is a coach worth it?