They have had no contact with my W except to let her know that they love her, support her, and if she needs anything let them know.
Is this how they really feel or is it BS? If they don't support this decision then why pretend? This is what is considered fuching CONSEQUENCES FOR YOUR ACTIONS!!!! You lose the love and support from your in-laws.
Before I even knew what validation was I had told my EX in the past "you shouldn't feel that way" about certain things. This was one of her reasons to D. Now my mother hasn't spoken to my EX in two years and ironically my EX says to me "she should feel that way about her".
As for the event, if it is not a big deal for you I wouldn't go. You want her getting out of dodge next week with as little fireworks as possible. That is when the true detaching starts kicking in.
My parents never supported my W decision, but they supported her because they loved her. Day 1 Post-BD that was how they felt and what was expressed to W. They don't feel that way anymore, but she doesn't know because the don't talk. I found out my sister did some snooping right after BD and suspected an EA/PA and told my folks so that didn't sit well. They also see what's going on with the kids and hear what the kids tell them. To say they are pretty disappointed in W would be an understatement.
I'm going to pass on the event and spend the evening with the kids.
H(37) W(35) D8, D5, S3 T20, M13 BD 8/31/18 EA Discovered 9/13/18 Mediation 10/3/18 W files for D 10/12/18 W moves out 11/10/18 EA confirmed 12/25/18 D Final 1/10/19
MiL shows up and W says to me, "you and MiL go ahead and take the kids I am going to stay home." Mentally I am thinking oh no I am not dealing with this B.S. you are handing out so I told wife "Are you kidding me? We are going as a family, this isn't about us, we are doing this for the kids."
TF, you're not a family anymore. Maybe you will be again some day but that ceased at BD. Quit pressuring her with stuff like this. Making her go is not going to benefit the kids because there's so much negative energy between the two of you right now. Next time just ask her if she's sure that's what she wants and then take the kids yourself.
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D8 wants to have me over as well to have Thanksgiving as a family. I say its your moms scheduled holiday I am not sure she wants to have me over. D8 gets upset so W says yeah we can do Thanksgiving together, but gives me a look.
Frankly that sounds very pouty on your part. It also sounds like manipulation- "I'm going to pout until I get my way". I'm sure it's not what you intended but that's how it sounds, and if it sounds that way to me it does to your W I'm sure.
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She says I shouldn't say that W doesn't want me over. I tell her its the truth I am not going to lie to the kids.
You never needed to say it in the first place. Like R2C suggested, you should have presented it to your D as a group decision rather than making it sound like your W is the bad guy in all of this. It's one thing to let them suffer the consequences of their actions. It's another thing completely when you try to FORCE them to suffer the consequences. You're just setting yourself up to be a target.
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W says if I keep giving them the harsh truth they are going to turn against me because it puts W in a bad light and they won't turn on their Mom, just me. So there is some truth to what she says, but wow there is also a lot of fantasy.
She's right, the kids will sense that you are trying to make W out to be the bad guy. The thing LBS's seem to lose touch of is that to your kids you are mom and dad, not husband and wife. When you try to pin the blame for all of this on W, all the kids see is you trying to hurt their mom.
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Selfish, playing the victim and not owning up to her actions, and lying to the kids to cover.
Maybe. Or maybe just trying to insulate the kids from the pain of all of this.
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If down the road they turn on their mom it should be because the R between them and W broke down. It should NOT be because of something I started. That is wrong, I know it, and I need to be aware of it.
Do you actually WANT the kids to turn against their mom? If so, why? Do you want her to hurt and suffer? Because that has more to do with you than her. Despite my BD, S and D, I never lost sight of the fact that my ex is an amazing mom to the kids. Sure I could say "well she broke up the marriage so she's a shitty mother" but the reasons WAS's walk is enormously complex and not easily understood. It doesn't mean she's suddenly evil, or a bad mom, or a bad person. She just went through something and didn't want to be married anymore. Why make things harder on the kids? It's hard enough for them even with the loving support of both parents. Even in D they want you two to be a team when it comes to them. Work towards that goal.
AS,
1. As you understand letting go of the family we had is hard. I am struggling with this big time. 2., 3., 4. I am not being pouty, being pouty would be an easy problem to fix. I have a problem of not having a filter on around the W and kids. I am too blunt around them. I treat them like an extension of myself and don't even realize I am doing it. It something I need to work on pretty hard and fast. 5. She has been insulating the kids with flat out lies. It's like we are on opposite ends, both screwing up. She lies, I am truthful to the point of being harsh and damaging. 6. Honestly, no I do not want the R with my W and kids to suffer. That would not be in anyone's best interest. Do I want W to hurt and suffer? I want her to face the consequences of her actions, I want her to quit running from her problems. I want these things, but I have no control of that happening. I feel like for large parts of our MR when times get tough for her, be it work, life, etc. she just finds a reason to bail. She is a grass is greener person and she is chasing happiness, I just feel like none of her changes have made her happy and now she is pointing that gun at me. This is her battle to fight not mine. It's just hard being a casualty and seeing the kids being a casualty. Once she is gone I know I will do better, because having her around in this state keeps tripping me up. I just hope she just gets better with the kids and her absenteeism is just an effect of being with in the house with me.
This whole thing is by far the most difficult challenge I have faced in my life.
I appreciate your insight AS.
Last edited by Twofeet; 11/02/1803:17 PM.
H(37) W(35) D8, D5, S3 T20, M13 BD 8/31/18 EA Discovered 9/13/18 Mediation 10/3/18 W files for D 10/12/18 W moves out 11/10/18 EA confirmed 12/25/18 D Final 1/10/19
I can guarantee you that once she is out of the house, detaching will become so much easier to grab a hold of. Sometimes I wished my WAW still lived in the house so I could have more interaction. But I also know I wouldn’t be as outcome independent as I am now.
As for kids, I have stuggled to keep my honesty at bay with S at times when he’s hurting. I’m a work in progress but I think you may need to keep a neutral front and not attach blame for anything.
Me - 38 W-37 S6 M 10 years T 13yrs BD 3/18 W moves out 4/18 W files 7/18
I can guarantee you that once she is out of the house, detaching will become so much easier to grab a hold of. Sometimes I wished my WAW still lived in the house so I could have more interaction. But I also know I wouldn’t be as outcome independent as I am now.
As for kids, I have stuggled to keep my honesty at bay with S at times when he’s hurting. I’m a work in progress but I think you may need to keep a neutral front and not attach blame for anything.
This is classic "grass is greener" thinking when it comes to our sitches. Those with in house separation say "it is too hard to detach". And those with actual physical separation say "I could show her my GAL and 180s better if she were still here."
Bottom line, no matter your sitch, you detach, 180, and GAL for YOU! If you keep the focus on you then your WASs proximity won't matter.
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
Just my two cents on what to tell the kids. First of all if they don't ask I don't tell them anything. I know first hand how difficult it is night after night when you are putting them to sleep and they are asking where their mom is and why she is never around. I kept silent for a while but now tell them the truth. I tell them the truth not about the details of the situation but the truth about their Mom. It looks something like this: "Mom is going through a difficult time right now and is under a lot of stress. Mom and Dad both love you very much and will always be here if you need anything".
Seeing our WAS so lost and all the things they are doing that make absolutely no sense and thinking so much about fixing ourselves I think can cause us to forget about things from their side of the fence. I don't know what runs through their heads but I don't think for a second that any of this is easy for them in any way. When I look at my W now, nothing she is saying or doing bothers me personally. It bothers me deeply on a level of genuine concern and sadness for her though. All I think when I look at W is how lost and confused and depressed the sad little girl inside of her is. Truth of the matter is she is going through a very difficult time, she is under a great deal of stress. She needs help badly, not for our marriage, not for our kids but for herself.
TF, I'm not sure if any of that helps but try and look at things a bit from her perspective. Let the kids know that their mom is going through a stressful time but leave it at that. Be there for them and be strong. They need their father and they need him to show them what true strength looks like.
I am not being pouty, being pouty would be an easy problem to fix.
Right, I do get that. I wasn't say you were, I was saying it -sounds- that way to others. This is one of the difficulties in DB'ing, much of it is trying to understand how someone else thinks and feels, it is about setting your own wants and needs aside and doing 180's to change their perception of you.
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Do I want W to hurt and suffer? I want her to face the consequences of her actions, I want her to quit running from her problems. I want these things, but I have no control of that happening.
She absolutely will face those consequences, there's no question. All I'm saying is you don't need to "help" her to that end. Just stay out of the way, she'll get there on her own! If you try to force it then it just makes you look bad to her and the kids. Let her wade through the mud on the low road while you cruise the nice, clean high road.
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I feel like for large parts of our MR when times get tough for her, be it work, life, etc. she just finds a reason to bail. She is a grass is greener person and she is chasing happiness, I just feel like none of her changes have made her happy and now she is pointing that gun at me.
Exactly. I can't remember what movie that was in but a killer was walking through shooting victims and he stopped at one guy and just stared, and then moved on. Later the victim was asked how he avoided getting shot and he said "I made myself invisible." That's what you need to do- make yourself invisible. Cease to be a factor to your W.
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This is her battle to fight not mine. It's just hard being a casualty and seeing the kids being a casualty.
Yes it is. So what can you do- you can be the best dad in the world to your kids. You can overcome this by smothering them with the kind of love only you can give them. Your W is showing them 10% love? Then you show them 190% to make up for it.
Originally Posted by RyanHun
Just my two cents on what to tell the kids. First of all if they don't ask I don't tell them anything. I know first hand how difficult it is night after night when you are putting them to sleep and they are asking where their mom is and why she is never around. I kept silent for a while but now tell them the truth. I tell them the truth not about the details of the situation but the truth about their Mom. It looks something like this: "Mom is going through a difficult time right now and is under a lot of stress. Mom and Dad both love you very much and will always be here if you need anything".
I was going to wait till Monday, but I just have to get things off my chest. This board helps me vent my emotions and process my thoughts.
Friday, work party went later than planned so after work I just went for groceries, went for a run, ate dinner and went to bed. Wife came home around midnight and the dogs woke me up. She didn't tell me what she was out doing, she told me about her taking the kids to my in-laws for the night. She almost slipped up and started to tell me what she was doing, but she quickly shut up. Doesn't matter, I don't ask anyway. When she comes out and tells me her plans its been the truth as far as I can tell. When she doesnt I assume the worst and hope for the best. If I linger on those negative thoughts too long I feel the anger rise and my fight or flight mechanism wanting to kick in, and I don't flight.
Saturday she wanted me to show her how to make pizza so I did. She would cook in the beginning of our marriage and it was mediocre, so I took over cooking duties because I have always been the better cook. She bakes, I cook. Anyway, she starts fishing for assets AGAIN! She says I am taking her for everything, I split out all the household goods to my favor without her. This is a lie, we discussed it all and I wrote it out then gave her the list for review which she never did. Anyway, I say I am sorry you feel this way, however we aren't going through this again, if you look at the list it should all be even and I paid you cash where it wasn't. I then listed of some items she was getting that she apparently did realize so it stopped that conversation, but she continued to pout. We ate lunch and she was asking about my mom and sis cause they called. I said they were out shopping. She says yuck I wouldn't want to go shopping with them, maybe your future relationship the OW can go with them. This is where I get unnerved and probably slip from DBing. I say I am not interested in any future R with OW. I say I had an R with you, it's all I wanted and look where it ended. I say I would appreciate it if you just keep those R with OW thoughts to yourself, I will be just fine.
Later I put the kids down for a nap/rest time and W went and napped instead of packing. Before napping she wanted to discuss Thanksgiving. She says D8 says I dont want you over for Thanksgiving. I said thats not what I am saying, I have explained that they are with mommy during Thanksgiving so its Mommys decision on what they are going to do. W says no just tell her you made your own plans and wont be coming. I said no that is a lie, you invited me, I accepted, you don't want me to go, otherwise I would go and I am not going to lie. I say it is your decision. She says oh so that's how it's going to be. I say well the harsh truth of saying you don't want to me to go is not right to tell her, but yes that's how it's going to be, I won't lie to them. It's your decision, and you get to make it. I left W so she could nap. During this time I took my smaller toolbox and filled it with tools she will need on her own. Later she went to her girls night out, she wanted to let me know she was DD, I said have fun call if you need anything.
That night after dinner with the kids D5 started crying out of the blue and was saying Daddy please don't get divorced, I dont want you to get divorced. I soothed her and just kept telling her I love her and I will always be here for her. So afterwards we had a PJ party and watched movies. W came home around 11 and was acting really shifty. She locked her purse up in her car. I was hauling a load of laundry when she did it and I said why did you lock your car in the garage. She said oops I don't know why I did it. I said that's weird, I shrugged then said okay. Then I kept going about my business with the laundry. Well she started following me and kept asking me if I was ok, is everything ok, etc. I said yeah I am ok why do you keeping asking me that, why are you being weird? She says are you okay because you are being weird. So I changed subject and asked if she had a good night. She says it was fun tells me a few things then goes into the bathroom. I later try to go in there to put away laundry because she has been in there for a long time. I say are you naked cause if not can I put the laundry away so I can go to bed. She says she needs her privacy. I say okay I can respect that. Later she goes to bed. Well she was hiding her car key in the bathroom. I don't know why, as I have a spare key. I am tempted to go snoop once she falls asleep. It may be nothing, it may be something. At this point I dont even know if it matters.
Last edited by Twofeet; 11/04/1806:34 AM.
H(37) W(35) D8, D5, S3 T20, M13 BD 8/31/18 EA Discovered 9/13/18 Mediation 10/3/18 W files for D 10/12/18 W moves out 11/10/18 EA confirmed 12/25/18 D Final 1/10/19
I then listed of some items she was getting that she apparently DIDN'T realize so it stopped that conversation, but she continued to pout.
correction did to didn't
Also couldn't help myself I snooped. It looks like she went and bought more stuff while she was out. I have noticed a pattern with her. Post-BD when she buys stuff, and if it comes in the mail she tries to intercept the package and open it in secret. She has also been buying clothes and shoes and hiding it in her car, she then integrates it into her life. Example: she bought some really expensive shoes, but hides them in her car. When the time is right she puts them in our closet and disposes of the shoebox & shopping bag. Later, if I notice the shoes I would say oh those are nice shoes when did you get those? She would say oh these shoes, they aren't new, I have had them for months/years. Now that I think about it this isn't totally new. She has just gotten worse since Post-BD. She is binge spending.
H(37) W(35) D8, D5, S3 T20, M13 BD 8/31/18 EA Discovered 9/13/18 Mediation 10/3/18 W files for D 10/12/18 W moves out 11/10/18 EA confirmed 12/25/18 D Final 1/10/19
When it comes to the kids stick to " I will not lie to the kids" stop the "it's your decision". It reinforces to her that this is her fault and you are blaming her. Remember in her warped mind this is your fault.
No more "there will be no future OW". That is just going to extend your chance at recon. Unfortunately it's most likely going to be when your in a relationship until she turns around and says "holy $hit he's not waiting for me anymore. This is where you should with a smirk say something like "I plan to date many women so I'm not sure I can bring them around my mom".
Lastly, this one is going to be a little harsh. "Call me if you need anything" WTF? She's out most likely with OM (don't be naive) her friends will cover for her. I know what your thinking, if I just show her how much I care she will see this and change her mind. Actually it works the opposite she looks at it as she is Ding you and you are still working trying to win her approval so that actually lowers your value in her eyes.
The best attitude to have right now is " oh you want to D me and you're going to find someone better then me? Lol good luck with that.
No more snooping! The money should be locked down and what she's doing is none of your business anymore. Once she's out the real work and detachment begins.
