[AnotherStander]

Wanted, you are spinning out of control. Stop. Breathe. Relax. Center yourself. You joined a whole month ago and now you are ready to threaten her, kick her out, teach her a lesson, separate. This will all backfire on you in ways you can't even begin to understand right now because your mind is a whirlwind of emotions. Right now your focus should be completely on yourself and the kids. NOT YOUR WIFE. Pull back. Give her time and space while you get out and GAL.

Can I ask why? I should just go along my merry way while she continues to fake like she’s struggling so hard with what to do all the while maintaining contact with OM?

Sounds like the biggest pushover, whimpy, weakling thing to do......

No the wimpy thing to do is to beg her to stay, to rub her feet, wash her clothes, make her a nice dinner, all while she's having an affair. But kicking her out isn't a healthy solution either, not this early in the process anyway. Those are the easy paths. What is the RIGHT thing to do, the HARD thing to do? LEAVE HER ALONE. Pull back, give her time and space, work on yourself, get out, GAL.

My “showing herl is by finally telling her that I want her to move out. If she’s not willing to take time and space away from OM to focus on our M and R and what she wants, then why should I allow her to be in this in house separation and get all of the benefits of being married?

It's her house too, you're not "allowing" anything. She has legal rights. Again, go dark. Work on yourself. You want to punish her, which tells us you are in the wrong frame of mind right now. You've got to pull back and collect yourself.

She hasn’t felt any loss or consequence from her actions. If she’s living away from our house and seeing the kids as frequently as she would if/when we divorce, she might finally understand the reality of this situation.

It usually doesn't happen that way. She'll probably be happy to finally have the independence she thinks she wants so much, at least at first. If you push for S or D, you have to do it with the right mindset, which takes time.

I honestly am at a point where if she leaves and doesn’t come back, I’m going to be OK.

I've seen this happen before, where the LBS thought they would be OK with it and then once it happened they spun into some really nasty depression because it didn't bring them the "relief" they expected. Again I think you are doing this as a reaction to the hurt, you want to push a button and make it go away. There is no magic button though, it takes time to recover.

[SteveLW]

. Stop. Breathe. Relax. Center yourself.

THIS^^^^^^^^^^^^

Wanted you really need to make sure you aren't doing anything on impulse motivated by fear and emotion. This will hurt your sitch not help it. This is why detachment is the highest priority. And it can only happen if you are GAL. So those should be your focus. Stop focusing on her. Focus on Wanted.

Anything you do to manipulate her will backfire. So if you kick her out it should be because you no longer want to live with her. Not because you want to jolt her or control her. She will see right through it.

[Wanted1]

Thank you all. Had the talk last night. She swore up and down that she hasn't contacted OM. Told me I could look at her phone if I wanted but then went on to say something that I felt the need to respond to and the communication kept on, so I missed the boat in taking her up on her offer to look, unfortunately. I usually can tell when she's lying and I don't think she's lying about it but at this point I'm not ruling anything out. I have no trust in her whatsoever.

My recon, without really explaining it in detail, showed that she either was contacting him or at least was still thinking about him after the NC talk between them. Hard to really explain without giving the details.

I didn't move forward with any talk about her moving out and me not wanting her to live in the house anymore. The discussion was calm and didn't get overheated at all. She thanked me for that and then said some of the stuff I said came as a "surprise." I asked her what surprised her and of course her response was that the distrust I had in her talking to the OM and the fact that I thought this "limbo" period was just for her to get on her feet financially before she bolted. She did validate though and explained that she can understand that's how I feel.

She's really hung up on me "invading her privacy." Which I can go on and on about how that's just ridiculous from her standpoint when she's had 3 As. She was pretty upset about that this morning. I told her that through my intel I had assumed that she contacted OM but it does show pretty clearly that she's still thinking about him. I told her something I saw Sandi write in another thread regarding a woman only being able to desire one man. If she desires OM, there is no way she can desire me and maybe that's the explanation I'm looking for on that matter. She told me this morning via a text exchange that our R is intrusive and toxic which is contradictory to what she wants. I validated her and told her I'm done invading her privacy, as she says, because nothing ever comes about from it. All it does is provide me another gut punch anytime I've done it in the past and it's unhealthy for me.

She's of course using my "blow up" (if you want to call it that) and the conversation last night and text exchange this morning as proof that I'm not changing the way I said I'm going to. I told her I can't just flip a switch and that I warned her that I wasn't going to guarantee I can change overnight. That I might fall back into that trap, etc. and that I'm human and make mistakes. I guess if she wants to base her entire decision on my mistakes over the past 24 hours, then so be it. Nothing I can do or change about it. I can make it a point to do better in the future however and I vow to do everything possible to do that.

I'm done talking R (I know, something I should have done 7 weeks ago!). Nothing good ever comes from it and anything I say, she either focuses on the small negative or implies whatever I'm saying in a negative light. She can't let go of the negative and never acknowledges anything positive. I'm leaving it in God's hands. If it's meant to be, he will make it happen. Probably through a miracle by Him at this point. It seems pretty hopeless in my eyes at this time. But I'm finally at the point where I understand it's her choice and decision and there's not a damn thing I can do about it. I'm ready to accept whatever the outcome and am going to start putting all of my focus on myself and my kids. If she wants to leave, which seems inevitable right now, I'l learn to deal with it.

We are scheduled to talk to a religious advisor (the priest that married us who is a very good family friend of my W and her family) next week. Maybe the miracle I'm looking for will take the place in that discussion, but I'm not going to expect for that to be the case. My W is pretty distant from me at this point.

[LH19]

I didn't move forward with any talk about her moving out and me not wanting her to live in the house anymore.

Good it would have blew up in your face and not given you the reaction you were looking for from her.

I told her something I saw Sandi write in another thread regarding a woman only being able to desire one man. If she desires OM, there is no way she can desire me and maybe that's the explanation I'm looking for on that matter.

Your'e still trying to use logic and reason with her which is a waste of your time and shows her your still attached.

She told me this morning via a text exchange that our R is intrusive and toxic which is contradictory to what she wants.

That's why we keep trying to prevent you from digging a bigger hole.

She's of course using my "blow up" (if you want to call it that) and the conversation last night and text exchange this morning as proof that I'm not changing the way I said I'm going to. I told her I can't just flip a switch and that I warned her that I wasn't going to guarantee I can change overnight. That I might fall back into that trap, etc. and that I'm human and make mistakes.

Logic and reason see above.

'm done talking R (I know, something I should have done 7 weeks ago!). Nothing good ever comes from it and anything I say, she either focuses on the small negative or implies whatever I'm saying in a negative light.

By George I think he's got it! Touching the hot stove ow ow ow ow ow ow ow

But I'm finally at the point where I understand it's her choice and decision and there's not a damn thing I can do about it.

Took me awhile to get there too.

We are scheduled to talk to a religious advisor (the priest that married us who is a very good family friend of my W and her family) next week. Maybe the miracle I'm looking for will take the place in that discussion, but I'm not going to expect for that to be the case. My W is pretty distant from me at this point.

What is the meeting about?

[neffer]

Well, you can’t say we didn’t warn you...

[SteveLW]

She's really hung up on me "invading her privacy."

This one always steams me. A serial cheater claiming she should have an expectation of privacy.

Wanted, what are you trying to save at this point? I really do think people deserve a 2nd, or even 3rd chance. But 3 A's??? At some point you might want to just cut bait and run. i know this is an anti-D board, but sometimes D is what a LBS should go after.

[MoveFrwd]

I'm done talking R ...............

We are scheduled to talk to a religious advisor (the priest that married us who is a very good family friend of my W and her family) next week. Maybe the miracle I'm looking for will take the place in that discussion, but I'm not going to expect for that to be the case. My W is pretty distant from me at this point.

Sounds like you arent done talking.......

Are you cancelling the MC sessions also?

[AnotherStander]

She's of course using my "blow up" (if you want to call it that) and the conversation last night and text exchange this morning as proof that I'm not changing the way I said I'm going to. I told her I can't just flip a switch and that I warned her that I wasn't going to guarantee I can change overnight. That I might fall back into that trap, etc. and that I'm human and make mistakes. I guess if she wants to base her entire decision on my mistakes over the past 24 hours, then so be it. Nothing I can do or change about it. I can make it a point to do better in the future however and I vow to do everything possible to do that.

Wanted, why in the world are you trying to negotiate with a lying cheater. I don't call her that to make you mad, but to hopefully remind you what you are up against. She is a wayward wife. She lies. She cheats. You can't negotiate, reason, beg, plead, etc. with a wayward. She will twist everything up and use it against you and make you out to be the bad guy. That's classic deflection. Stop throwing ammo to her to make bombs out of to stuff down your throat. Read what we've been telling you and don't just say " thank you all" and ignore it and do your own thing (which up to this point is EXACTLY what you've been doing).

I'm done talking R (I know, something I should have done 7 weeks ago!). Nothing good ever comes from it and anything I say, she either focuses on the small negative or implies whatever I'm saying in a negative light.

Just like we've been telling you all along!

She can't let go of the negative and never acknowledges anything positive.

Right, that's what WAS's do. We call it "rewriting history".

We are scheduled to talk to a religious advisor (the priest that married us who is a very good family friend of my W and her family) next week.

WHY??????? Seriously, it's a waste of time. If she was one foot out the door that would be OK, but she's two feet out the door.

[Wanted1]

[quote=Wanted1] We are scheduled to talk to a religious advisor (the priest that married us who is a very good family friend of my W and her family) next week. Maybe the miracle I'm looking for will take the place in that discussion, but I'm not going to expect for that to be the case. My W is pretty distant from me at this point.

What is the meeting about?

This is basically my shot and, quite frankly, MY last effort in busting this D. My W admires and respect this man very much. He's a Catholic Bishop now, so he's obviously going to be pro-marriage. I think if anyone can talk some logic and sense into her, it will be him. She's always been very religious and spiritual (ironic considering the 3 extramarital A huh?!) This is probably where the miracle from above will take place if He intends us to stay together. However, I'm not expecting anything to happen. What he says will probably go in one ear and out the other much like everything else that's been said to her has. I'm still going to work on detaching in the meantime and will be adamant about NO R talk between now and then.

Well, you can’t say we didn’t warn you...

Yep, guilty as charged.

She's really hung up on me "invading her privacy."

This one always steams me. A serial cheater claiming she should have an expectation of privacy.

Wanted, what are you trying to save at this point? I really do think people deserve a 2nd, or even 3rd chance. But 3 A's??? At some point you might want to just cut bait and run. i know this is an anti-D board, but sometimes D is what a LBS should go after.

It really aggravates me too. SO MUCH. But I can't do much about it.

Steve, I hear you. I often step back and think to myself "why the hell am I trying to save this?" I don't mean this to sound preachy at all, but for some reason God is telling me to fight for my M. I've prayed so much and have never gotten a feeling that I should just give up and cash in. Lately, though, I do feel more comfortable and calm with the realization that I'm likely to be D in the not so distant future. That doesn't bother me as much anymore. I've been praying for my own strength as well. Maybe those prayers are being answered now, I don't know.

To be honest, if the meeting I'm speaking about above doesn't offer me any hope of moving toward R, I think I'm just going to count my losses and move on. I'm comfortable now with that outcome and I don't think anyone can say I wasn't justified or that I didn't at least try everything in my power to save my M. I take comfort in both of those.

She's of course using my "blow up" (if you want to call it that) and the conversation last night and text exchange this morning as proof that I'm not changing the way I said I'm going to. I told her I can't just flip a switch and that I warned her that I wasn't going to guarantee I can change overnight. That I might fall back into that trap, etc. and that I'm human and make mistakes. I guess if she wants to base her entire decision on my mistakes over the past 24 hours, then so be it. Nothing I can do or change about it. I can make it a point to do better in the future however and I vow to do everything possible to do that.

Wanted, why in the world are you trying to negotiate with a lying cheater. I don't call her that to make you mad, but to hopefully remind you what you are up against. She is a wayward wife. She lies. She cheats. You can't negotiate, reason, beg, plead, etc. with a wayward. She will twist everything up and use it against you and make you out to be the bad guy. That's classic deflection. Stop throwing ammo to her to make bombs out of to stuff down your throat. Read what we've been telling you and don't just say " thank you all" and ignore it and do your own thing (which up to this point is EXACTLY what you've been doing).

I'm done talking R (I know, something I should have done 7 weeks ago!). Nothing good ever comes from it and anything I say, she either focuses on the small negative or implies whatever I'm saying in a negative light.

Just like we've been telling you all along!

She can't let go of the negative and never acknowledges anything positive.

Right, that's what WAS's do. We call it "rewriting history".

We are scheduled to talk to a religious advisor (the priest that married us who is a very good family friend of my W and her family) next week.

WHY??????? Seriously, it's a waste of time. If she was one foot out the door that would be OK, but she's two feet out the door.

I know I've made mistakes and I appreciate everyone calling me out on them. I'm learning, albeit slowly. That answer to your last question is addressed above.

[burned]

Hey man, glad to see you’ve cooled off.

Two things stand out to me from your last post. OK, two and a half. First, that’s super cool that you know a bishop! But: you used the words “logic” and “sense” which just don’t apply here. Even under normal circumstances, human emotions don’t operate under the laws of logic and sense (that’s actually what makes them really cool to study, from a neuroscience perspective). Even less so in a crisis. In hindsight, do you feel like you were thinking logically or sensibly last night?

That segues into the other thing. PATIENCE. I’m one of the least patient people I know. And I’m telling you to be patient. So that’s a good sign of an opportunity for a 180. Now, I have no idea how to train myself to be patient. Maybe stare at a piece of pizza and see how long I can go without eating it?

Anyway, look. You’re new here. You’re talking a good game. You’re using all of the right terminology. But after what went down last night, sorry but I just don’t buy it. Seems like it’s much too soon. Or I’m completely wrong, I dunno. But take one gigantic step back and try to look at things from a “beginner’s mind.” And consider what you have going in your favor. Take time to make a decision. Read about the people who thought they were detached but weren’t, even AnotherStander, who is like the Odin of this board... patience. Marathon. At least a year of hard, hard work.

The nice thing is that you get to choose. And take the advice with a grain of salt. We don’t know you or your W. Objectively, if all we know is that she has a bad A habit, and you’re a decent guy, then yeah, it could be a character flaw that won’t ever change. But you know her and you know you. And right now everything is HER fault according to you. Obviously because you can’t fit ALL of the details into a post here. But ask yourself some questions. Why did you get married? What were your expectations? Are there things about you that you could identify, if you took a really honest look at yourself? Because right now there’s too much blame on her. At one point she felt that she wanted to spend her life with you. Then that changed. Why? Can you think of things about YOU that result in her having to fulfill her needs elsewhere? And what are those needs? And why weren’t you fulfilling them?

THAT’s what’s in your power. Until you’ve done at LEAST that, you HAVEN’T done everything your power to save the M. Or at least to get to a better one, with W or with whomever.

That kind of soul searching hurts like a donkey but you WILL benefit from it if you really are detached and if it turns out that your future with W has been irreparably tainted by her behavior. Because the next lady will get a H who is introspective, sensitive to her needs, confident in his ability to think about these things, blah blah blah.

And she will eat. it. up. You’ll be exhausted from all of the sex. She’ll cling to you like pine sap. I mean that’s sort of how I envision it. Could be the beer talking.