what the heck is happening, is this DB?

[burned]

I don’t see anything wrong with your final goal being “Have a successful marriage with my wife”.

Good, because that's my goal. Unfortunately I get the vibe sometimes that it's not the right goal to have. But I accept that it is MY goal, for better or for worse.

But then I’d break that down further because that isn’t really actionable at the moment. So what do you need in order to make that happen:
1) adopt successful relationship skills
2) be attractive to my wife
3)....

Nothing I do seems to attract her back. That's part of where the frustration comes from. So then I'll look at the actionable items:

Then you can break those down further -
1-1) form good interpersonal habits --getting better at this, with everyone except her, obv.
1-2) develop skills for maintaining a healthy personal attitude --this is one I need to focus on. Today I'm working on a day off, which does help me feel a bit better about my ability to make a difference in the world, achieve meaningful things, etc.
1-3) develop skills for maintaining a happy home --this is the one I seem to struggle with, because it always ends with me realizing the things I could have done better with W. So, now I realize those things. Better write them down so I remember them like 5 years from now when I need them again.

You need a map because it feels rudderless right now. And with that, you lose direction and focus and can become “stuck” or “frustrated” because you have no way of measuring your progress except by what your wife does.

Here's where, despite months of thinking about DB, I repeatedly fall back into the trap of "Well if the goal is R, isn't it ALL about how she reacts?" No! But my emotions are a nuisance, they say, "You're losing her, try harder!" And then I get feedback like the above, which points me back in the right direction. Because of goal 2, be attractive. Maybe some sub-goals of 2 should be, "Stick with DB" and "Stop trying to win her back" and "Live your own life for you."

Nobody else is going to do t for you.

This is what IC and I have been working on for weeks. Why do I get stuck there? What is it about me that expects everyone else to handle it for me? "Take care of yourself so that I don't have to" was a statement that W kept repeating after BD. At the time I was angry and figured, She just wants me to go away so that she doesn't have to feel guilty. But maybe it was more than that, and maybe it was a fundamental part of the breakdown of the M, that I was leaning so heavily on her that she felt smothered and couldn't be herself. (Why she chose A as a solution to that, I may never know).

[Vapo]

Here's where, despite months of thinking about DB, I repeatedly fall back into the trap of "Well if the goal is R, isn't it ALL about how she reacts?" No! But my emotions are a nuisance, they say, "You're losing her, try harder!" And then I get feedback like the above, which points me back in the right direction. Because of goal 2, be attractive. Maybe some sub-goals of 2 should be, "Stick with DB" and "Stop trying to win her back" and "Live your own life for you."

Months DB-ing? Dude, you only joined in August. 3 months is nothing in DB time...

[FlySolo]

[quote=burned] Months DB-ing? Dude, you only joined in August. 3 months is nothing in DB time...

... but I get how burned feels ... these short months feels like a life time.

[lost8]

3 months is nothing....I'm into 5 and am just seeing scraps of improvement, but it is mostly about how I feel about myself and how I see what life will be like starting over and that is the success. You have to continue to work on you if she doesn't want a good man it will be her loss.

[MoveFrwd]

I’m on my phone so I can’t quote easily

1) I said “BE ATTRACTIVE to your wife.” To me, that is learning about YOU and what it means to be attractive. It doesn’t deal with whether or not she is attracted. So things like we’ve been talking about -Detach, GAL, boundaries, independence, etc come in.

2) my lists were very incomplete. It’s up to you to take that framework and run with it. The point is to make “mini-goals” that you can judge yourself to. If your only goal is that top level one of R, then you will never feel success. By breaking it down into accomplishable milestones, you can find those victories and build momentum.

3) be careful with what’s a goal. To me “live your life for you” is less a goal than a mantra. How do you measure that? I would instead focus on what things you do would show to yourself that you are achieving that? THATS how you can measure whether or not are doing that or not?

None of this is easy. Or fast. It takes effort and accountability. And persistence. And patience.

What you are doing isn’t working. You are stuck in a repeating cycle of disappointment. How will you break out of it? Not only that - how will you do that in a way that aligns with your goals? THAT is up to you!

[Phoenix9]

Month 4 for me. That's still considered "nothing", even though a lot of changes have been made and sticking.

What is considered a "good" DBing time? If such a thing exists?

[burned]

FS: you said a couple of things that got my mind churning over the weekend, and I wanted to follow up. This is an important area of growth for me, in the sense that I’m too nice and not very good at reading people.

Your W takes manipulative to a whole new level and I even I would come back at her all guns blazing ... "you are being unfair", my [censored].

Can you explain how you reached that conclusion? If it requires too much time going back through old posts, that’s fine. The next one is more important:

Not being a total [censored] but if you let me walk all over you the way she has, and I was of a WW mindset, I probably would have lost respect for you too.

I’m having trouble understanding this concept, and it’s a recurring theme around here. Is there anything you can add to explain how this works? Sorry I’m dense...

[RyanHun]

B,
I think what FS was referring to was things like her using the card without first asking etc. She has left, that card needs to be cancelled ASAP. There should be no joint accounts, cards etc. Just one example I could see looking back a bit.

[burned]

Yeah, that’s definitely one of the ways. I’m mainly trying to be aware of the subtle ways in which she uses my NGS against me. Like, making me feel guilty. I don’t know how she does it, it’s almost like it just sort of happens. If we ever R I think this will be one of the things I will have made the most progress on, along with my NGS (I hope), just being aware of her “tricks” and trying to build a genuine relationship. (I wonder if she uses the same tricks on OM, or if maybe they do have the kind of healthy relationship I thought I had with her because I wasn’t aware of the tricks.)

[RyanHun]

B,
I also have NGS but am progressing on that a lot. She isn't making you feel guilty, NGS/you are making yourself feel guilty. Ask yourself what someone with self respect and who values themselves would do before responding. You may not feel confident in it but you really do know what is best and right for you, do it and don't feel guilty about any of it.