LBH Looking for Help and Guidance

[JB42]

Thanks for all the feedback. Everyone that she has told (except her divorced friends and sister) are all on my side or trying to stay neutral. The whole sitch is incredibly unfair, but I can't focus on the injustice of it if I want to get myself to a better place. As for the agreement about sexual partners, that was specifically for after the divorce. I made it very clear that cheating was not okay. My struggle is that there isn't anything I can do to stop her if she started. I avoid the topic completely at the moment and focus on myself, the kids, or other interactions. I'm going to rethink cohabitating. It'll be terrible to not have the kids around as they are my rock, but like others have said, I'm not sure I could endure the kind of personal hell it would be to watch my wife move on.

[JB42]

W just admitted to an EA while we were talking divorce logistics. She stated that it didn't start until after the BD, but I don't believe her. She also stated that nothing sexual has happened, but I dont believe that either. She is fast tracking the divorce because she says she isn't a "cheater". I think she just feels guilty. I'm truly disgusted by the whole thing, but I dont hurt as much as I thought I would. Maybe the pain will sink in later.

[ballast]

jb42...i am terribly sorry to hear about the EA, but sadly not surprised. as many folks will tell you hear no matter how unique we feel our individual sitches are, basically they aren't. in my sitch while w has not said anything about EA/PA/OM and i've not bothered once to look, her words/actions and my gut tell me there is.

i completely agree your W is just trying to absolve her guilt by saying this started post-BD. feel like my W is fast tracking the D for exactly the same reason. "oh we met after BD/were separated so I wasn't cheating"....yeah right

at least now you know. use that to shift gears so to speak. focus on you and moving yourself forward. if w wants that OM and is willing to lose you, let her be the fool by being strong and letting her go. it's not like you can control her decisions/actions anyway. for sure you will cycle with your emotions, allow yourself to experience what comes, but DO NOT let her see them!

and keep posting here as needed. you are not alone in what you are going through and there is so much good information here that can help you.

prayers for you JB. hang in there.

-B

[AnotherStander]

BD: My wife asked for a divorce 23 Oct, the day after I returned from a hunting trip. She is not willing to reconcile or go to couples’ counseling, but she has stated that she is pursuing individual therapy.

Don't expect IC to help with the M any, it almost never does. Typically the IC is just there to validate, so if she is prepped for D then the IC will "support" her in that.

Before the BD: I knew she wasn’t happy, but I didn’t know why and she wouldn’t tell me when I asked her prior to that point. I had been reading up on what makes a good marriage and how to be a better husband, I even downloaded a bunch of audiobooks and podcasts to take on my hunting trip.

Just curious, but does she resent your hunting trips? If you do a lot of stuff for yourself like that and she doesn't then resentment can really build up over time. Seems kind of ironic that you were downloading stuff on how to be a better husband to take with you on a retreat that you were going on alone while presumably leaving her to take care of the house and kids.

I knew something had to be done about the marriage so I committed myself to finding out our issues and being a better man/husband.

I'm curious if you tried implementing anything before BD, or were still in "research mode"? She is probably looking at it as "too little too late".

We have always been good friends. Our fights have been few and minor, and we are always able to reach a quick and mutually agreed upon resolution.

It was the same with my ex and me, and a lot of counselors consider the lack of fighting to be a bad thing. If both partners are conflict-avoidant then unaddressed resentment can be a real problem.

I need physical touch, primarily, and she needs quality time together. We both failed to make quality time for each other - life got busy with careers, school (she started on her Master’s degree and I started my Bachelor’s when she graduated), and kids.

It doesn't mean she doesn't like PT, she just didn't give it the priority you did. But a warning about 5LL, the recommendations in that book are mainly for a healthy marriage. So now you know one of the things that went wrong (you two weren't communicating in each other's languages), but that is not something you can fix right now. The LAST thing she wants after BD is more "quality time" with you! So shelve that for now.

I pleaded for another chance, wrote long emotional letters and emails, and failed to give her any space.

OK well you know better now! Those things are all very damaging, they make you look sad and needy and desperate at a time you need to look strong and confident. But that's OK, most of us did the same before finding DBing. So change that behavior as it sounds like you are, and plan on sticking with it for quite a while before it will have any impact on her.

but I feel like my situation is weird or unique in a way (just like everyone else).

Yes everyone thinks their situation is unique, LOL! And they use it as an excuse to do things they shouldn't, especially pursuit. So be careful about that. Some people that come here are masters of spinning things to "explain" why they need to do things differently, and despite advice to the contrary they do what they want, and it never works.

She wants to cohabitate in the marital home for the kids after the divorce. I know this stunts moving on emotionally

For financial reasons? And did you tell her you are OK with that? I'm sure right now you want to hang onto her however you can so that may sound like an appealing option, but I can't see that working out too well. In-house separations can be miserable business, can't see an in-house D being better! A LOT of people here do everything they can to keep their spouse from leaving, but nearly all who do let them go state afterwards that separation was the turning point for them finally moving on.

We talked about sexual boundaries during this period, but she clearly stated that nothing was off the table at the moment and she needed to “discover herself”. The only rule she would agree to was not to bring anyone to the house or introduce the kids when she gets into a relationship. We are switching off weeks for who has responsibility for the kids and she spends at least one night of her week “without” the kids at another person’s house, but I don’t ask and she doesn’t tell. She seemed very reluctant to start anything physical at the moment, but I am planning for the worst and hoping for the best.

Sounds pretty likely she's having a PA. She just doesn't feel obliged to tell you about it.

1. What is your take on my situation?

It sounds like you are afflicted with NGS (have you read No More Mister Nice Guy? If not, add it to your list). You are bending over backwards to placate her and she is cake-eating and taking advantage of you. It sounds like she is a WW (wayward wife), not a WAS. WW's will chew you up and spit you out. She has zero respect for you right now and you are making it worse by playing housewife while she pursues her "girls gone wild" lifestyle. It's only going to get worse from here unless you take your balls back.

2. For those who neglected their social lives (aka codependent), what were your winning strategies and tactics with GAL?

I had to force myself to GAL. It's easy to convince yourself not to, but recovery depends on GAL. The more you GAL the faster you recover. Also be as diverse in GAL as possible. GAL doesn't mean "go drinking at bars" (you'd be surprised how many people think that at first). I went back to weight-lifting every day, volunteered with Habitat for Humanity building houses, picked up several old hobbies (building models, building and flying R/C planes, working on my motorcycles and riding them again), reconnected with old friends I hadn't seen or talked to in ages, started taking my kids out more to do stuff (walk at the park, fly kites, go to a movie, go to lunch or dinner), started going to more events (such as motorcycle gatherings and R/C plane "fly-ins"), joined in more after-work social activities, the list goes on and on. I can't stress enough how hard it was at first, it is so tough when all you want to do is stay home and be miserable or engineer ways to throw yourself in front of your wife to show her how bad she needs you. You have to do it though, and the more you do it the less difficult it is, until eventually you actually start enjoying life again.

Everyone that she has told (except her divorced friends and sister) are all on my side or trying to stay neutral.

Neutral is good, "on your side" is bad. Try to explain to mutual friends and family that there is no "side" here, they should be supporting both of you through these difficulties. You DO NOT want them trying to talk her out of it or really even talk to her at all about the M. She will see that as you "rallying the troops against her". Don't talk about your sitch to people unless they have no ties to your W, because things you say WILL get back to her. Just tell people you are having some troubles the two of you are working on and leave it at that.

[JB42]

Guess it hit me harder than I thought. Didn't sleep at all last night. Thanks ballast and anotherstander for your words. I held it together last night and she seems really torn up and I am actively trying to avoid interacting with her. I've been letting her cake eat since this whole thing started and I realize now that it was a mistake. I'm so emotionally wrecked right now. She apologized via text this morning (not for having the EA, but about last night in general) and I decided not to respond. I think the worst part is that the OM is (was) a mutual friend and her coworker.

AnotherStander, I have zero expectations of my wife right now other than she keep her share of the house clean. I've backed off from romantic gestures completely. We had disagreements and I feel like they were resolved, but perhaps she just bottled up her resentment. I'm definitely a partial NG, not full blown NGS, but enough to make me address it. I'm reading the book now. Thanks for the GAL stuff, I'm working on my own though building meaningful friendships was never my strong suite. Another thing I have to work on.

[SteveLW]

JB42, your sitch is very similar to my sitch. (I read your sitch on Friday but I haven't been able to respond until now.)

Yes, the EA doesn't surprise me at all. 99.999999% of all of the sitches here involve another person in one form another. Even if it is just an fantasy of an OP. Many of us have written extensively about vulnerable to the charms of an OM wives in our situations are (OVR was alluding to this when he mentioned I'd be along to confirm this).

But here is some good news: It changes NOTHING you should be doing. GAL, 180s, detaching. Being the best JB42 you can be. Be the man only a fool would leave!

Right now the best piece of advice I can give you is to not lift a finger, in anyway, to help her fast track this divorce. You don't need to actively do anything to stop it, but definitely make her do the heavy lifting. She will have a fantasy fog of a perfect, stress free divorce. Do not give it to her. Make her file. Make her do all of the legwork and document gathering. Make her do all of the work. Likely she will never even file (even if she moves her EA forward into a full blown PA). If she doesn file, hire a lawyer. WAWs HATE getting lawyers involved. It interferes with their fantasy of a perfect, roadblock free D.

My W even wanted to give me full custody, and not try for alimony or take half of the marital assets. Why? Because in her mind this made it so there was nothing to fight over. When I explained that we would be splitting everything 50/50, all assets (my retirement accounts), current account balances, selling the house and splitting the equity, sharing custody, and that I would also be paying child support (and potentially alimony depending on how quickly she found a job), I could see her fantasy bubble burst a bit. Then when I told her I spoke to an attorney it burst further. You guys have kids, so there is not such thing as a stress free D.

So make her do all of the work. But protect yourself. Please do not come back and say "but I can't afford an attorney". That is never the problem...the problem is ALWAYS that you can't afford to NOT have an attorney.

Read my sitch. Read other's sitches. All sitches have their differences, but many are very similar. I think if you double-down on the DBing, especially detaching (let her go to get her back!), you have a good chance of turning this thing around.

P.S. Forget the OM. Your problem is not with him. Trust me on this, if it wasn't him it would have been someone else! In fact, even if it were to end with him today, she'd be on the look out for the next OM immediately.

[JB42]

Thanks Steve. I'll read your sitch tonight. My wife has already formalized many of the divorce documents and is working with an agency to process the paperwork faster. I'm standing my ground on the important issues. I'm not sure if I want to get lawyers involved because everything goes to [censored] and I dont want my kids to live through that. The OM sitch hurts and I definitely have zero respect for a person who would call me a friend and then try and hook up with my wife (even if she initiated). It hurts because she tried to hide it and he was a mutual friend. I've already made the comparison between him and me and it's not that he's a better man. My wife just needed a shoulder that wasn't mine and he was it. Anyway, thanks for the words of encouragement, Steve.

[SteveLW]

JB, speaking to a lawyer, and letting her know you did, doesn't mean you have to get them involved. the fact that I just had a phone consultation with a lawyer had an impact:

1) It made her realize that I was not going to fight the D, but embrace it.
2) As I said, it made her take pause and go, "uh oh, this may not go as smoothly as I hoped"
3) It hit her with the reality that D is a legal process that takes time, energy, money and effort, and isn't just a box you check in the "I'm moving on with my life" checklist.

Anyway, just consider it. It paid off in my sitch.

[JB42]

Steve85,

I think I'm going to follow that guidance. Things have been moving really quickly and I know that I am not mentally or emotionally at 100%. Gonna get a consult and see if I can get a quick sanity check on the way forward. While I don't think that there is any way of stopping the D papers from getting filed/finalized, I'm gonna keep at this whole DB thing because it's helping me immensely.

[Twofeet]

JB

Go to 2 or 3 lawyers for consults. Ask around for recommendations. Talk to a mediator who is also a lawyer to determine if you would rather go that route. I would skip the self file or one of those insta-files like legal zoom. If you want this to happen as fast as she does then it will. However while you can't stop D you can pull the breaks and slow it down. Get all the info you can, be on top of the D process.

Following Steve's thought process when you talk about D with wife let her know what your lawyer advises. That will wake her up a bit. It probably won't stop anything, but at least she knows you aren't just going to roll over.