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W asked me why my energy was off. I told her that I'm fine. She asked if I was angry about the IUD. I said it is none of my business. I told her that I know she was going to be sexually active so the IUD was not a surprise. She then told me how we discussed before BD that she wanted her tubes tied and how the IUD was like that because the doctor told her it's almost the same and, blah, blah, blah. I do not recall that conversation and I told her as much. Did not start a fight, just told her that it was none of my business what she does with her life.

Originally Posted by Steve85
pain, I am going to get a little graphic here but play along.

What if I told you that your W had been part of a 100 man gang-bang session? How would you react to that? It would be shocking and completely unexpected right? It would cause you spin and make you wonder who she was.

Since BD your W has SHOWN you exactly who she is. Is the IUD really such a major revelation that it is completely out of the norm of what you would expect from her right now? I'd argue that it is not. The 100 man gang-bang? THAT would be shocking and out of the norm.

My point is that I do not understand why LBSs are so blindsided by things that they already knew their WAS/WS was capable of. I take that back, it is what sandi refers to as holding onto the image you have of the person you married, and not facing the reality of the person they've become.

This is who she has been for months now. Why does it shock you? Because you haven't faced the reality of who she has become.


I recall you using the 100 man gang-bang in reference to detaching and how that event should be water off a duck's back. I have not forgotten that and still work on applying that concept while I detach.

The IUD is not a revelation or a shock at all. It's just feels like yet another middle-finger to me and the family (not even thinking about MR). The way she talks down to me seems downright condescending. She says she values my opinion, but it does not come out as genuine.

I do realize again that I am still grasping to who my W WAS and who my W IS NOW. The realization is coming in small pieces, but my overall feeling of her has changed significantly in the last 4 months. My old W is not coming back. I don't know what form she will come back as, but I do know it will be very different from here on out.


Originally Posted by RyanHun
Pain,
I hear you, I am am in a similar boat. I to have a selfish, lying, manipulating, maybe cheating W in front of me. I also struggle with all of these feelings daily. You can't ignore their actions but try and use them in a positive light for yourself. None of us on here deserve to be treated this way, we all deserve the type of relationship we want, sure we made some mistakes along the way, I find myself wondering often if the one big mistake I did make was hanging onto an unhealthy relationship for too long. Either way I look at it, with W or without I know the kind of relationship and love I deserve and how I deserve to be treated despite my flaws and that is what I am going after.

One thing I recognized very early on after joining here is how similar all of our WAS's are. We can all clearly see what is really going on but they seem to have no clue. One thing I am really starting to realize quite quickly is that as the LBS I have the upper hand and i think we all do, we clearly see the issues with the relationship, with ourselves, we are striving to fix what we can, we are striving to grow, our WAS's not so much from what I can tell. In the end we LBS's will be much better off in our lives as a whole regardless of the outcome of our sitch's. I sleep soundly at night knowing that either way I will be better off as an individual in the end.


Her actions fuel me to be AMOAFWL. My physical transformation over the last four months have given me a tremendous boost to my self-esteem. I look more toned, more muscular, and dare I say it...sexy. I lost two pants sizes. Yesterday I donated four pairs of my old jeans because they got too big for me. My mental and emotional transformation is a work in progress, but all of you can see who I am becoming. Many have noted at how I have changed since I first started posting here. I'm excited to continue to put in work and see who I will be 4 months form now.

I am the better individual. It's validated by so many around me. My D4, my mom, my co-workers, just to name a few. I just want to keep improving. It's taken me longer than I hoped, but I do know and feel that the changes I am making are genuine.


1/6/18-BD OM1
2/18-W meets OM2
4/18-W intros D4 to OM2
5/18-“Romance ends"
7/18-DB start
7/18-IHS Ends
4/19-WW moves out
3/21-D filed

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Quote
Her actions fuel me to be AMOAFWL. My physical transformation over the last four months have given me a tremendous boost to my self-esteem. I look more toned, more muscular, and dare I say it...sexy. I lost two pants sizes. Yesterday I donated four pairs of my old jeans because they got too big for me. My mental and emotional transformation is a work in progress, but all of you can see who I am becoming. Many have noted at how I have changed since I first started posting here. I'm excited to continue to put in work and see who I will be 4 months form now.

I am the better individual. It's validated by so many around me. My D4, my mom, my co-workers, just to name a few. I just want to keep improving. It's taken me longer than I hoped, but I do know and feel that the changes I am making are genuine.


Pain,
You really are doing great things for yourself and I am always looking at your posts for inspiration. Keep up with the changes you are making, strut your "sexy" new self and really just love yourself.

Last edited by RyanHun; 11/27/18 07:40 PM.

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Day 122

W is still very sick. I am at work and a friend is looking after her and D4. W texted me that she is scared. I asked her to call the doctor right now. She said she was afraid and didn't want to. I told her that I'm echoing the same question I asked her two days ago when she was uncertain about going to the ER - Stay and suffer or go and try to get fixed? Few moments later she told me she booked an appointment for this afternoon.

I asked her if she wants me to take her or not. She told me she is too weak to decide. I told her to be ready an hour before and told her friend to take W to the doctor. Ended the conversation by requesting she get a hold of me if she needs me there. No response yet.

So...I feel like I'm taking control of a situation that I would have been a little apprehensive (don't piss her off, is she comfortable enough, etc.). I just told her that this is what she is going to do.

Don't know if this asserting control of the situation without being aggressive or if there was a "smoother" way of trying to get her to do things.

Last edited by pain18; 11/28/18 07:33 PM.

1/6/18-BD OM1
2/18-W meets OM2
4/18-W intros D4 to OM2
5/18-“Romance ends"
7/18-DB start
7/18-IHS Ends
4/19-WW moves out
3/21-D filed

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I think you handled it fine. It amazes how the WW will try to take advantage and play on the compassion of their LBH. Oh, I can nearly hear some LBS's spouses response to my statement, but I'm telling you that she was trying to manipulate certain feelings in you. I'm not saying she is in no pain! I'm sure she is. Her STD has been exposed, and she knows good & well that her H should be absolutely furious. So, she says she is too weak to decide if she wants you to go with her or not. smirk Please! She wasn't too weak to text you. She wasn't too weak to tell you she was afraid, yada, yada.

Here's the thing. She is experiencing some consequences for engaging in sex with someone other than her H. I've heard that IUD's can be painful if not in properly in place. (Any thing that goes up in the va-jayjay that gets out of place is painful). IDK if it can cause that degree of back pain, but that's the doctor's call. Anyway, she's been exposed about the STD and the IUD. And just like other things the WW does that makes no logical sense.....she's going to temp check you. Mark it down.


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Originally Posted by pain18
W asked me why my energy was off. I told her that I'm fine. She asked if I was angry about the IUD. I said it is none of my business

Right there is where you stop. The rest was just wasting your breath on your W.

Originally Posted by pain18
The IUD is not a revelation or a shock at all. It's just feels like yet another middle-finger to me and the family (not even thinking about MR). The way she talks down to me seems downright condescending. She says she values my opinion, but it does not come out as genuine.

The middle finger came at BD, this is just now her bad choices not yours. And No she doesnt value your opinion and why should you care. Let go P!


Originally Posted by pain18
I do realize again that I am still grasping to who my W WAS and who my W IS NOW. The realization is coming in small pieces, but my overall feeling of her has changed significantly in the last 4 months. My old W is not coming back. I don't know what form she will come back as, but I do know it will be very different from here on out.

Buddy, you are grasping on who YOU think your W was. Maybe she was who you think she was maybe she wasn't. The important thing is that you should hold on to the good, learn from the bad, and move on. If your imperative is to R with her someday its not going to happen until you let go. If it does happen its not going to be what you had, it will have to be different to get different results.

Originally Posted by pain18
Her actions fuel me to be AMOAFWL. My physical transformation over the last four months have given me a tremendous boost to my self-esteem. I look more toned, more muscular, and dare I say it...sexy. I lost two pants sizes. Yesterday I donated four pairs of my old jeans because they got too big for me. My mental and emotional transformation is a work in progress, but all of you can see who I am becoming. Many have noted at how I have changed since I first started posting here. I'm excited to continue to put in work and see who I will be 4 months form now.

I am the better individual. It's validated by so many around me. My D4, my mom, my co-workers, just to name a few. I just want to keep improving. It's taken me longer than I hoped, but I do know and feel that the changes I am making are genuine.

This right here bud, this is the mentality you need to have. My only 2 cents is that its nice to be validated by others, but you don't need it. Validate yourself. Keep building your inner strength to go along with your outer strength.


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T20, M13
BD 8/31/18
EA Discovered 9/13/18
Mediation 10/3/18
W files for D 10/12/18
W moves out 11/10/18
EA confirmed 12/25/18
D Final 1/10/19
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Quit talking to your W. You two have nothing to talk about. Seriously. Get a schedule for the daughter and you don't need to speak to her. You get hung up on everything she says and does and you get dragged into crazyland with her. Don't talk to her for your own sanity. It will help you and it will kill her.

I can't believe you're being sympathetic to her over this problem she should never have gotten into in the first place.


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Divorce Busted Spring 19

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Originally Posted by ovrrnbw
Quit talking to your W. You two have nothing to talk about. Seriously. Get a schedule for the daughter and you don't need to speak to her. You get hung up on everything she says and does and you get dragged into crazyland with her. Don't talk to her for your own sanity. It will help you and it will kill her.

I can't believe you're being sympathetic to her over this problem she should never have gotten into in the first place.


Not sympathetic. Someone needs to take care of D4. Like I said earlier, she deserves this. I just haven’t told her as much.

What part of my dialogue in the last two days showed you that I was doing the things you mentioned? I kept it short and businesslike. I didn’t say that it will be ok. I definitely did not feel sorry for her. I am not talking for the sake of conversation.

But I will not be outright cold to her and twist the preverbial knife. I am not going to set that kind of example for my D4. Sorry but not sorry.

Last edited by pain18; 11/28/18 11:46 PM.

1/6/18-BD OM1
2/18-W meets OM2
4/18-W intros D4 to OM2
5/18-“Romance ends"
7/18-DB start
7/18-IHS Ends
4/19-WW moves out
3/21-D filed

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Pain, I'm with Ovr. And what I'm about to say, I've been debating whether to hit "Post Reply." So, here goes.

I've been watching you since I got here. I know you're angry right now, and probably feeling like you need to defend your actions. Let me tell you the pattern I've noticed in you. First, you get a whole bunch of input. You implement some new strategies. You start feeling good about your progress, and everyone congratulates you. That makes you feel good about yourself. Then your W does something and you go into a tail spin. Suddenly nothing at all is working and it's all the worst thing ever, and you feel a need to take drastic action. But it's never your fault. Then, usually about a month later, you're feeling better again and we're all a happy family.

Meanwhile your W eats the cake that you're spoon-feeding her. From where I'm standing, it looks like W is doing whatever she feels like, and you're dancing around her doing everything you can to avoid having to do the harder work.

Your posts just scream "please approve of me." Ask yourself: why do you need the approval of a bunch of strangers on the internet?

Why do I notice these things? Because I do them too.

Teach your D4 that strong people don't let other people use them and disrespect them like that. Teach her that strong people back up their strong words with strong actions. Teach her what it looks like to do the RIGHT thing, not just what other people tell you is right.


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Originally Posted by burned
Pain, I'm with Ovr. And what I'm about to say, I've been debating whether to hit "Post Reply." So, here goes.

I've been watching you since I got here. I know you're angry right now, and probably feeling like you need to defend your actions. Let me tell you the pattern I've noticed in you. First, you get a whole bunch of input. You implement some new strategies. You start feeling good about your progress, and everyone congratulates you. That makes you feel good about yourself. Then your W does something and you go into a tail spin. Suddenly nothing at all is working and it's all the worst thing ever, and you feel a need to take drastic action. But it's never your fault. Then, usually about a month later, you're feeling better again and we're all a happy family.

Meanwhile your W eats the cake that you're spoon-feeding her. From where I'm standing, it looks like W is doing whatever she feels like, and you're dancing around her doing everything you can to avoid having to do the harder work.

Your posts just scream "please approve of me." Ask yourself: why do you need the approval of a bunch of strangers on the internet?

Why do I notice these things? Because I do them too.

Teach your D4 that strong people don't let other people use them and disrespect them like that. Teach her that strong people back up their strong words with strong actions. Teach her what it looks like to do the RIGHT thing, not just what other people tell you is right.


I do see where you are coming from and I would have to agree. About the cycling between making progress then W does something and I crash then pick myself up and go through this process again. But I do not realize that until someone points it out to me.

My NGS? I never realized that I had it until it was pointed out to me.
My W cake-eating? I never realized that I was doing it until it was pointed out to me.
My need to get better? Again, I never realized how much I needed to improve until it was pointed out to me.

I ask for approval, because I really do not know how well I am doing. I tell myself I am doing well, then someone points out to me that I am not doing things correctly at all. So I take the criticism (and as evidenced before and even now, begrudgingly and angrily) and use it to better myself. And if I am wrong for reacting that way, I admit it as much. The best example of changing my behavior was my 90 day review. I thought I was doing pretty good until it was pointed out to me that I definitely was not. It was a cold splash of water and gave me the realization that I have a lot of work to do. So I took it, rolled up my sleeves and started working on being the best employee I can be. I have my annual review in two weeks. I feel like I have made a lot of improvements. But I want to make sure that I am meeting their criteria for being a "good employee". I have lost jobs because of my poor performance and realizing it after it was too late. I don't want that.

I do my best not to go into denial because I know that what people are saying to me is likely true because they themselves have gone through one form of it or another, like you burned. But I also feel the need to defend myself because I perceive it as a slight or an attack, when in reality, it's not. That's a behavior that I am trying to work on as well and the only way I can work on it is if someone sees it and calls me out on it. One such example was a couple of months ago when I told you all that I told W about my weight loss and AS told me that I was pursuing when I thought it was a good thing and the response I got from her was genuine. Looking back, it was not. It was her just placating me. I was just too fogged up back then to realize. It was not until I saw the emails that I saw the extent of her actions and I truly saw W for what she is. It's been 39 days since that revelation. And I started to truly work on my detachment. It's safe to assume that I am still in the fog. I am not out, but I am trying my best to come out of it.

When people like you or ovr tell me things like I am hanging on to her every word and have her cake-eat, I do get angry, mostly because I thought I was doing better than I thought I was and come to realize that no...I am still a long ways off and still making a ton of mistakes. I try to take responsibility for my actions but it appears that I still shift the blame towards external sources and factors (W, her friends). I do not see how it's my behavior until someone (you all) point it out to me. I thought that my keeping my responses short and businesslike I am doing the right thing. I thought that by telling her things like "It's none of my business" and the conversation afterward, I feel like I was doing the right thing. I really feel that I am not showing any sympathy. And it shows to folks here that I still have work to do.

And I do want to work it out. But I want to do it right. Because I am feeling those changes based off of the feedback given by you all. I am starting to turn it around. Slowly, but it's happening. And I'm slowly trying to let go and detach. Again...slowly, but it's happening. I don't think I would have made such strides if it were not for folks chiming in and providing criticisms, praise, and reinforcement. I really don't.

You folks are not strangers on the Internet to me...you're my support group. You're my inspiration to make those needed changes for myself. If you can be a happier you, why can't I use what you have done to be a better me?

I am not going to promise that I will stop being so defensive and hurt when I get hit with a 2x4. But I am going to work on taking said 2x4 better. You're not trying to hurt me. You're trying to help me. And I need to continue to see that.

Last edited by pain18; 11/29/18 01:13 AM.

1/6/18-BD OM1
2/18-W meets OM2
4/18-W intros D4 to OM2
5/18-“Romance ends"
7/18-DB start
7/18-IHS Ends
4/19-WW moves out
3/21-D filed

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Great post Pain. Honestly...I am in the same boat as you. I find myself cycling between periods of PMA and a despair-like sadness that can be overwhelming. It is sometimes related to my H and something he said or did but mostly it is something that just seems to hit me out of the blue. I think this is the nature of grief and I know that all of us will get through this phase... we have no choice. But man, does it have to be so d@mn painful?!? I’d really like to just skip to the full-on acceptance part and get off of this ride. frown

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