[AnotherStander]

Yep, I’m on his 3rd thread now. What you were writing to him back then sounded awfully similar to what I’ve heard from you here.

DB'ing today is pretty much the same as it was a year ago and 5 years ago There are some aspects that are particular to each person but the gist of it is the same for everyone.

I’m preparing for the long haul, but in the meantime going to focus on me and getting through the pain, grief and utter devastation. That’s priority #1 along with continuing to detach and move on. I understand I need to let her go and do whatever it is she has to do. If that means signing the D papers to get it started, I’ll oblige.

There you go, that's exactly the right attitude!

I don't know what to think about my sitch. It's stupid to even THINK this, but I almost wish my W would get mad at me for crap because that would mean she's actually interacting with me and concerned about what I'm doing. She really doesn't give me the time of day unless it's something of the utmost importance pretty much.

That is because you are so utterly starved for attention from her. You may have seen me say this before but often the LBS will first try to "nice" the WAS back, then when that doesn't work they'll try to "mean" them back (this is a particularly a problem with men that have NGS). They are just so desperate for attention that they don't even care if it's positive or negative as long as it's SOMETHING. I doubt I need to explain to you why this is a problem! Work on that GAL, and keep in mind that attention is what YOU want, and at this time everything needs to be about what SHE wants.

On the flip side, no communication does help me detach from an emotional standpoint and helps me with going dim as well I suppose.

Yes, that's what going dim/ dark is for is to help the LBS detach. It won't fix the M but it will help the LBS detach and that detachment is what may eventually bring the WAS back around.

Not gonna lie, the lack of any intimacy for me is starting to bother me.

Well don't be too anxious to cross that bridge. When I started getting intimate with other women it opened a whole new set of struggles. I had never had sexual issues in my life, but being intimate with someone else after 25 years just felt so strange and wrong. I don't know how WAS's can have affairs and not be eaten alive with guilt and remorse, I struggled with it even though my ex had already dumped me and moved out! It took months for me to get comfortable being with someone else. The sexual gratification part is easy, the emotional and psychological side is not.

[Wanted1]

That is because you are so utterly starved for attention from her. You may have seen me say this before but often the LBS will first try to "nice" the WAS back, then when that doesn't work they'll try to "mean" them back (this is a particularly a problem with men that have NGS). They are just so desperate for attention that they don't even care if it's positive or negative as long as it's SOMETHING. I doubt I need to explain to you why this is a problem! Work on that GAL, and keep in mind that attention is what YOU want, and at this time everything needs to be about what SHE wants.

Yep, I see that clearly. And I know it's counterproductive to feel that way, I do. She wants to know associate with my whatsoever and wants time and space away from me and I am wanting the opposite. Time to forget what I want and keep in mind what she wants. Once again, I'm sacrificing my needs for hers but in the long run the needs I have right now aren't beneficial to my overall growth detachment or beneficial to her finding her way back IF that would ever happen.

Not gonna lie, the lack of any intimacy for me is starting to bother me.

Well don't be too anxious to cross that bridge. When I started getting intimate with other women it opened a whole new set of struggles. I had never had sexual issues in my life, but being intimate with someone else after 25 years just felt so strange and wrong. I don't know how WAS's can have affairs and not be eaten alive with guilt and remorse, I struggled with it even though my ex had already dumped me and moved out! It took months for me to get comfortable being with someone else. The sexual gratification part is easy, the emotional and psychological side is not.

Yep, very good point. The thought of even going out on a date just seems so scary and awkward at this point let alone anything more. It's been SO long since I've done any of that but I suppose over time, like you said, it'll get more comfortable. Face your fears, right?

I'm with you on the affairs thing. I can't imagine myself doing something like that. There's no way I could ever go through with it if the opportunity presented itself. I, too, would be eaten alive with guilt and remorse.

[Wanted1]

The part that is so utterly and absolutely confusing to me is why my WW wouldn't at least consider trying to work on things even if it were just for the kids.....that, obviously, isn't really a good reason, from my standpoint, in wanting to stay in a marriage, but even if she was only trying it for the kids' sake, it surprises me greatly that she couldn't find it in her heart to just try. I've even mentioned in the past to her that what is the hurt it trying? It doesn't mean we will 100% work our issues out and R. If we tried and things didn't get better than it pretty obvious what the best course of action would be. But to just flat out refuse to try and be done without any sort of attempt continues to boggle my mind.

Don't the kids deserve at least as much as trying?? Whatever, I'm done trying to understand it because I never will. She would never admit it, but her desires and actions are completely centered around herself with no regard for what's in the best interests of the kids. She tries to justify it with lame attempts at telling me the kids will be better off but everyone in their right mind knows that's just BS. I think that's where the most resentment I have for her lies. Her unwillingness to at least try now that I admit and own my own shortcomings. Something I haven't been able to realize in the past.

I know either way I'll be fine. This little ordeal has given me the opportunity to bond so much more with the kids which I'm enjoying so much I can't put it into words. I also think IF she would ever decide to come back, going through this for herself will give her that much more appreciation for me and the family we have. Sometimes you don't know what you have until it's gone. Maybe after some time on her own she will understand what she had wasn't really as bad as she thought it was and if I can continue down my own path of becoming a better version of myself, a R will be much better and long lasting. If not, again, I sort of feel like Joe2017 did and clearly become the most eligible bachelor in town. That doesn't seem to be a bad prospect. With that said, on the flip side, maybe I'll realize what I didn't have with her and am currently longing for. Sort of the opposite of "you don't know what you have until it's gone." I'll find out what it's like to have a spouse/partner who truly desires to be with me, treat me with respect and is utterly head over heels for me. That still could be with her or with someone entirely new. Maybe God needs us to both go our separate ways for awhile to work on ourselves so that if R is an option we aren't back in this same situation again and we come back renewed, refreshed and recommitted to each other. She has more work to do than I. I think that's a given. This could be God protecting me from another BD down the road if she came back before she should. Time will tell.

[LH19]

The part that is so utterly and absolutely confusing to me is why my WW wouldn't at least consider trying to work on things even if it were just for the kids.

Why is it confusing to you? It's because you are trying to use logic and reason with an emotional human being. It's best for the kids. (logical) You won't lose half the time with the kids (logical). You will lose half your assets (logical). That is how you see things. She is unhappy right now and she feels she will never be happy staying with you. These are her feelings RIGHT NOW and you trying to prevent her from her "happiness". More of the same behavior from you in her mind.

Whatever, I'm done trying to understand it because I never will.

This is part of the problem. You don't understand women and you will continue to struggle until you do.

She tries to justify it with lame attempts at telling me the kids will be better off but everyone in their right mind knows that's just BS.

This is actually true if you both end up in loving relationships down the road.

Her unwillingness to at least try now that I admit and own my own shortcomings. Something I haven't been able to realize in the past.

What are these said shortcomings you speak of?

I know either way I'll be fine.

100 PERCENT CORRECT!

This little ordeal has given me the opportunity to bond so much more with the kids which I'm enjoying so much I can't put it into words.

That is AWESOME!

Maybe God needs us to both go our separate ways for awhile to work on ourselves so that if R is an option we aren't back in this same situation again and we come back renewed, refreshed and recommitted to each other.

Very well could be. Now open the cage door Wanted!

[AnotherStander]

Time to forget what I want and keep in mind what she wants. Once again, I'm sacrificing my needs for hers but in the long run the needs I have right now aren't beneficial to my overall growth detachment or beneficial to her finding her way back IF that would ever happen.

Exactly!!

Yep, very good point. The thought of even going out on a date just seems so scary and awkward at this point let alone anything more. It's been SO long since I've done any of that but I suppose over time, like you said, it'll get more comfortable. Face your fears, right?

Definitely. And to clarify a bit, I actually enjoyed meeting and going out with women. It was the sex part that was a big adjustment. I had just wired myself to be with one person, and rewiring my mind to open up to others sexually was the tough part. Now I've been with my GF for 4 years and she's my comfort zone. Having sex with my ex just seems so utterly foreign to me now, like THAT would be wrong!

The part that is so utterly and absolutely confusing to me is why my WW wouldn't at least consider trying to work on things even if it were just for the kids.....that, obviously, isn't really a good reason, from my standpoint, in wanting to stay in a marriage, but even if she was only trying it for the kids' sake, it surprises me greatly that she couldn't find it in her heart to just try. I've even mentioned in the past to her that what is the hurt it trying? It doesn't mean we will 100% work our issues out and R. If we tried and things didn't get better than it pretty obvious what the best course of action would be. But to just flat out refuse to try and be done without any sort of attempt continues to boggle my mind.

Oh yes it's very confusing and there is no reasonable explanation. It just doesn't add up, how can you say "I am going to spend my life with this person" and then invest heavily in a home and family with them, then decide you are done with all that and leave with hardly an explanation of why??? If I die and God meets me at the pearly gates and says "ask me anything, I will tell you the universe's secrets" then that will be number one on my list

She tries to justify it with lame attempts at telling me the kids will be better off but everyone in their right mind knows that's just BS.

And she knows it too, but she wants desperately to convince herself otherwise. It's a lot like mental illness, her synapses are not firing properly right now.

Maybe after some time on her own she will understand what she had wasn't really as bad as she thought it was

Very likely. Will it lead to recon? That part we can't say for sure, but she will come out of the fog some day and see things much differently than she does now. Sometimes it takes a long time. I don't think my ex really came out of the fog until this year. Her attitude has been such a dramatic reversal this year that I'm kind of surprised she hasn't hit me with the recon question. I wonder if she hasn't because either she is too ashamed, or because I have a GF now, or both.

[Wanted1]

The part that is so utterly and absolutely confusing to me is why my WW wouldn't at least consider trying to work on things even if it were just for the kids.

Why is it confusing to you? It's because you are trying to use logic and reason with an emotional human being. It's best for the kids. (logical) You won't lose half the time with the kids (logical). You will lose half your assets (logical). That is how you see things. She is unhappy right now and she feels she will never be happy staying with you. These are her feelings RIGHT NOW and you trying to prevent her from her "happiness". More of the same behavior from you in her mind.

I know, I know. Logic. I just can't wrap my head around someone not taking "logic" and "reason" into account for anything. With that said, I understand the concept of emotions guiding everything with her and logic not playing a part at all. I get the concept. I just don't get how someone can totally disregard one in favor of the other, I guess. Not sure if that makes sense or not.....hard to put into words.

Whatever, I'm done trying to understand it because I never will.

This is part of the problem. You don't understand women and you will continue to struggle until you do.

I'm not going to be naive and say I understand women, because I don't think I totally do. However, I don't think I'm completely ignorant about them either. I will say, though, I don't understand the WW mentality at all! I wonder if I should read Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus.....maybe that would help me for the future.

She tries to justify it with lame attempts at telling me the kids will be better off but everyone in their right mind knows that's just BS.

This is actually true if you both end up in loving relationships down the road.

I get what you are saying, but "better off" doesn't really make sense to me. My kids are young enough that they have no clue what's going on right now. She's been living in the basement for 3 months and they still don't know or have caught on. They think everything is hunky dorie. It's going to be a major BD on them when we have to tell them she's moving out. I am NOT looking forward to that conversation at all. They adore their mother and are constantly wondering when she will get home now that she's at the new job and gets home later. I'm not sure they are going to be "better off" when our relationship hasn't affected them negatively at all. Also, I don't believe any kid is better off only seeing one parent each 50% of the time. I'd understand if we were constantly fighting, arguing and abusive in front of them, but that isn't the case in my situation.

Her unwillingness to at least try now that I admit and own my own shortcomings. Something I haven't been able to realize in the past.

What are these said shortcomings you speak of?

Typical "guy/male" tendencies: Not wanting to open up and talk about my emotions and feels. (Boy have I done a 180 on that these past 3 months!) General communication barriers/issues that I intend to work on and fix and have been trying to already. A little hard to do that/implement when you have no one to communicate with though! I think that goes both ways for my W and I though. We've never really been great at communicating. I plan to work on my end, it's up to her to figure out her side. I have some NGS in me, as well. Covert contracts were a big part of my mentality I realize now. I would freeze her out if she didn't initiate anything in the form of physical touch. Then I would get all frustrated when it had gone on for awhile and confront her about it. Stuff like that. Mainly all communication problems which are entirely fixable! And I want to fix them!

Maybe God needs us to both go our separate ways for awhile to work on ourselves so that if R is an option we aren't back in this same situation again and we come back renewed, refreshed and recommitted to each other.

Very well could be. Now open the cage door Wanted!

The door has been opened and is swaying in the breeze now.

[Ready2Change]

I just can't wrap my head around someone not taking "logic" and "reason" into account for anything.

Men and women are wired differently.

One simple example:

Most men are turned on by the visual.
Most women are tuned on by words.

There is no way my women is going to be turned on by me walking around the house in just a T-shirt. Me on the other hand.....

She gets turned on when I tell her "You were the hottest girl in the restaurant"...If she says things like that to me, I don't get turned on.


The same is true for logic and emotions. Men make decisions based off of logic. Women rely heavily on feelings or emotions.

Use logic to change the way she feels about you.



You are the man. You need to use your logic and reason. You turn off all your "scary" emotions. Emotions are women behaviors. This is why women are attracted to strong men. Strong men control their emotions.


These are general characterizations, but I hope that helps clarify.

[Wanted1]

I just can't wrap my head around someone not taking "logic" and "reason" into account for anything.

Men and women are wired differently.

One simple example:

Most men are turned on by the visual.
Most women are tuned on by words.

There is no way my women is going to be turned on by me walking around the house in just a T-shirt. Me on the other hand.....

She gets turned on when I tell her "You were the hottest girl in the restaurant"...If she says things like that to me, I don't get turned on.


The same is true for logic and emotions. Men make decisions based off of logic. Women rely heavily on feelings or emotions.

Use logic to change the way she feels about you.



You are the man. You need to use your logic and reason. You turn off all your "scary" emotions. Emotions are women behaviors. This is why women are attracted to strong men. Strong men control their emotions.


These are general characterizations, but I hope that helps clarify.

Very well put, RC. That actually helps a ton! Probably quote thread worthy!!!

[Ready2Change]

Logic tells you to set them free and forgive them. Your emotions keep you tied. Face your biggest fear and things move forward faster.

[Wanted1]

Logic tells you to set them free and forgive them. Your emotions keep you tied. Face your biggest fear and things move forward faster.

RC,

I think I'm headed in that direction. Right now, I'm fine either way, really. Not sure if the roller coaster will shoot down again or not but I've been feeling fairly calm over the past couple days with this current mindset. If she decides to come back, I'll take it into consideration, but she will have to be willing to meet any and all demands that I have for it to happen. Something along the lines of, "I'm willing to do anything to get a second chance." If/When she decides to tell me that I should sign the papers to get the process started, I'm fine doing that too. I'm done trying to delay the seemingly inevitable.

There will be something better for me in the future. Whether that is MR 2.0 with Wanted W 2.0 or with young, hot, amazing girl I meet 1.0, we will see. Either way, I'm going to continue to walk in the direction I'm headed and try my damnedest to not look back. I hope I don't fall back into the sorrow and agony stages. That is what I pray for now.