Sandi's Reflections - Part 3

[Wanted1]

I think once I move on, if I'm in a new R with an incredible woman who treats me right, why the he$$ would I want to go back and give her a second chance when she can't find it within herself to give me one right now?

Wanted you are so desperately trying to get a second chance with a W who has cheated on you 3 times. Do you not see that it should be the other way around? What did you do to her that justified 3 affairs and two with your friends?
Something for IC.

I'm not desperate anymore. Do I want her to wake up and realize that she @#$%ed up royally and come to me begging for another chance so that our family can remain intact? Yes, I do, with the stipulation that she has a lot of work to do for that to happen.

But that isn't going to happen. Not any time soon, if ever. So, my choice is to move forward. I will tell you right now, if she came into the MBR tonight and said "let's just forget this and start over." My reaction would be: "Prove it. I'm done listening to what you say and taking you back too easy. Look where that got me the last 2 times....it's time for you to show me that you are worthy of me."

[ballast]

Wanted you are desperate and inherently for very much a right and noble reason...you want mostly for your children their family to be returned. Everyone gets that part. If you didn't have children, would you feel the same? I would suggest that when you DO NOT CARE if she wakes up/realizes THEN you are not desperate anymore.

And I hate to say this, but you don't really have a choice...moving forward for you and your children is the only thing you can do buddy. As LH says HOW were you so terrible to her that her actions are in any way justifiable? And I can guarantee you are sitting there reading this ready to give your life for your children to have their family. ZERO shame in that. I can't think of an LBS man/woman on here who does not exactly understand that. BUT at what cost to you AND whatever MR you can create out of the devastation WW has wrought? The pull within an LBS's soul between wanting to save their family for their children and saving themselves. I really believe that may be the hardest of all realities for a human being to accept. Patience and with time you will get more able to be at peace with...notice I did not say acceptance. I am at peace with the fact that my D will not have her family, but internally I do and will for my life rage at the seemingly terrible unfairness of it all. Give yourself the grace to understand that making the right choice for yourself does not mean you failed your family.

-B

[SoTorn]

Wanted. You are justifiably hurting and wanting your W back and family whole. It f***ing hurts man. It's not fair to us in any way shape or form.

It's not fair to our kids. It's not fair that W has destroyed our family and cant see the destruction for what it is. I would love for my wife to break down and beg for me back. Of course I would prefer to keep my family whole. But I recognize that's not something I can even have hope for because it just hurts me. I accept that my WW has ended our family. WW doesnt want to remain M to me. I accept that.

I accept that I need to let her go. Maybe she will come back, maybe she will one day try and get me back. But I can only focus on myself and our kids right now. WWs break us emotionally.

[Wanted1]

Guys, I’m not hurting nearly as much as I was a couple weeks ago. I’ve been pretty calm and even keel now for about 10 days or so. I’ve accepted that D is probably a 99% probability. I don’t have any expectations that anything will change. I’m tired of trying to do “something” and focusing on saving the M. I’m now doing nothing and just continue down my path. I pray for strength, courage and trust in Him. I’m no longer praying for a miracle or for my W to finally see the light.

[Phoenix9]

Guys, I’m not hurting nearly as much as I was a couple weeks ago. I’ve been pretty calm and even keel now for about 10 days or so. I’ve accepted that D is probably a 99% probability. I don’t have any expectations that anything will change. I’m tired of trying to do “something” and focusing on saving the M. I’m now doing nothing and just continue down my path. I pray for strength, courage and trust in Him. I’m no longer praying for a miracle or for my W to finally see the light.

Wanted, it's a roller coaster with a LOT of ups and downs. One moment you're feeling good and just accept the outcome, the next moment a memory comes up and reminds you of your sitch and derails you for a few days. Some people are better at riding it out until it is over. Others, like me, feel the highs and lows of this. Just this morning, as I was going to my car, I laughed that I was going through the 5 stages of grief quickly and repeatedly. Just last week, I was livid at WW's actions. I skipped the bargaining and hit depression (though that was exacerbated by our talk two days ago). Pretty soon, I'll be accepting. Then I end up going back to denial and starting the whole cycle again.

Just be mindful and have outlets to have emotional moments when needed. It's ok to backtrack your feelings. Sometimes, it's necessary.

[Wanted1]

Guys, I’m not hurting nearly as much as I was a couple weeks ago. I’ve been pretty calm and even keel now for about 10 days or so. I’ve accepted that D is probably a 99% probability. I don’t have any expectations that anything will change. I’m tired of trying to do “something” and focusing on saving the M. I’m now doing nothing and just continue down my path. I pray for strength, courage and trust in Him. I’m no longer praying for a miracle or for my W to finally see the light.

Wanted, it's a roller coaster with a LOT of ups and downs. One moment you're feeling good and just accept the outcome, the next moment a memory comes up and reminds you of your sitch and derails you for a few days. Some people are better at riding it out until it is over. Others, like me, feel the highs and lows of this. Just this morning, as I was going to my car, I laughed that I was going through the 5 stages of grief quickly and repeatedly. Just last week, I was livid at WW's actions. I skipped the bargaining and hit depression (though that was exacerbated by our talk two days ago). Pretty soon, I'll be accepting. Then I end up going back to denial and starting the whole cycle again.

Just be mindful and have outlets to have emotional moments when needed. It's ok to backtrack your feelings. Sometimes, it's necessary.

Oh I know the roller coaster well. I have a season pass on it and was riding it daily. However, I was feeling the highs and lows a lot more often than I’ve been experiencing lately. Like I said, these last 10 days or so I haven’t been careening downhill like I would in the past.

[Nutcrac]

Women are attracted to men with ambition. They are attracted to successful men. In our world, success usually equals financial security. Financial security is very attractive to women, b/c one of our basic needs is security. If we have a H, we are going to look to him to bring it. It's our nature. Even if we work, we still expect him to work, too.

Sandi2, came across your quotes on this forum and one thing that specifically caught my attention is above. Have a few questions that I need answers to -

1) Is this above quote true for every woman?
2) This is a very commonplace issue when the WAW earns more than the LBS. If this was the problem (Reason for WAW to leave) during the marriage, how can it be overcome later on? Even if you learn your mistakes and start working on it, being successful may take years or decades. what is your suggestion on how the LBS can overcome this?

[lost8]

"Coming around" how? Is she still in contact with OM? She has showed a lot more emotion and has been pursuing, I just found out last night yes she does communicate with him, said he's still a friend.....I drew the last line that if contact doesn't cease we're done

When was the last time she had a serious conversation with you, without a few drinks in her? Can't say I remember

Are you still going home after work and drinking with her? Yes

You say she tends to open up when she's drinking. What does she talk about? Is this when she gets so emotional and tells you she is sorry for hurting you? Does she remember the next day what was said when she was drinking? Her convos are usually all about her, but she does get emotional about us splitting up...and doesn't always remember the next day

Didn't she ask you to attend an IC session with her? Have you? I saw her IC briefly alone before she went in and addressed her drinking and where I stood that I am ready to walk away. I wanted to get ICs opinion on sitch because W is starting intense therapy for PTSD. I expressed that I would not start MC while OM was present and she agreed.

[sandi2]

Originally Posted by sandi2

Women are attracted to men with ambition. They are attracted to successful men. In our world, success usually equals financial security. Financial security is very attractive to women, b/c one of our basic needs is security. If we have a H, we are going to look to him to bring it. It's our nature. Even if we work, we still expect him to work, too.

Sandi2, came across your quotes on this forum and one thing that specifically caught my attention is above. Have a few questions that I need answers to -

1) Is this above quote true for every woman?

Well times have changed a lot of things and there might be one female out there that says she is attracted to a lazy man who doesn't have enough drive to get out of bed and go work to provide for his family...…...but I kind of doubt it.

In the animal kingdom, the females and males looks for certain qualities in a potential mates. I think it's true with humans, too. It may go back to the female being the weaker vessel and historically she depended on the male to do the harder more physical demanding work. She had to have someone to provide and protect her family while she was birthing and nursing the babies. Therefore, in order to chose the best mate who could fit the bill.....she is naturally attracted to certain traits in the male.

As I previously stated, women are attracted to successful men, b/c we usually equate success with financial security. I'm just saying that it is a natural attraction to how she sees him. Having security means a lot to women. However, that's not to say she can't fall in love with some guy in high school, get married, and raise a family while they both hold down full time jobs until the day they retire. The point I'm making is that the H is not lazy. We don't normally associate laziness with success or even a paycheck. She's not going to be attracted to the guy who is laying around the house, finding some excuse for not being able to find the right job for him, or some other b.s. while she is working to support the family. That's when you'll see the W's respect start fading real quick. Sure, it's wonderful to have a H who is pulling in the big bucks, but the main thing she needs to see is his feet hitting the floor every morning, going to a paying job. He may be blue collar or white collar...…..but he's doing all that he can. If he can get a higher paying job, that's great......but the point is to work at something. Healthy men should not sit home while the W supports the family.

I think it takes a level of maturity to be able to handle a situation where the W's salary is considerably higher than her H's. Maturity on both sides. Sometimes the man has an ego problem, and sometimes the woman has a lack of respect. Actually, I don't know that the main issue boils down to the dollar amount, as much as it is about the job title/position. How do their peers see them, knowing she's making a lot more than her H? For instance, say he has been working at the same factory, doing the same boring job for twenty years and it's pretty clear there's nowhere to advance...…...and if his W has some glamorous career where she is flying all over the world and attending high society parties...…...do you see what I mean? If either the H or W feels that she has outgrown him.........it could easily become a point of conflict. Here's the cold, blunt truth. Women need to feel admiration for their H. The W needs to "look up" at her H. If she begins to see herself elevated above him (as in earning more money, social status, importance, etc)...….there's going to be trouble.

2) This is a very commonplace issue when the WAW earns more than the LBS. If this was the problem (Reason for WAW to leave) during the marriage, how can it be overcome later on? Even if you learn your mistakes and start working on it, being successful may take years or decades. what is your suggestion on how the LBS can overcome this?

How can it be overcome later..........you mean with the same W? Like I said, I think there is usually more to the story than just differences in their salary. If the W left the M b/c her H did not measure up to her expectations of more money from his side of the street, I would check to see why he was not drawing a higher salary. Is it his lack of ambition, or is he just stuck in a low salary job with no hope of advancing? Maybe it's not him. Maybe he has a demanding and unrealistic W. Does he want to find a higher paying job and put in the necessary work in order to keep his W? I suppose that would be up to him.

Even if you learn your mistakes and start working on it, being successful may take years or decades. what is your suggestion on how the LBS can overcome this?

Well, what was the mistake? Did you have a tendency to be lazy, a slacker, failed to follow through with training/education? Did you lack zeal, no passion, no drive to advance? Were you perfectly contented to remain in your current position, although it didn't pay enough to suit your W? What would you need to do to earn a higher salary? Would it mean changing jobs or changing careers? Big difference, IMO. What would be the drawback, and would there be any advantages or benefits, other than more money? These are the type things I would suggest checking out. There is a difference in a guy who won't buckle down and bring home a sufficient paycheck b/c he doesn't want to put in the hours or whatever..….and the one who is doing the best job he can with the qualifications he holds. If he wants to do whatever is necessary to get the qualifications, that's up to him.

[neffer]

Sandi, we need you at Steve’s sitch. Please.